****Official 2017 NBA Playoffs Thread****

[KC_Connection]

The real season begins.

Round 1:

EAST:

#8 Bulls @ #1 Celtics
#7 Pacers @ #2 Cavs
#6 Bucks @ #3 Raptors
#5 Hawks @ #4 Wizards

WEST:
#8 Blazers @ #1 Warriors
#7 Grizzlies @ #2 Spurs
#6 Thunder @ #3 Rockets
#5 Jazz @ #4 Clippers

[New World Order]

Originally Posted by PAChiefsGuy

Don't forget about his high basketball IQ.

That leads to turnovers and little offensive production

[DaneMcCloud]

Originally Posted by The Bad Guy

For what? So they can be stuck in basketball mediocrity the next 4 years? They'll be an 8-10 seed, miss out on a top draft pick and be stuck in purgatory.

Pacers will end up taking a Lakers package eventually if I had to guess. Lakers should offer Randle/Clarkson and the 28.

The Lakers don't need to give up anything, as George has made his intentions clear.

The Pacers are powerless.

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Originally Posted by -King-

GS has a one star player advantage but you'd think that would partially be offset by LeBron being the best player in the world. But I guess not.
Posted via Mobile Device

Shaun Livingston and Iguodala as the #5 and #6 guys are significantly better than any player Cleveland has outside of Love, LeBron, and Irving. They are incredibly valuable to what the Warriors do.

[-King-]

Originally Posted by New World Order

No they don't.

Draymond's 10 ppg is really an all-star advantage?

I'm looking at it from KCCs point of view. I don't view Draymond as that great of a player either. He's a result of a hustle guy who was placed in a perfect system. If he was on the Cavs and Tristan was on the warriors, KCC would be complaining about how great a player Tristan is and how LeBron has no good teammates and has to rely on shitty role players like Draymond.
Posted via Mobile Device

[-King-]

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

Shaun Livingston and Iguodala as the #5 and #6 guys are significantly better than any player Cleveland has outside of Love, LeBron, and Irving. They are incredibly valuable to what the Warriors do.

That's because they play within a system. If Livingston played with the Cavs, the same people praising him would be talking about how shitty the Cavs bench is that their 6th man is a first round bust who came off one of the worst knee injuries in the NBA. He averaged 5 points, 2 rebounds and 2 assists a game. You're telling me that he'd magically make the Cavs better?


The biggest difference in the warriors vs Cavs is that the warriors have an actual system that they all play within and no player is bigger than the system. The Cavs system is LeBron James. When he's on the bench, theyre literally lost. And you can blame that on James. Blatt tried to implement a system that wasn't overly reliant on LeBron. He didn't like it and got Blatt fired and got a coach hired that has no idea wtf he's doing.
Posted via Mobile Device

[New World Order]

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

Shaun Livingston and Iguodala as the #5 and #6 guys are significantly better than any player Cleveland has outside of Love, LeBron, and Irving. They are incredibly valuable to what the Warriors do.

Argue about the bench, that's fine. I have no problem with that. I do have a problem with those that say Green is the reason GS is superior.

[-King-]

Imagine if Korver was on the warriors. I can't imagine how much people would complain about that.
Posted via Mobile Device

[dirk digler]

.

The Cavs are willing to enter into trade talks for George without any assurances he will commit to a long-term deal in Cleveland, a source familiar with the Cavs' thinking told ESPN. Cleveland is confident its championship culture and overall atmosphere could sway George to want to stay after playing out the 2017-18 season on the final year of his deal.

That said, there are only two assets the Cavs possess that would likely grab the Pacers' attention in a potential swap (operating under the assumption that LeBron James is untouchable): Kevin Love and Kyrie Irving.

And to part with either the 25-year-old Irving or the 28-year-old Love, both coming off All-Star seasons and on relatively economical long-term deals, without any verbal commitment from George that he planned to stay in Cleveland beyond 2018 would be "hard" to agree to, one source familiar with the Cavs' thinking told ESPN.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by dirk digler

.

The Cavs have maybe a year or 2 before their window self destructs no matter what. They can't improve themselves any other way because they dont have trade chips, draft picks, or any money the next few years. And lebron won't carry the team the same way as he gets older. There is no benefit to staying put.

