A Head Coach Botches the Super Bowl, and it wasn't Pete Carrol

[Hootie]

http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/...-pete-carroll/

[Amnorix]

Originally Posted by Hootie 2.0

It's not ideal, but after the timeout before 3rd down (assuming they stopped Lynch), you call two plays.

Me? I call a play-action boot on 3rd down. But let's say they do call a run.

Fine.

3rd down. Run. Stuffed again? They already have a 4th down play call...they know...they hurry to the line. That's advantage Seattle, albeit with a lot of pressure...and I call a 4th down read option and put the game in my QB's hand. He makes the right read, they win. It's over. Done.

But yeah. They could have ran 3 times if they wanted to. Time really wasn't a factor, at all...unless Wilson took a 3rd down sack.

If in your rush you don't set properly and get called for a 5 yard penalty, or if the players don't unstack as quickly as you'd like or whatever, and time runs out, then the criticisms they are getting for this play call would like nothing compared to the criticism you'd get for THAT fiasco.

I'd probably run Lynch on 2nd, call time and call two plays. The first is a designed rollout/option involving Wilson. If he isn't 100% sure of getting into the end zone, throw it into the third row. Fourth down is probably back to Lynch.

But here is the problem -- you are calling the fourth down play without knowing FOR CERTAIN that you are at the 1 yard line. If you get knocked back to the 3, or your'e at the 2 inch mark, then things might change and you don't have time to adjust.

I honestly have less of a problem with passing on 2nd down than I do the specific pass. I'd feel alot better about a safer play, rather than a throw right into the middle of the mess. Rollout with Wilson seems much smarter to me there.

[Amnorix]

Originally Posted by -King-

A play only taking 4 seconds is wishful thinking. If the Patriots stop Lynch, how fast do you think they're going to unpile and get ready for the line? By the time they all unpile and the ball is spotted, at least 10 seconds will have ran off the clock. You would get 2 run plays at AT BEST.

You don't need to unpile before calling time. You can call it as soon as the play is whistled dead, which is what they are saying.

[siberian khatru]

Originally Posted by Amnorix

But here is the problem -- you are calling the fourth down play without knowing FOR CERTAIN that you are at the 1 yard line. If you get knocked back to the 3, or your'e at the 2 inch mark, then things might change and you don't have time to adjust.

I honestly have less of a problem with passing on 2nd down than I do the specific pass. I'd feel alot better about a safer play, rather than a throw right into the middle of the mess. Rollout with Wilson seems much smarter to me there.

1. Legit point. But still.

2. Agree

[Amnorix]

Originally Posted by siberian khatru

Yes I am. Seen it done before. I bet you have too. I mean, don't they practice those kinds of plays?

After the final timeout on second down, you call two plays in case you don't score on third down, make sure everyone knows the drill (and notify the refs they better be quick to remove any Patriots lingering on top of a Seahawk).

Depends on what kind of play you call. I'm also not sure I'm keen on calling the 4th down play after 2nd down. The ball could move up or back and it might affect things. If after 3rd down you're 2 inches from the goalline, you might prefer to go over the top versus offtackle to Lynch, but you won't have any choice.

And you better not have anyone injured on that third down play. 10 second runoff.

EVERYTHING involves at least some risks. I really don't think I'd run three times. I'm with Carroll that you need to throw on either 2nd or 3rd down. Unless you think your QB is a stiff, why would your risk everythign on three handoffs?

[TimBone]

Wait, I thought this thread was about Belichick's lack of a timeout call?

[Hootie]

which is funny to me

because the Pats saw Edelman totally abuse the DB on that goal to go pass and Brady just missed it

next drive?

Same exact call...boom. Game winning TD.

If the Hawks really wanted to pass there...why not just run the same damn play that found Baldwin wide open by 15 yards?

Everyone, including the Patriots, knew the Hawks were gonna run on 2nd down.

It took an all-time great play and an all-time stupid play call for the Pats to win that game. Just mystifying.

[Hootie]

Originally Posted by -King-

Yes he did. He should have made a better throw. Wilson should have made a better throw also. There's no reason to lead a receiver in that situation at all. You don't need YAC.

