Chiefs A Levelheaded Review Wk17 - Page 9

DenverChief · 01-01-2023, 03:08 PM

1. The missed XP & FG - didn't get to see another view of the XP snap - looks like Tommy just flat out dropped the ball. Love the initial effort to just take it in for 2 but when he realized he wasn't gonna get there it got ugly. Maybe Tommy is the problem. Need to figure out the XP/FG thing real quick. That will kill us in the playoffs. The missed FG at half, dunno what to say other that Butker flat out shanked that kick. I watched closely as the ball was snapped. It was a clean catch and perfect placement (laces out) Butker for whatever reason hit it like a parent chasing a child around the house.

2. EZ Interception. The Broncos seem to have figured out how to get Pat to throw picks. 4 total in the last two meetings combined. Disappointed in this one but Pat takes risks and sometimes they don't work out. I did think it was interesting that Pat didn't throw to Pat's side all game. Much respect for the Surtain.

3. Toney PR fumble was just good special teams work. Can't really fault Toney for fumbling - it was a good strip. Chiefs have to know other teams are looking to strip the ball now. Knowing that our guys aren't holding the ball with two hands in traffic.

4. Defense played really well multiple batted balls, couple of Wilson sacks and bottled their O pretty effectively. 2nd Q big 3rd down play with about a minute left. They just found the soft spot in the D, this is a direct result of LB's in coverage. Need to find that Sorenson hybrid LB/DB. Someone with size to play the run and speed to play the pass. Defense really came up big today when it counted and they have improved dramatically over the last couple of games. The addition of Brandon Williams seems to correlate with the improved pass rush and run D.

5. Watson, just when you thought he was done for he comes up with a huge play in the final seconds of the first half. Great catch - absolutely amazed at what Mahomes can make happen with very little time on the clock.

6. The Broncos are a proud organization they know the score and they are going to give us 110% every game year after year. We have to be prepared for that. Especially with the dismissal of their HC. Denver last swept us multiple years in the division from 2012 thru 2014. We have been sweeping them every year since 2016, 14 games in a row, quite the feat. Especially considering a lot our rivalry has been to split the series. They are no slouches and were projected to give the Chiefs a run for their money this year. Their Defense is really good - their offense is okay.

7. Patrick is back to playing the long ball game when it's not there. Gotta take the open stuff underneath. He missed Pacheco wide open in the flat a couple of times. Need to see the all 22 but Juju and Kelce both disappeared through the 1st three quarters. Need to game plan to get them in the game earlier.

8. Sneed wanted that pick 6 pretty bad and got absolutely leveled by Jerry Jeudy. Gotta have your head on a swivel if you are gonna dance around after an interception. Glad to see he is okay after taking that hit.

9. Referees - Pass interference the PI on Sutton was super ticky tacky as was the Williams PI. The 4th and 7th play was incredibly confusing. Illegal hands to the face (which no replay - show me the penalty - I hate them ignoring that) before the interception - 5 yard penalty makes it 4th & 2. The sticks were set up for 1st and 10 but the down marker was 4th down. Didn't matter as Jeudy got a 9 yard pass but talk about discombobulated. WTF was going on with the zebras today.

10. Injuries Thuney and Skyy. Obviously the Thuney injury hurts, hopefully it is just minor and can make a complete recovery before the playoffs.

Chris Meck · 01-03-2023, 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

But #23 per attempt and #19 in completed air yards per attempt. We are also #2 in YAC.

Great! We still can't buy a game breaker WR. We'll have to develop one.

Chris Meck · 01-03-2023, 09:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

But #23 per attempt and #19 in completed air yards per attempt. We are also #2 in YAC.

These are things that tell a story, but not the one you think.

Hammock Parties · 01-03-2023, 09:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

But #23 per attempt and #19 in completed air yards per attempt. We are also #2 in YAC.

now do joe burrow

"per attempt" is just a function of throwing the ball a lot more in most cases, which is why justin fields is high

Chris Meck · 01-03-2023, 09:48 AM

I really think there's a lot of irrational 'want' going on here.

We remember 'WASP', and we see Burrow throwing to Chase/Higgins/Boyd and we think-

MAN, I WANT THAT!

But reality is, 'WASP' is a pipedream with Brown and Wylie at OT, and The Bengals have all of those guys on rookie contracts still.

