Chiefs Package Deal with Bienemy and Dorsey? - Page 12

MahomesMagic · 12-02-2020, 08:21 AM

Sources tell Matt Lombardo of FanSided that Eric Bieniemy and John Dorsey could be a package deal.
The upcoming hiring season should begin in the next few weeks in the NFL as one of several frustrated teams hungry for new leadership will make the first move to hire a new regime. For one team, it could include a reunion of former and current Kansas City Chiefs employees.

Matt Lombardo, National NFL columnist for FanSided, has word that former Chiefs general manager John Dorsey and current offensive coordinator Eric Bieniemy might make themselves available as a package deal of sorts for a team looking to recreate the stable success of Kansas City.

https://arrowheadaddict.com/2020/12/...deal-new-team/

Interesting. So if that is the case Bienemy would be looking for a place with a HC and GM opening..

**DaneMcCloud** · 12-03-2020, 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wazu

Bullshit. Neither Reid nor Veach made that trade. Veach (who worked for Dorsey) found Mahomes.

Veach worked has worked with Reid since 2006 and was high on Mahomes in 2015.

Quote:

Originally Posted by wazu

Reid bought in, as did seemingly everybody. But trading up 15 spots in the first round is extraordinary. Nobody could expect that would be possible. He also knew exactly how high he had to go to make sure he got Mahomes. Greatest move by any GM in franchise history, with no close second.

That's really ****ing funny!

Do you really think that John Dorsey, the guy that never visited the Texas Tech campus, never met with Kliff Kingbury and had absolutely NO RELATIONSHIP with Bills head coach, Sean McDermott, made that trade?

You're ****ing smokin' crack.

That deal was made because McDermott worked with Andy for 10 full years and when it was time to let him go, Reid recommended him as DC to one of his other "guys" in Ron Rivera.

Dorsey didn't have dick to do with Mahomes. Hell, even Leigh Steinberg and his guys have said that they were in constant contact with Brett Veach during the entire draft season of 2017.

WhiteWhale · 12-03-2020, 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

I can't believe that people are this stupid.

Yeah you can.

The 4 certainties of life. Life, death, taxes, and reading stupid shit on the internet

htismaqe · 12-03-2020, 08:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by B_Ambuehl

I'd be more concerned about EB having success than Dorsey. Coaches attempting to run the Andy Reid offense aren't exactly setting the world on fire (Nagy, Pederson).

Dorsey has proven himself a stud. He got run out of cleveland because Podesta is Haslam's lapdog & Dorsey literally took Podesta's reports and threw them in the trash.

Thru 7 drafts he either drafted or traded for 13 pro bowlers and has 7 straight years of acquiring at least one pro bowler:

2013: Eric Fisher, Travis Kelce

2014: Dee Ford

2015: Marcus Peters, Mitch Morse

2016: Chris Jones, Tyreek Hill

2017: Patrick Mahomes, Kareem Hunt

2018: Denzel Ward, Nick Chubb (also acquired pro bowler Jarvis Landry in free agency)

2019: Wyatt Teller (set to make 2020 pro bowl. Dorsey fleeced Buffalo in a trade for peanuts)

All you detail there is personnel decisions. Nothing about contracts or coaching hires, both of which are still a GM's job.

Dorsey hired Freddie Kitchens despite Podesta's protestations. He's a terrible GM. It's a fact.

Titty Meat · 12-03-2020, 08:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by B_Ambuehl

I'd be more concerned about EB having success than Dorsey. Coaches attempting to run the Andy Reid offense aren't exactly setting the world on fire (Nagy, Pederson).

Dorsey has proven himself a stud. He got run out of cleveland because Podesta is Haslam's lapdog & Dorsey literally took Podesta's reports and threw them in the trash.

Thru 7 drafts he either drafted or traded for 13 pro bowlers and has 7 straight years of acquiring at least one pro bowler:

2013: Eric Fisher, Travis Kelce

2014: Dee Ford

2015: Marcus Peters, Mitch Morse

2016: Chris Jones, Tyreek Hill

2017: Patrick Mahomes, Kareem Hunt

2018: Denzel Ward, Nick Chubb (also acquired pro bowler Jarvis Landry in free agency)

2019: Wyatt Teller (set to make 2020 pro bowl. Dorsey fleeced Buffalo in a trade for peanuts)

Pederson won a super bowl before Reid.....

