Fire Bob Sutton

[petegz28]

That is all.

[htismaqe]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

I don't mind that.

There's no salary cap on coaches and the things you teach your ILBs and OLBs aren't the same. If you can have another person dedicating more of his time to a group of players, that's fine with me.

I don't see a problem with a CBs coach and a safeties coach. I'm not sure I'd agree with a DE coach vs. DT coach or multiple OL coaches, but the ILB/OLB distinction is kinda similar to TE vs WR to me. They do some things that are similar, but some things that are quite a bit different.

There's nothing terribly complex about 'read/react' and ideally that's exactly what we'd have our guys doing. The problem is that they suck at it. Their ability to diagnose a play is just comically bad. So if they're going to guess wrong anyway, might as well just have them sell out to stop SOMETHING.

I don't know. It reminds of the Vermeil days when the Chiefs had more assistant coaches and quality control staff than anybody else in the league.

Just because you have the money to build a giant bureaucracy doesn't mean you should.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by htismaqe

I don't know. It reminds of the Vermeil days when the Chiefs had more assistant coaches and quality control staff than anybody else in the league.

Just because you have the money to build a giant bureaucracy doesn't mean you should.

I look at it as quarantining a disease.

Whatever it is the ILBs have right now, keep them in a bubble and make sure it doesn't infect anyone else. Cordon them off at practice and make sure nobody so much as hears anything they're being taught. God help us all if Dee Ford manages to contract their particularly virulent strand of indecisivitis; he's just getting over a seemingly terminal case of it.

I'm not sure we can save the legs here, but maybe we can still save the patient...

[GloryDayz]

Originally Posted by htismaqe

Andy Reid will NEVER be that coach, sorry.

And it hurts the team. Done correctly, it's part of the game within the game. And even if he doesn't want to, because he's afraid they'll fight back by calling him fat (or something), he should enable and encourage his players to play that game within the game. By that game's rules. Tom and Payton aren't the only two players in the NFL to ever hold that status, but none of the people who were in that "community" were ever invited to be part of it by the officials, they sort of opened the door and walked in.

So yeah, I totally hope the D-line starts getting in the face of the official (from five feet away) every time they're held. If they draw a flag for it (if....), the TVs will almost certainly go back and show what happened, and why the official is actually wrong.

But alas, they probably won't.

[The Franchise]

And the winner of the most obvious statement of the week goes to Bob Sutton https://t.co/P9EXcRLst5

— Tucker (@thereal_tuckerf) October 18, 2018

[OKchiefs]

Originally Posted by The Pest

And the winner of the most obvious statement of the week goes to Bob Sutton https://t.co/P9EXcRLst5

— Tucker (@thereal_tuckerf) October 18, 2018

Yep, no shit Bob. Now what the **** are you going to do about it?

I'm sure we'll see A. J. Green in single coverage during the 4th quarter of a one score game on Sunday. I'm also sure Ragland and Hitchens will continue to be hesitant to react because of zero changes made to a piss poor scheme.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by OKchiefs

Yep, no shit Bob. Now what the **** are you going to do about it?

I'm sure we'll see A. J. Green in single coverage during the 4th quarter of a one score game on Sunday. I'm also sure Ragland and Hitchens will continue to be hesitant to react because of zero changes made to a piss poor scheme.

When a RB catches a ball in space with 5 yards between him and Hitchens then Hitchens backs up, what the hell does that have to do with scheme?

Look at some of those plays last week - there was no read to make, the ballcarrier had the ball and was coming at Hitchens, yet Hitchens wasn't getting his ass downhill to get after the ballcarrier. He's been truck-sticked so many times this year that he's just afraid of contact now. He's trying to get to the sides of guys for a drag tackle.

Hitchens had struggled leading up to last week but he flat ****ing embarrassed himself on Sunday. That was as poor a game as you will ever see from an inside linebacker.

[Jimmya]

As the analyst on NFL rewind said on those RB flare routes "this is a bad scheme... Most NFL defenses cannot have an inside linebacker in man coverage and expect him to cover a flare route ran by a 4.3 forty yard RB."

[SuperBowl4]

Andy Reid should be HC/DC!

[htismaqe]

Originally Posted by SuperBowl4

Andy Reid should be HC/DC!