We're just in a different place now. You like Mahomes? Me too. But we're paying him now, and we have dogshit at RT, a mediocre LT that wants record setting money, and one good rookie DE and nothing else there. Things aren't changing other than continued growth this season.

and in '23, we have zero starting OT's, one starting level DE, no starting WR's under contract-33 guys under contract total, and somewhere around $45-50m to deal with it all.

We're not going to blow it all on a free agent WR-and there aren't any great ones in their prime available anyway.

We're going to have to grow our own, unless it's Toney-which if he can get his hammy issues under control I'd feel real good about, honestly.

O.city · 01-03-2023, 09:52 AM

Everyone wants the 18 offense back. It's just not gonna happen. I'd love to have a legit WR. Everyone would.

But it's just gonna have to come in the draft.

And as much as this offense has been good, Mahomes has done just as much at slowing it down as others. He hasn't played as well this year despite the #'s.

Hammock Parties · 01-03-2023, 09:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city

He hasn't played as well this year despite the #'s.

shittiest MVP ever

DenverChief · 01-03-2023, 09:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Meck

I really think there's a lot of irrational 'want' going on here.

We remember 'WASP', and we see Burrow throwing to Chase/Higgins/Boyd and we think-

MAN, I WANT THAT!

But reality is, 'WASP' is a pipedream with Brown and Wylie at OT, and The Bengals have all of those guys on rookie contracts still.

We're just in a different place now. You like Mahomes? Me too. But we're paying him now, and we have dogshit at RT, a mediocre LT that wants record setting money, and one good rookie DE and nothing else there. Things aren't changing other than continued growth this season.

and in '23, we have zero starting OT's, one starting level DE, no starting WR's under contract-33 guys under contract total, and somewhere around $45-50m to deal with it all.

We're not going to blow it all on a free agent WR-and there aren't any great ones in their prime available anyway.

We're going to have to grow our own, unless it's Toney-which if he can get his hammy issues under control I'd feel real good about, honestly.

Niang is still under contract for 23? I would like to see him back in there - I think he is much better than Wylie.

TEX · 01-03-2023, 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Meck

These are things that tell a story, but not the one you think.

They do tell the story. You're usually spot on, but respecrfully IMO, you're off here if you cant see the story they teĺl.

TEX · 01-03-2023, 10:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

But #23 per attempt and #19 in completed air yards per attempt. We are also #2 in YAC.

Exactly. Ptetty clear.

TEX · 01-03-2023, 10:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Meck

So you're really arguing 'air yards'?

I personally don't think a shorter pass that a receiver breaks a long run counts any less than a pass that travels 40 yards in the air.

We don't have ****ing time to run WASP.

Yes I am. And we need to fix the OT's so we will have time. They're so bad, when we play teMs with good pass rushers, we don't even have time for the short stuff.

chiefzilla1501 · 01-03-2023, 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Meck

I really think there's a lot of irrational 'want' going on here.

We remember 'WASP', and we see Burrow throwing to Chase/Higgins/Boyd and we think-

MAN, I WANT THAT!

But reality is, 'WASP' is a pipedream with Brown and Wylie at OT, and The Bengals have all of those guys on rookie contracts still.

We're just in a different place now. You like Mahomes? Me too. But we're paying him now, and we have dogshit at RT, a mediocre LT that wants record setting money, and one good rookie DE and nothing else there. Things aren't changing other than continued growth this season.

and in '23, we have zero starting OT's, one starting level DE, no starting WR's under contract-33 guys under contract total, and somewhere around $45-50m to deal with it all.

We're not going to blow it all on a free agent WR-and there aren't any great ones in their prime available anyway.

We're going to have to grow our own, unless it's Toney-which if he can get his hammy issues under control I'd feel real good about, honestly.

I don’t think anybody is saying that we will be anything like the fast break offense we used to be. Anyone wanting new WRs knows we are heading in the right direction. But we have some clear limitations. We’re paying $10m to Mvs who is a liability. And we may pay juju $15-20m to not be a WR1 - much as I like the guy. Again I don’t think you need to give $30m to a top 5 wr. Frankly if we’re nervous about spending then cut Mvs and think twice about re-upping juju. Get yourself a Wr1 with size AND speed, and solve our problem of having a guy who can actually match up with CB1s. That’s basically cost neutral. Then use draft picks to fill in the rest.