**wazu** · 12-03-2020, 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

That deal was made because McDermott worked with Andy for 10 full years and when it was time to let him go, Reid recommended him as DC to one of his other "guys" in Ron Rivera.

Dorsey didn't have dick to do with Mahomes.

Do you have a source for any of this? Bills GM tells a different story about how he was talking to Dorsey for months leading up to the draft.

https://www.espn.com/nfl/draft2019/s...maneuvered-nfl

"Dorsey had much the same sense. He identified the Cardinals, Giants and Saints as teams the Chiefs needed to maneuver in front of. The Saints picked 11th, the Cardinals 13th and the Giants 23rd.

"I tried to read as much as I could, in terms of reading the other 31 teams and seeing where they were positioning," Dorsey said shortly after Mahomes was drafted. "I felt to get this player, I had to be at 10.

"I know there were three teams that wanted this player very badly, and I got a text or two [afterward] asking, 'How'd you do that?' It worked. I've got to thank the Buffalo Bills. They were willing to acquire some picks, and that would help them as well, so it helped out both parties."

Dorsey and Doug Whaley, then the Bills' general manager, started discussing the trade at the NFL scouting combine in February. They got serious about trade terms in the days leading up to the draft.

Whaley said last week that he didn't know the player the Chiefs were after and didn't suspect it was a quarterback, despite the steep move from 27 to 10.

"Not at all," said Whaley, who was fired shortly after that draft for reasons not having to do with the Mahomes trade. "The Chiefs played it right. With Alex Smith on their roster, we didn't think they were coming up for a quarterback."

Titty Meat · 12-03-2020, 08:32 PM

Alot of gymnastics being played in here to discredit Dorsey for sure. He definitely brought talent to both organizations how is that even a debate?

htismaqe · 12-03-2020, 08:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Titty Meat

Alot of gymnastics being played in here to discredit Dorsey for sure. He definitely brought talent to both organizations how is that even a debate?

It's not a debate. Nobody is saying he's bad at evaluating talent.

The issue is that evaluating talent only 1/3 of a GENERAL Manager's job.

He was legitimately bad at the other 2/3.

How is THAT even a debate?

**DaneMcCloud** · 12-03-2020, 08:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by B_Ambuehl

Dorsey has proven himself a stud. He got run out of cleveland because Podesta is Haslam's lapdog & Dorsey literally took Podesta's reports and threw them in the trash.

Quote:

Originally Posted by B_Ambuehl

Thru 7 drafts he either drafted or traded for 13 pro bowlers and has 7 straight years of acquiring at least one pro bowler:

2013: Eric Fisher, Travis Kelce
2014: Dee Ford
2015: Marcus Peters, Mitch Morse
2016: Chris Jones, Tyreek Hill
2017: Patrick Mahomes, Kareem Hunt
2018: Denzel Ward, Nick Chubb (also acquired pro bowler Jarvis Landry in free agency)
2019: Wyatt Teller (set to make 2020 pro bowl. Dorsey fleeced Buffalo in a trade for peanuts)

Good ****ing god.

2013: Eric Fisher - Andy Reid. Travis Kelce - Andy Reid.
2014: Dee Ford - Definitely John Dorsey
2015: Marcus Peters - Chris Ballard. Mitch Morse - Andy Reid
2016: Chris Jones and Tyreek Hill were scouted by Ryne Nutt. The entire organization was in on the Tyreek Hill selection due to the domestic violence conviciton
2017: Mahomes was Veach & Reid. Reid used to watch Hunt every Thursday on ESPN's MAC games and loved him.
2018: Denzel Ward over Bradley Chubb?

Landry was acquired in a trade, not as a Free Agent.

Dorsey took Kpassognon when Alvin Kamara and JuJu Smith Schuster were still on the board. He took shitbag KeVarie Russell in the 3rd round and had to cut him after TC because he sucked ass so badly.

He traded a 5th to Baltimore for Ben Grubbs, quickly signed him to $24 million dollar deal with $8 million in guarantees. Grubbs played in 7 games and was released at the end of the season.

Dorsey cut Tamba Hali, which caused a $4 million dollar Dead Cap hit, then signed him to a 3 year, $21 million dollar deal. Hali didn't play his final year of that contract but received his full contract.