He's already calling the offense. There's no way.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by Jimmya

As the analyst on NFL rewind said on those RB flare routes "this is a bad scheme... Most NFL defenses cannot have an inside linebacker in man coverage and expect him to cover a flare route ran by a 4.3 forty yard RB."

James White runs a 4.6.

If we're putting Hitchens in coverage on Tarik Cohen, he might have a point. But White's a guy who's athletic and a nice pass-catcher, but not so insanely athletic that he should be able to blow Hitchens off the map (Ragland, OTOH, is a different story).

Asking Hitchens to credibly stand in front of James White and tackle him before he gets another 6 yards downfield on a simple swing pass is not asking much at all. That's not a scheme problem, especially when you also have to account for Gordon, Edelman, Hogan and Gronk. As well as a QB who can just check into a run if he sees an easy opportunity.

That's just a remarkably stupid bit of 'insight' from an analyst that simply didn't have anything substantive to say.

[The Franchise]

No way.

Which team has missed the most tackles?
⁦@NFLResearch⁩ NextGen Stats pic.twitter.com/irWhfa4K6I

— Andrew Siciliano (@AndrewSiciliano) October 18, 2018

[kccrow]

Originally Posted by KCChiefsFan88

This thread is filled with people trying to rationalize why Sutton isn’t to blame and shouldn’t be fired for the collapse of the defense.

There's a much bigger talent issue than DC issue. I do think Sutton should be fired at season's end if only to bring in a cultural shift and accountability at every level. With that, I really support KC switching to a 4-3 but that's not really for right now. Right now the players in KC are horrendous and there's not much Sutton can do about that aside from make a complete schematic change mid-season and significantly dumbing down the defense but that just isn't going to happen, especially quickly. Sutton would have to start installing packages and ramp them up systematically throughout the season. I'm not sure he does though, so I'm prepared to whine like a bitch the remainder of this season and hope for change later.

[htismaqe]

Originally Posted by The Pest

No way.

Which team has missed the most tackles?
⁦@NFLResearch⁩ NextGen Stats pic.twitter.com/irWhfa4K6I

— Andrew Siciliano (@AndrewSiciliano) October 18, 2018

Impossible.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by The Pest

No way.

Which team has missed the most tackles?
⁦@NFLResearch⁩ NextGen Stats pic.twitter.com/irWhfa4K6I

— Andrew Siciliano (@AndrewSiciliano) October 18, 2018

Gotta be close enough to make one in order to miss it, I guess...

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by kccrow

There's a much bigger talent issue than DC issue. I do think Sutton should be fired at season's end if only to bring in a cultural shift and accountability at every level. With that, I really support KC switching to a 4-3 but that's not really for right now. Right now the players in KC are horrendous and there's not much Sutton can do about that aside from make a complete schematic change mid-season and significantly dumbing down the defense but that just isn't going to happen, especially quickly. Sutton would have to start installing packages and ramp them up systematically throughout the season. I'm not sure he does though, so I'm prepared to whine like a bitch the remainder of this season and hope for change later.

Sutton did make incremental changes last season and some fairly substantial ones late. And really, it looked for several weeks like they'd work. Hell, it looked like they were still working in the 1st half of the Titans game.

Then the Titans just decided to publicly emasculate the Chiefs box defenders. You don't see defenses get physically manhandled as badly as we did in that game very often.

To your point regarding culture - it's a fair one. The Chiefs were said to have been focused on adding toughness and aggression to the defense yet I still don't see any. And everyone who discusses Sutton's personality says he's 'cerebral' when they're being diplomatic and 'passive' if they aren't.

I won't dispute that a change might bring in a fresh attitude and in that respect it's worth exploring. I'm just can't get behind the idea that somebody's going to come in here, rip the scheme asunder and fix everything. Shit, the 'fire Sutton' threads can't even make up their minds what the problem is. Some say the scheme is too predictable and needs more 'creative blitzes' while others are saying it's too exotic and needs to be simplified.

I don't think scheme is the issue here. But man, attitude might be. I mean, be careful what we wish for because this is the same G-Rob vs. Gunther argument that we made 15 years or so ago, but maybe a little bit of crazy in the coaching box will help.