The WR market will be way better than you think. If not this year then next year. We’re going go see an insane amount of huge contracts come due in the next year or two and it’s unsustainable for these teams to be able to keep all their WRs.

chiefzilla1501 · 01-03-2023, 10:21 AM

And you cannot walk into next season with Mvs and Watson playing the majority of snaps. It’s clear that we’re productive in spite of these guys, not because of them, right?

IowaHawkeyeChief · 01-03-2023, 10:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

I’m tired of this narrative that we are so explosive on offense that we should be remotely content. Andy Reid is a magician making it really work with what we have. But we have clear limits. And they are limits on talent, not on sloppiness. Anyone not looking at stats on paper can see that our offense hasn’t been nearly as explosive as you continue to suggest. Two bad second halves against denver. Terrible game vs Seattle. Struggled against the rams. And despite what the numbers say, we had a really hard time moving the ball vs the chargers and titans. I get why we want to be more efficient but we have some glaring issues with the passing game.

And the narrative that we weren’t explosive last year is also overused and exaggerated. We were dominant the second half of last year including back to back 40+ point playoff wins. We had one bad second half against cincy.

You’re not gonna clean up Mvs. He just isn’t it. For crying out loud we run Watson on 75% of snaps simply for running the right routes. Thats a talent issue. Defenses can essentially wipe out two of our WRs without paying a lick of attention to them. Juju is solid but we all know he’s a possession guy. Again I applaud our move to efficiency and I know this is a rebuild year. I’m just shocked at how many are content with what our offense has become. I don’t care what the numbers say, as good as we’ve been, we are capable of way better and we can be with more talent.

Mahomes missed MVS twice yesterday, one was most likely a long TD. Mahomes even called himself out in his words at his press conference.

IowaHawkeyeChief · 01-03-2023, 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

I don’t think anybody is saying that we will be anything like the fast break offense we used to be. Anyone wanting new WRs knows we are heading in the right direction. But we have some clear limitations. We’re paying $10m to Mvs who is a liability. And we may pay juju $15-20m to not be a WR1 - much as I like the guy. Again I don’t think you need to give $30m to a top 5 wr. Frankly if we’re nervous about spending then cut Mvs and think twice about re-upping juju. Get yourself a Wr1 with size AND speed, and solve our problem of having a guy who can actually match up with CB1s. That’s basically cost neutral. Then use draft picks to fill in the rest.

The WR market will be way better than you think. If not this year then next year. We’re going go see an insane amount of huge contracts come due in the next year or two and it’s unsustainable for these teams to be able to keep all their WRs.

Right... I wish we had an offense where the QB was the only one in the league to hit 5000 yards this year...

chiefzilla1501 · 01-03-2023, 10:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IowaHawkeyeChief

Mahomes missed MVS twice yesterday, one was most likely a long TD. Mahomes even called himself out in his words at his press conference.

He also had a few passes where he sat and waited for the ball where an above receiver makes an attempt to play the ball.

Mvs….
Disappears most games
When he does produce he disappears outside of 1-2 catches
Kills too many drives with drops or not getting his feet down
Kills even more drives by not adjusting to the ball
Really seems to be out of sync with mahomes

Having a home run threat is fine but we’re paying the guy $10m. And you can’t have an efficient offense with a guy who makes this many mistakes.