Dorsey was garbage and treated players like shit. He was unceremoniously fired in Cleveland as well.

Anyone that thinks he was "great" doesn't know dick about the NFL.

**DaneMcCloud** · 12-03-2020, 09:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wazu

Do you have a source for any of this? Bills GM tells a different story about how he was talking to Dorsey for months leading up to the draft.

There have been countless articles in Sports Illustrated, The Athletic and others detailing exactly what transpired, all of which completely contradict Adam Teicher's article, which should shock no one.

Here's a few:

https://www.chicagotribune.com/sport...109-story.html

"Brett, obviously with retrospect now, did a tremendous job on scouting Patrick and then getting first, Andy, and then later, John Dorsey, excited about him," Hunt told reporters in October. "It truly was an organizational decision to draft him, so I don't want to minimize that, but Brett deserves a lot of the credit."

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/...165452074.html

A few days before the NFLPA Collegiate Bowl in January 2017, Chris Cabott and Brett Veach huddled in a quiet hallway outside of a Los Angeles hotel ballroom.

The discussion they’d have that day — about a quarterback prospect out of Texas Tech named Patrick Mahomes II — would shape the direction of the Kansas City Chiefs for years to come, though no one would have guessed that at the time.

Cabott, who co-represented Mahomes with Leigh Steinberg, was trying to convince NFL teams and draft pundits that Mahomes was more than a reckless gunslinger, someone who should be a first-round pick in the coming months. This was long before Mahomes became one of the hottest quarterbacks in the NFL entering Sunday, sporting a 143.3 rating with 10 touchdown passes, 582 passing yards and zero interceptions after two games.

“Oh yeah, you’ve got Mahomes,” Veach said, prompting Cabott to answer in the affirmative. “We’re really serious about Patrick.”

So if you want to know the Mahomes origins story involving the Chiefs, this is as good a place to start as any. Over the next three months after that meeting in L.A., Cabott says that without fail, he’d hear from Veach, who always wanted to know the latest on his guy.

“For like 94 straight days, we literally communicated in some way, shape or form,” Cabott told Yahoo Sports. “We established a rapport where Brett was like, ‘anything about Patrick, I want to know.’”

Cabott respected Veach’s aggression and persistence. He wanted to know how Mahomes did in workouts. He wanted to know how his injured wrist was healing. He wanted to know the details of Mahomes’ passing script for his pro day workout at Texas Tech. “Some of these calls with Brett were at midnight, 1 a.m. in the morning,” Cabott recalled with a chuckle. “It was clear to me that Patrick was the guy in Brett’s eyes, the guy that he wanted them to take. But it would be more than his call.”

Indeed. But Veach was on that, too, as he was the first one to introduce Mahomes to Reid, the quarterback guru with a tremendous amount of organizational sway. For months, Veach hounded Reid, telling him: check out Mahomes, check out Mahomes, check out Mahomes.

---
Much more at the link

**wazu** · 12-03-2020, 10:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

There have been countless articles in Sports Illustrated, The Athletic and others detailing exactly what transpired, all of which completely contradict Adam Teicher's article, which should shock no one.

Here's a few:

https://www.chicagotribune.com/sport...109-story.html

"Brett, obviously with retrospect now, did a tremendous job on scouting Patrick and then getting first, Andy, and then later, John Dorsey, excited about him," Hunt told reporters in October. "It truly was an organizational decision to draft him, so I don't want to minimize that, but Brett deserves a lot of the credit."

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/...165452074.html

A few days before the NFLPA Collegiate Bowl in January 2017, Chris Cabott and Brett Veach huddled in a quiet hallway outside of a Los Angeles hotel ballroom.

The discussion they’d have that day — about a quarterback prospect out of Texas Tech named Patrick Mahomes II — would shape the direction of the Kansas City Chiefs for years to come, though no one would have guessed that at the time.

Cabott, who co-represented Mahomes with Leigh Steinberg, was trying to convince NFL teams and draft pundits that Mahomes was more than a reckless gunslinger, someone who should be a first-round pick in the coming months. This was long before Mahomes became one of the hottest quarterbacks in the NFL entering Sunday, sporting a 143.3 rating with 10 touchdown passes, 582 passing yards and zero interceptions after two games.

