The Myth that Nelson Sucks

[kccrow]

I don't know that he sucks. He certainly has some wtf moments, but overall he's solid. The issue will be re-signing him. I think his floor is around $7 million per. You look at a guy like Bobby McCain from Miami, essentially the same type of guy with spot starting duty and then gets an extension at $6.75 per.

Do you really spend that on Nelson or do you spend a bit more and maybe get a guy like Ronald Darby and draft a slot guy?

[htismaqe]

I don't think he sucks but after Ragland, he was the worst defender against Cleveland.

[O.city]

Originally Posted by htismaqe

I don't think he sucks but after Ragland, he was the worst defender against Cleveland.

Nelson?

[Fansy the Famous Bard]

Originally Posted by htismaqe

I don't think he sucks but after Ragland, he was the worst defender against Cleveland.

Are we still talking about Nelson? He looked pretty good yesterday outside of one play....

[htismaqe]

Originally Posted by Fansy the Famous Bard

Are we still talking about Nelson? He looked pretty good yesterday outside of one play....

Name a player other than Ragland that played worse. You won't be able to do it.

[staylor26]

Originally Posted by htismaqe

I don't think he sucks but after Ragland, he was the worst defender against Cleveland.

Lol what game were you watching?

[htismaqe]

Originally Posted by staylor26

Lol what game were you watching?

Just got done watching the game twice actually and he was out of position a TON. He just wasn't victimized on it but a couple of times.

He's the most bipolar player on the defense. He's great for a couple of plays and then flat awful for 1 or 2 more.

[Buckweath]

Originally Posted by htismaqe

Just got done watching the All 22 actually and he was out of position a TON. He just wasn't victimized on it but a couple of times.

He's the most bipolar player on the defense. He's great for a couple of plays and then flat awful for 1 or 2 more.

I get that everyone is entitled to their opinion but why do I always have to see those clueless opinions like yours, this time, on this forum.

I watched the full game. Nelson was excellent yesterday.

PFF ranked him top 2 defensive player for the Chiefs yesterday with Kendall Fuller, with a passer rating less than 48 when targeted.

Indeed, he was very good and showed on the screen, in a good way, many times.

[htismaqe]

Originally Posted by Buckweath

I get that everyone is entitled to their opinion but why do I always have to see those clueless opinions like yours, this time, on this forum.

I watched the full game. Nelson was excellent yesterday.

PFF ranked him top 2 defensive player for the Chiefs yesterday with Kendall Fuller, with a passer rating less than 48 when targeted.

Indeed, he was very good and showed on the screen, in a good way, many times.

I'm clueless.

Like I said, he's bipolar. I never said he sucked. But for all of the great plays he makes, he gives up 1 or 2 CRIPPLING plays every game or commits a terrible penalty.

Believe whatever you want. I really don't care. I watched the game twice this morning, I know EXACTLY what I was watching.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by Buckweath

I watched the full game. Nelson was excellent yesterday.

PFF ranked him top 2 defensive player for the Chiefs yesterday with Kendall Fuller, with a passer rating less than 48 when targeted.

Indeed, he was very good and showed on the screen, in a good way, many times.

Fuller had an understated good game yesterday. He never really jumped off the screen but he was on Landry a lot and that dude's a tough cover. They kept Landry well below what I'd have expected given the relatively poor pass rush and our problems over the middle.

That game script suggested a big day from Landry and Fuller was a large part of why that didn't come together for him.

[BWillie]

Originally Posted by Buckweath

I get that everyone is entitled to their opinion but why do I always have to see those clueless opinions like yours, this time, on this forum.

I watched the full game. Nelson was excellent yesterday.

PFF ranked him top 2 defensive player for the Chiefs yesterday with Kendall Fuller, with a passer rating less than 48 when targeted.

Indeed, he was very good and showed on the screen, in a good way, many times.

I think it's because he watched the film and he's talking about defensive positioning. You can blow coverage, you can be in the wrong spot, and if the offense doesn't penalize you, nobody will know you ****ed up except for your and the coaching staff. You can't always be results oriented.

I don't know personally - I just watch the games to have fun. I don't go back and watch "film".

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by htismaqe

I don't think he sucks but after Ragland, he was the worst defender against Cleveland.

Well that's not accurate.

Bailey, Ford and especially Speaks were all absolutely ass. Nor did Williams/Nnadi do anything worth mentioning. Hitchens did Hitchens stuff; was in between all day.