And no one is calling Wilson a choker. I'm not. But just because he got a shitty play call doesn't mean he's without fault.

I don't fault him for the pass at all...Bill Barnwell, on Grantland, even says the receiver should have made a better play.

What can you do? It's a timing route called on the 1 god damn yard line where he threw the ball in the middle of the field.

All-time horrendous playcall. That's really the only narrative for that.

But keep on talking about how Russell led his receiver too much. Dumb.

[-King-]

Originally Posted by Hootie 2.0

I don't fault him for the pass at all...Bill Barnwell, on Grantland, even says the receiver should have made a better play.

What can you do? It's a timing route called on the 1 god damn yard line where he threw the ball in the middle of the field.

All-time horrendous playcall. That's really the only narrative for that.

But keep on talking about how Russell led his receiver too much. Dumb.

How exactly could the receiver have made a better play? Phased through Butler and made the catch instead?

There's a difference in how Wilson threw that slant and how Brady threw his slant to LaFell. Brady didn't lead LaFell at all thus taking the risk of a DB cutting it out. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MjFxzjyZyoU LaFell didn't need to extend his hands for it and there was no way any DB could have cut it.

[Eleazar]

Pootie is still searching for any way to detract from Brady winning another Lombardi

[Hootie]

No. I'm not.

That was a total legacy game for Brady. A game I always bashed him for not having. Now, he has it. That's clear.

What I'm saying is...they drew up a timing route at the 1 yard line and people are expecting a perfect ****ing pass. Russel executed that play just fine. Just fine. DB made a better play. Plain and simple. Everyone other than a few dumb****s on CP agrees.

Shit, Tom Brady, apparent greatest QB ever, had a wide open Edelman on the same play he hit him on the next time and missed him by 3 yards.

You can't make a perfect pass every time on a timing route...Russel made a pass that would have been complete had the DB not made a better play.

The real question is...why are they running shotgun timing routes on 2nd down from the 1?

[Saul Good]

Originally Posted by -King-

But then again, if Wilson doesn't try to lead the WR for what ever reason, it's either an incomplete pass or a TD.

Or it gets poked out, glances off his shoulder pad, etc. and pops up in the air where 11 Patriots are waiting on it to come down.

[penguinz]

Originally Posted by Hootie 2.0

No. I'm not.

That was a total legacy game for Brady. A game I always bashed him for not having. Now, he has it. That's clear.

What I'm saying is...they drew up a timing route at the 1 yard line and people are expecting a perfect ****ing pass. Russel executed that play just fine. Just fine. DB made a better play. Plain and simple. Everyone other than a few dumb****s on CP agrees.

Shit, Tom Brady, apparent greatest QB ever, had a wide open Edelman on the same play he hit him on the next time and missed him by 3 yards.

You can't make a perfect pass every time on a timing route...Russel made a pass that would have been complete had the DB not made a better play.

The real question is...why are they running shotgun timing routes on 2nd down from the 1?

Because Lynch is unreliable when it is on the 1 yd line!

[-King-]

Originally Posted by Saul Good

Or it gets poked out, glances off his shoulder pad, etc. and pops up in the air where 11 Patriots are waiting on it to come down.

Chances of that happening vs the chance of an INT happening when you lead the WR and DBs are playing a couple yards off the line?

I'm not arguing that a pass was a good decision, but don't double down on the bad decision by leading the WR at the goal line.

[The Franchise]

Originally Posted by -King-

How exactly could the receiver have made a better play? Phased through Butler and made the catch instead?

There's a difference in how Wilson threw that slant and how Brady threw his slant to LaFell. Brady didn't lead LaFell at all thus taking the risk of a DB cutting it out. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MjFxzjyZyoU LaFell didn't need to extend his hands for it and there was no way any DB could have cut it.

Brady Quinn wrote an article and talked about how the receiver was trying to catch it with his body instead of his hands. He said there would have been less of a chance of an INT if he had tried to catch it away from his body.

[morphius]

I can see the throw on 2nd down as if it fails it stops the clock, then you can huddle up for your next play, run the ball and use your last timeout, get the lineup you want and go for it again on 4th.