“Oh yeah, you’ve got Mahomes,” Veach said, prompting Cabott to answer in the affirmative. “We’re really serious about Patrick.”

So if you want to know the Mahomes origins story involving the Chiefs, this is as good a place to start as any. Over the next three months after that meeting in L.A., Cabott says that without fail, he’d hear from Veach, who always wanted to know the latest on his guy.

“For like 94 straight days, we literally communicated in some way, shape or form,” Cabott told Yahoo Sports. “We established a rapport where Brett was like, ‘anything about Patrick, I want to know.’”

Cabott respected Veach’s aggression and persistence. He wanted to know how Mahomes did in workouts. He wanted to know how his injured wrist was healing. He wanted to know the details of Mahomes’ passing script for his pro day workout at Texas Tech. “Some of these calls with Brett were at midnight, 1 a.m. in the morning,” Cabott recalled with a chuckle. “It was clear to me that Patrick was the guy in Brett’s eyes, the guy that he wanted them to take. But it would be more than his call.”

Indeed. But Veach was on that, too, as he was the first one to introduce Mahomes to Reid, the quarterback guru with a tremendous amount of organizational sway. For months, Veach hounded Reid, telling him: check out Mahomes, check out Mahomes, check out Mahomes.

---
Much more at the link

I've seen all that. I believe absolutely that Veach was the guy, who worked for Dorsey, who found Mahomes, and built the organizational support for making a big move to get him. None of that refutes that Dorsey pulled off that amazing trade. Reid was not the GM. Veach was not the GM. They can love a guy all they want but trading from 27 to 10 is not something that just happens. Dorsey negotiated an insane deal and pulled the trigger on behalf of the entire organization. Give the man credit.

**DaneMcCloud** · 12-03-2020, 10:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wazu

None of that refutes that Dorsey pulled off that amazing trade. Reid was not the GM. Veach was not the GM. They can love a guy all they want but trading from 27 to 10 is not something that just happens. Dorsey negotiated an insane deal and pulled the trigger on behalf of the entire organization. Give the man credit.

Reid was a GM for 13 years in the NFL and drafted many Pro Bowlers, All Pro's and a few Hall of Famers. His relationship with McDermott went back more than a decade and Whaley was already out the door. Shortly thereafter, Dorsey was fired, too.

The deal was made between Reid and McDermott, with assists from Clark and Pegula.

You're living in a fantasy world if you believe otherwise.

ChiefsFanatic · 12-04-2020, 02:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

Good ****ing god.

2013: Eric Fisher - Andy Reid. Travis Kelce - Andy Reid.
2014: Dee Ford - Definitely John Dorsey
2015: Marcus Peters - Chris Ballard. Mitch Morse - Andy Reid
2016: Chris Jones and Tyreek Hill were scouted by Ryne Nutt. The entire organization was in on the Tyreek Hill selection due to the domestic violence conviciton
2017: Mahomes was Veach & Reid. Reid used to watch Hunt every Thursday on ESPN's MAC games and loved him.
2018: Denzel Ward over Bradley Chubb?

Landry was acquired in a trade, not as a Free Agent.

Dorsey took Kpassognon when Alvin Kamara and JuJu Smith Schuster were still on the board. He took shitbag KeVarie Russell in the 3rd round and had to cut him after TC because he sucked ass so badly.

He traded a 5th to Baltimore for Ben Grubbs, quickly signed him to $24 million dollar deal with $8 million in guarantees. Grubbs played in 7 games and was released at the end of the season.

Dorsey cut Tamba Hali, which caused a $4 million dollar Dead Cap hit, then signed him to a 3 year, $21 million dollar deal. Hali didn't play his final year of that contract but received his full contract.

Dorsey was garbage and treated players like shit. He was unceremoniously fired in Cleveland as well.

Anyone that thinks he was "great" doesn't know dick about the NFL.

Here is the complete draft history of Chiefs GM John Dorsey. It's littered with scrubs for the most part. If the player didn't grade out as a first day guy, Dorsey was pretty much clueless at identifying talent.

Building depth on your roster is done in the later rounds. Dorsey was very bad at building depth. I posit that any late round player that made an impact at all only did so because Reid was the head coach.