Scandrick was just quiet; they didn't seem to go his way often though I'm pretty sure I remember Callaway converting a couple of 1st downs in front of him. Fuller spent a lot of time working on Landry and Landry was very quiet yesterday.

Nelson got beat once, otherwise he was awfully good. He made some very strong tackles and had a couple of good pass breakups. That was no worse than a B- game from Nelson and really it was probably better than that.

Nelson played well. The ILBs sucked and the DL/OLB's sucked just as badly. I'd say Nelson was probably the 3rd(ish) BEST player on the defense yesterday. And you can make a legitimate argument that he was the best.

[htismaqe]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

Well that's not accurate.

Bailey, Ford and especially Speaks were all absolutely ass. Nor did Williams/Nnadi do anything worth mentioning. Hitchens did Hitchens stuff; was in between all day.

Scandrick was just quiet; they didn't seem to go his way often though I'm pretty sure I remember Callaway converting a couple of 1st downs in front of him. Fuller spent a lot of time working on Landry and Landry was very quiet yesterday.

Nelson got beat once, otherwise he was awfully good. He made some very strong tackles and had a couple of good pass breakups. That was no worse than a B- game from Nelson and really it was probably better than that.

Nelson played well. The ILBs sucked and the DL/OLB's sucked just as badly. I'd say Nelson was probably the 3rd(ish) BEST player on the defense yesterday. And you can make a legitimate argument that he was the best.

On the first 2 series, Speaks stopped the Browns running game almost single-handedly.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by htismaqe

On the first 2 series, Speaks stopped the Browns running game almost single-handedly.

Speaks made a nice play on that inside trap looking play where he flowed down the line, no doubt (though if my memory serves, Chubb still gained a handful of yards there because poor push in the middle). He also did a good job of staying in front of Johnson later in the game on that 4th down and waiting for help to finish the play.

But Mayfield dropped back 42 times yesterday with the worst pair of tackles in the league protecting him and Speaks was getting stood up head to head damn near every time.

Speaks, like the rest of the box defenders, was reactive most of the day. They made the job a hell of a lot harder on the secondary than needed and the secondary stood tall for the most part. He didn't 'shut down' the run on those drives; they still gained okay yardage in between incomplete passes from Mayfield. Moreover, Bailey had his only real standout play of the game early on as well when he tagged Chubb (IIRC) at the line of scrimmage and even Hitchens did an okay job early on so even on those drives, Speaks didn't do anything 'single-handedly'.

Nobody loses every time, but Speaks was completely ineffective as a pass rusher, got absolutely abused in coverage a time or two and was...fine...as a run defender. He did not play well yesterday and he damn sure didn't play better than Nelson.

[htismaqe]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

Speaks made a nice play on that inside trap looking play where he flowed down the line, no doubt (though if my memory serves, Chubb still gained a handful of yards there because poor push in the middle). He also did a good job of staying in front of Johnson later in the game on that 4th down and waiting for help to finish the play.

But Mayfield dropped back 42 times yesterday with the worst pair of tackles in the league protecting him and Speaks was getting stood up head to head damn near every time.

Speaks, like the rest of the box defenders, was reactive most of the day. They made the job a hell of a lot harder on the secondary than needed and the secondary stood tall for the most part. He didn't 'shut down' the run on those drives; they still gained okay yardage in between incomplete passes from Mayfield. Moreover, Bailey had his only real standout play of the game early on as well when he tagged Chubb (IIRC) at the line of scrimmage and even Hitchens did an okay job early on so even on those drives, Speaks didn't do anything 'single-handedly'.

Nobody loses every time, but Speaks was completely ineffective as a pass rusher, got absolutely abused in coverage a time or two and was...fine...as a run defender. He did not play well yesterday and he damn sure didn't play better than Nelson.

Speaks is playing out of position, we all know it. People expecting him to get a bunch of sacks standing up are deluding themselves. And the Browns line played pretty decent, they shut down Ford pretty much all day too.

This defense FINALLY showed up against the run and Speaks was a big (actually, probably the biggest) part of that. The only play Speaks really got burned on was the flat pass to Duke Johnson that went for 23 and he got picked at the line by Landry, which could have arguably been OPI. He played a solid, but unspectacular, game and was the most consistent defender I saw out there.