2019 Free agency Thread

[O.city]

We don't really have one of these yet, so figured we could use this as a place to discuss potential free agent acquisitions and what we would like to look for them to bring in.

If any of you guys are interested, heres a good place to do some research.

https://overthecap.com/

[pugsnotdrugs19]

Originally Posted by O.city

Problem right now, is that Jones isn't going to be getting blocked with 1 guy with what they've got around him at the moment.

Obviously have a while to go, but you need quite a few up there.

Well the tackles have to block the edge guys, doesn't matter if its you or me out there. They just have to account for them.

Jones will often be doubled, but again, I think we'll blitz and mix the looks up enough to get him some opportunities.

[O.city]

Originally Posted by htismaqe

His issues in the run game are just mental lapses - he gets too aggressive and doesn't stay assignment-sound. That can be coached out of him (hopefully).

And with his physical talent, it's not a stretch to say he's one of the few that might actually BE Aaron Donald-esque.

He's just so tall, he's always going to struggle with pad level in there but he's so athletic he can get away with it.

I'm hoping the new coaching staff helps with the free lancing for sure.

I'm not saying I wouldn't sign him or he's not really good. Just having counter conversations.

[pugsnotdrugs19]

Originally Posted by O.city

The Chiefs have expressed interest in former #Mizzou star and #Cardinals DE Markus Golden, per a source.

Golden, a St. Louis native, is a former second-round pick who led Arizona in sacks with 12.5 in 2016. Golden tore his ACL in 2017 and had 2.5 sacks in 11 starts last season.

— Terez A. Paylor (@TerezPaylor) March 14, 2019

That'd be fine. Get him and Ogbah and you've at least solidified some depth.

[O.city]

They're gonna run a lot of hybrid fronts with pattern matching behind it. It's really exciting.

Just get the damn guys to play it.

[pugsnotdrugs19]

I would think Golden would love to come back to Missouri.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by O.city

So are we sure we want to keep Jones? I know he's good and everyone loves him, but i'm always a little skeptical of paying DL that much who have some whispers of motor issues.

Especially when you're moving him off the edge deeper into the interior. Now granted, he spent a fair amount of time in a 3-tech anyway and in the under package he'll still be at the 3-tech a fair amount of the time, but there's still gonna be more dirty work for him to be doing in there.

Is he willing to do that? Is he willing to just occupy his blocker and play the run when the situation demands it? He wasn't always very good at that in the 3-4 and he'll be asked to do it more frequently in the 4-3, IMO.

The bottom line is you have to ask yourself if he's gonna be Fletcher Cox. Cox made the move seamlessly into the interior when he was asked to do so. In fact, he got better in a lot of ways. If Jones handles the switch the same way, he's worth more than Lawrence, IMO.

But because he plays DT, his tag figure will be lower and thus his negotating leverage less. You can probably get him for less than Lawrence. Especially since I don't think there have been any big ticket DT's signed this off-season that should serve to drive that average DT cost up any higher (so the DT franchise tag should stay relatively flat) whereas there have absolutely been some big money DE's signed who will drive that $17 million figure for DEs even higher next season.

You may be talking a tag # of $15.5 for Jones next season while DE's were at $17.2 this year and will probably be nearer $18 next. And that's without considering the fact that Lawrence already has 2 years on the tag and a guaranteed $20 million.

I think Jones should cost less than Lawrence. If you're talking about 6/$110 w/ $65 million guaranteed for Jones vs. 6/$130 w/ $75 million guaranteed for Lawrence, even assuming you can wash the pick by tagging/trading Jones, I'd prefer the former and the cap savings with the upside of having a disruptive interior rusher. I'll just have to take the risk that he doens't mail it in once he gets paid.

[O.city]

Yeah, Golden, ogbah would be a start.

Draft another one.

[pugsnotdrugs19]

Originally Posted by O.city

They're gonna run a lot of hybrid fronts with pattern matching behind it. It's really exciting.

Just get the damn guys to play it.

Fast DBs are great for it, like HB, Darby, even Verrett if that pans out.

[O.city]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

Especially when you're moving him off the edge deeper into the interior. Now granted, he spent a fair amount of time in a 3-tech anyway and in the under package he'll still be at the 3-tech a fair amount of the time, but there's still gonna be more dirty work for him to be doing in there.

Is he willing to do that? Is he willing to just occupy his blocker and play the run when the situation demands it? He wasn't always very good at that in the 3-4 and he'll be asked to do it more frequently in the 4-3, IMO.

The bottom line is you have to ask yourself if he's gonna be Fletcher Cox. Cox made the move seamlessly into the interior when he was asked to do so. In fact, he got better in a lot of ways. If Jones handles the switch the same way, he's worth more than Lawrence, IMO.

But because he plays DT, his tag figure will be lower and thus his negotating leverage less. You can probably get him for less than Lawrence. Especially since I don't think there have been any big ticket DT's signed this off-season that should serve to drive that average DT cost up any higher (so the DT franchise tag should stay relatively flat) whereas there have absolutely been some big money DE's signed who will drive that $17 million figure for DEs even higher next season.

You may be talking a tag # of $15.5 for Jones next season while DE's were at $17.2 this year and will probably be nearer $18 next. And that's without considering the fact that Lawrence already has 2 years on the tag and a guaranteed $20 million.