Trading love for butler or George is the only way. It's a big upgrade because of system fit. George and I bet lebron will probably opt out but it will be worth it for one last run. And no Cleveland fan should be upset if lebron leaves Cleveland this way.

[Pitt Gorilla]

Originally Posted by dirk digler

.

This is great for the Pacers. They literally need just one team to want to trade for George for other teams to start the bidding. I think the Lakers were holding out hope that he'd remain in Indiana and they'd just sign him as a FA. If he's traded to the Cavs, though, the Lakers' chances of getting him long-term go down significantly.

Good for the Pacers, even though their GM is mostly garbage.

[KC_Connection]

Originally Posted by PAChiefsGuy

So both this year and next years GS teams are the greatest team of all-time?

Well this year's team probably was: http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/...nce-to-end-it/

I don't know what next year's team will be, but if they retain Iguodala, it's pretty safe to say they'll be right there again.

[KC_Connection]

Originally Posted by -King-

I'm looking at it from KCCs point of view. I don't view Draymond as that great of a player either. He's a result of a hustle guy who was placed in a perfect system. If he was on the Cavs and Tristan was on the warriors, KCC would be complaining about how great a player Tristan is and how LeBron has no good teammates and has to rely on shitty role players like Draymond.
Posted via Mobile Device

Draymond is #4 in the league in RPM (http://www.espn.com/nba/statistics/rpm/_/sort/RPM), #16 in BPM (http://www.basketball-reference.com/..._advanced.html), and #16 in VORP (http://www.basketball-reference.com/..._advanced.html). TT is 147th in the league in RPM, 75th in BPM, and 47th in VORP.

Turns out that one of the best defenders in the league means you have a large impact on the games.

[New World Order]

Originally Posted by KC_Connection

Draymond is #4 in the league in RPM (http://www.espn.com/nba/statistics/rpm/_/sort/RPM), #16 in BPM (http://www.basketball-reference.com/..._advanced.html), and #16 in VORP (http://www.basketball-reference.com/..._advanced.html). TT is 147th in the league in RPM, 75th in BPM, and 47th in VORP.

Turns out that one of the best defenders in the league means you have a large impact on the games.

Ridiculous. Lebron had one of the worst +/- in the Finals. Does that mean he was one of the worst players in the series?

Look at matchups. Draymond gets stomped 1-on-1 against good post up players:

http://www.basketball-reference.com/...01&idx=players

http://www.basketball-reference.com/...01&idx=players

[KC_Connection]

Originally Posted by New World Order

Ridiculous. Lebron had one of the worst +/- in the Finals. Does that mean he was one of the worst players in the series?

Look at matchups. Draymond gets stomped 1-on-1 against good post up players:

http://www.basketball-reference.com/...01&idx=players

http://www.basketball-reference.com/...01&idx=players

Not sure how posting matchups that show how Griffin and Aldridge put up worse numbers than their averages when facing Green/the Warriors is supposed to help you. You might want to rethink this one.

[chiefzilla1501]

The Cavs' need for 3 years has been exactly the same. They never needed Love. What they needed was a rim protector, a wing defender/Lebron depth, and Kyrie depth. In year 1, they ended up giving 2 firsts and Dion Waiters to get it, and lucked out with Delly overplaying his potential. Their inability to find Lebron depth has led to overuse of his minutes and a rotation of geriatrics like Marion and Richard Jefferson to fill his shoes.

This season, in desperation mode, the Cavs again hunted for... you guessed it... Kyrie depth and a rim protector. Led to a desperate bid for Bogut and even Larry Sanders. And what killed the Cavs this finals? You guessed it... They didn't have the Mozgov guy to neutralize GS' Zaza, which makes Tristan Thompson better. Deron Williams was a trainwreck on the court. And the best wing defender for Durant was... Richard Jefferson, just as the Cavs embarrassingly marched out Shawn Marion and Mike Miller in year 1.

If the Cavs trade for Paul George and can keep Bogut, they can compete with Golden State next year assuming they stay healthy. Though it'd be real nice to find some kind of Kyrie depth to soak up some minutes. That's the kind of talent they should have looked for in the first damn place 3 years ago.