01-01-2023, 03:08 PM
DenverChief MVP Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Rocky Ford Casino cash: $5549867	A Levelheaded Review Wk17 1. The missed XP & FG - didn't get to see another view of the XP snap - looks like Tommy just flat out dropped the ball. Love the initial effort to just take it in for 2 but when he realized he wasn't gonna get there it got ugly. Maybe Tommy is the problem. Need to figure out the XP/FG thing real quick. That will kill us in the playoffs. The missed FG at half, dunno what to say other that Butker flat out shanked that kick. I watched closely as the ball was snapped. It was a clean catch and perfect placement (laces out) Butker for whatever reason hit it like a parent chasing a child around the house. 2. EZ Interception. The Broncos seem to have figured out how to get Pat to throw picks. 4 total in the last two meetings combined. Disappointed in this one but Pat takes risks and sometimes they don't work out. I did think it was interesting that Pat didn't throw to Pat's side all game. Much respect for the Surtain. 3. Toney PR fumble was just good special teams work. Can't really fault Toney for fumbling - it was a good strip. Chiefs have to know other teams are looking to strip the ball now. Knowing that our guys aren't holding the ball with two hands in traffic. 4. Defense played really well multiple batted balls, couple of Wilson sacks and bottled their O pretty effectively. 2nd Q big 3rd down play with about a minute left. They just found the soft spot in the D, this is a direct result of LB's in coverage. Need to find that Sorenson hybrid LB/DB. Someone with size to play the run and speed to play the pass. Defense really came up big today when it counted and they have improved dramatically over the last couple of games. The addition of Brandon Williams seems to correlate with the improved pass rush and run D. 5. Watson, just when you thought he was done for he comes up with a huge play in the final seconds of the first half. Great catch - absolutely amazed at what Mahomes can make happen with very little time on the clock. 6. The Broncos are a proud organization they know the score and they are going to give us 110% every game year after year. We have to be prepared for that. Especially with the dismissal of their HC. Denver last swept us multiple years in the division from 2012 thru 2014. We have been sweeping them every year since 2016, 14 games in a row, quite the feat. Especially considering a lot our rivalry has been to split the series. They are no slouches and were projected to give the Chiefs a run for their money this year. Their Defense is really good - their offense is okay. 7. Patrick is back to playing the long ball game when it's not there. Gotta take the open stuff underneath. He missed Pacheco wide open in the flat a couple of times. Need to see the all 22 but Juju and Kelce both disappeared through the 1st three quarters. Need to game plan to get them in the game earlier. 8. Sneed wanted that pick 6 pretty bad and got absolutely leveled by Jerry Jeudy. Gotta have your head on a swivel if you are gonna dance around after an interception. Glad to see he is okay after taking that hit. 9. Referees - Pass interference the PI on Sutton was super ticky tacky as was the Williams PI. The 4th and 7th play was incredibly confusing. Illegal hands to the face (which no replay - show me the penalty - I hate them ignoring that) before the interception - 5 yard penalty makes it 4th & 2. The sticks were set up for 1st and 10 but the down marker was 4th down. Didn't matter as Jeudy got a 9 yard pass but talk about discombobulated. WTF was going on with the zebras today. 10. Injuries Thuney and Skyy. Obviously the Thuney injury hurts, hopefully it is just minor and can make a complete recovery before the playoffs.
Posts: 16,229

01-03-2023, 09:48 AM	#124
Chris Meck MVP Join Date: May 2001 Location: midtown KC Casino cash: $1604910	I really think there's a lot of irrational 'want' going on here. We remember 'WASP', and we see Burrow throwing to Chase/Higgins/Boyd and we think- MAN, I WANT THAT! But reality is, 'WASP' is a pipedream with Brown and Wylie at OT, and The Bengals have all of those guys on rookie contracts still. We're just in a different place now. You like Mahomes? Me too. But we're paying him now, and we have dogshit at RT, a mediocre LT that wants record setting money, and one good rookie DE and nothing else there. Things aren't changing other than continued growth this season. and in '23, we have zero starting OT's, one starting level DE, no starting WR's under contract-33 guys under contract total, and somewhere around $45-50m to deal with it all. We're not going to blow it all on a free agent WR-and there aren't any great ones in their prime available anyway. We're going to have to grow our own, unless it's Toney-which if he can get his hammy issues under control I'd feel real good about, honestly.
Posts: 17,574

01-03-2023, 09:52 AM	#125
O.city In Search of a Life Join Date: Jul 2009 Casino cash: $2404064	Everyone wants the 18 offense back. It's just not gonna happen. I'd love to have a legit WR. Everyone would. But it's just gonna have to come in the draft. And as much as this offense has been good, Mahomes has done just as much at slowing it down as others. He hasn't played as well this year despite the #'s.
Posts: 81,534	1 0

01-03-2023, 10:21 AM	#132
chiefzilla1501 In Search of a Life Join Date: Aug 2008 Casino cash: $1694497	And you cannot walk into next season with Mvs and Watson playing the majority of snaps. It’s clear that we’re productive in spite of these guys, not because of them, right?
Posts: 48,551	1 0