Eric Fisher - LT - 1st (Probably Reid)
Travis Kelce - TE - 3rd (Definitely Reid)
Knile Davis - RB - 3rd
Nico Johnson LB - 4th
Sander Commings - CB - 5th
Eric Kush - C - 6th
Braden Wilson - FB - 6th
Mike Catapano - DE - 7th

Dee Ford - DE - 1st
Philip Gaines - CB - 3rd
Dat - RB/WR - 4th
Andy Murray - QB - 5th
Zach Fulton - OL - 6th
LDT - OL - 6th

Marcus Peters - CB - 1st
Mitch Morse - OL - 2nd
Chris Conley - WR - 3rd
Steven Nelson - CB - 3rd
Ramik Wilson - LB - 4th
DJ Alexander - LB - 5th
James O'Shaugnessy - TE - 5th
Rakeem Nunez-Roches - DT - 6th
Da'Ron Brown - WR - 7th

Chris Jones - DT - 2nd
KeiVarae Russell - CB - 3rd
Parker Ehinger - OL - 4th
Eric Murray - CB - 4th
D-Rob - WR - 4th
Kevin Hogan - QB - 5th
Tyreek - WR - 5th
DJ White - CB - 6th
Dadi Nicolas - LB - 6th

Mahomes - QB - 1st (Bart Vatch & Reid)
TK - DE - 2nd
Kareem Hunt - RB - 3rd
Jehu Chesson - WR - 4th
Ukeme Eligwe - LB - 5th
Leon McQuay III - S - 6th

Sent from my GM1915 using Tapatalk

htismaqe · 12-04-2020, 07:27 AM

That Marcus Peters draft ended up being a pretty good one.

For other teams.

In58men · 12-19-2020, 10:08 AM

Looks like Dorsey might be headed to Philly.

From @gmfb Weekend: The #Eagles quietly brought former #Chiefs and #Browns* GM John Dorsey aboard as a consultant the past few months. Dorsey could be in the mix for some GM jobs this cycle. If not, possible he sticks in Philly.

KChiefs1 · 12-19-2020, 10:12 AM

Mahomes & Kamara on the same team would have been phenomenal.

12-02-2020, 08:21 AM
MahomesMagic Generational Player Join Date: May 2017 Location: Honolulu Casino cash: $3670400	Package Deal with Bienemy and Dorsey? Sources tell Matt Lombardo of FanSided that Eric Bieniemy and John Dorsey could be a package deal. The upcoming hiring season should begin in the next few weeks in the NFL as one of several frustrated teams hungry for new leadership will make the first move to hire a new regime. For one team, it could include a reunion of former and current Kansas City Chiefs employees. Matt Lombardo, National NFL columnist for FanSided, has word that former Chiefs general manager John Dorsey and current offensive coordinator Eric Bieniemy might make themselves available as a package deal of sorts for a team looking to recreate the stable success of Kansas City. https://arrowheadaddict.com/2020/12/...deal-new-team/ Interesting. So if that is the case Bienemy would be looking for a place with a HC and GM opening..
Posts: 2,740

12-03-2020, 08:32 PM	#171
Titty Meat Inmem 2.0 Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: My house Casino cash: $1777558	Alot of gymnastics being played in here to discredit Dorsey for sure. He definitely brought talent to both organizations how is that even a debate?
Posts: 75,613	1 0

12-04-2020, 07:27 AM	#178
htismaqe 'Tis my eye! Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Chiefsplanet Casino cash: $10269900	That Marcus Peters draft ended up being a pretty good one. For other teams.
Posts: 100,022

12-19-2020, 10:08 AM	#179
In58men Baba Ganoush Join Date: Jan 2012 Casino cash: $1798026	Looks like Dorsey might be headed to Philly. From @gmfb Weekend: The #Eagles quietly brought former #Chiefs and #Browns* GM John Dorsey aboard as a consultant the past few months. Dorsey could be in the mix for some GM jobs this cycle. If not, possible he sticks in Philly. __________________ My Kansas City Chief record 9-9
Posts: 29,427

12-19-2020, 10:12 AM	#180
KChiefs1 I’m a Mahomo! Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Mid-Missouri Casino cash: $6771021	Mahomes & Kamara on the same team would have been phenomenal. __________________
Posts: 54,038