I think Jones should cost less than Lawrence. If you're talking about 6/$110 w/ $65 million guaranteed for Jones vs. 6/$130 w/ $75 million guaranteed for Lawrence, even assuming you can wash the pick by tagging/trading Jones, I'd prefer the former and the cap savings with the upside of having a disruptive interior rusher. I'll just have to take the risk that he doens't mail it in once he gets paid.

That's the thing, when he did some free lancing in the previous d, there were guys behind him. They usually sucked so they'd miss the tackle anyway, so it didn't matter but that's gonna change now.

Cox is a great example as that dude is just a ****ing monster in there. He does the little stuff too.

[pugsnotdrugs19]

As usual, we're probably too wrapped up in base scheme than we should be given the state of the league today. All teams are gonna spend over 2/3 of their defensive snaps in 4-2, 4-1, 2-3, or 2-4 fronts depending on their base identity.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by O.city

Problem right now, is that Jones isn't going to be getting blocked with 1 guy with what they've got around him at the moment.

Obviously have a while to go, but you need quite a few up there.

Exactly.

It's easy to have a high motor when you're getting single assignments and being allowed to attack upfield due to the help you have around you.

But that's a tougher ask when he's gonna get constantly double-teamed. It's like Shaq mailing it in on defense when he wasn't getting fed passes in the low post. Your big guys need to eat sometimes to keep their effort level up; it's just the nature of the beast.

So will he be able to get those opportunities? And frankly, if you can get Hill/Fuller extended and free up the tag for him next season, are you better served to make the conversion, see how he does and THEN pay up? Especially if he's already likely to ask for Cox money to get extended right this very second.

Given my druthers, that's the route I'd take. Get Hill and Fuller taken care if and free up the ability to use the tag on Jones next season if needed after he's shown what kind of transition he'll make into the 4-3.

[O.city]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

Especially when you're moving him off the edge deeper into the interior. Now granted, he spent a fair amount of time in a 3-tech anyway and in the under package he'll still be at the 3-tech a fair amount of the time, but there's still gonna be more dirty work for him to be doing in there.

Is he willing to do that? Is he willing to just occupy his blocker and play the run when the situation demands it? He wasn't always very good at that in the 3-4 and he'll be asked to do it more frequently in the 4-3, IMO.

The bottom line is you have to ask yourself if he's gonna be Fletcher Cox. Cox made the move seamlessly into the interior when he was asked to do so. In fact, he got better in a lot of ways. If Jones handles the switch the same way, he's worth more than Lawrence, IMO.

But because he plays DT, his tag figure will be lower and thus his negotating leverage less. You can probably get him for less than Lawrence. Especially since I don't think there have been any big ticket DT's signed this off-season that should serve to drive that average DT cost up any higher (so the DT franchise tag should stay relatively flat) whereas there have absolutely been some big money DE's signed who will drive that $17 million figure for DEs even higher next season.

You may be talking a tag # of $15.5 for Jones next season while DE's were at $17.2 this year and will probably be nearer $18 next. And that's without considering the fact that Lawrence already has 2 years on the tag and a guaranteed $20 million.

I think Jones should cost less than Lawrence. If you're talking about 6/$110 w/ $65 million guaranteed for Jones vs. 6/$130 w/ $75 million guaranteed for Lawrence, even assuming you can wash the pick by tagging/trading Jones, I'd prefer the former and the cap savings with the upside of having a disruptive interior rusher. I'll just have to take the risk that he doens't mail it in once he gets paid.

I'm also just looking and talking thru ways to have both of them for a time without it being crippling financially. I don't think that's possible.

The Chiefs also can't really trade away that first round pick. The only first round picks still on the roster from the last 5 years is Mahomes. Obviously, that's ideal, but you can't be losing those guys and it not come back to bite you.

[RunKC]

Yes you ****ing pay Chris Jones. You give him a 4 year deal instead of 5 or 6 so if the worst happens, you’re only ****ed for 2 years before the cap saving can start coming in for relief.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by pugsnotdrugs19

As usual, we're probably too wrapped up in base scheme than we should be given the state of the league today. All teams are gonna spend over 2/3 of their defensive snaps in 4-2, 4-1, 2-3, or 2-4 fronts depending on their base identity.

We don't have anywhere near the 'edge talent' to run 2 or 3 man fronts.

The sub packages may well change around what we do with the LBs and secondary - in fact I fully expect that. But even the sub packages are likely looking at 4 down linemen. So unless you look to kick Jones out to DE and put Williams/Warm Body in the middle, he's not gonna get a lot of outside rushing opportunities. Fewer even than he got last season.

He's gonna spend a lot of time in the muck.

[O.city]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

Exactly.

It's easy to have a high motor when you're getting single assignments and being allowed to attack upfield due to the help you have around you.

But that's a tougher ask when he's gonna get constantly double-teamed. It's like Shaq mailing it in on defense when he wasn't getting fed passes in the low post. Your big guys need to eat sometimes to keep their effort level up; it's just the nature of the beast.

So will he be able to get those opportunities? And frankly, if you can get Hill/Fuller extended and free up the tag for him next season, are you better served to make the conversion, see how he does and THEN pay up? Especially if he's already likely to ask for Cox money to get extended right this very second.

Given my druthers, that's the route I'd take. Get Hill and Fuller taken care if and free up the ability to use the tag on Jones next season if needed after he's shown what kind of transition he'll make into the 4-3.

It's something to think about. I don't like using the tag just because it pisses them off, but the players negotiated the agreement so it is what it is.

But I'd let him play in the 43 and see. That's not a bad idea IMO