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Old 09-05-2014, 03:34 PM  
'Hamas' Jenkins 'Hamas' Jenkins is offline
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Organic Chemistry Question

This one has me totally vexed. Any help you could offer on where to put the arrows would be greatly appreciated.




It looks like it's already done. I'm not sure if I should approach it as conjugated pi bonds or not.
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Old 09-05-2014, 03:58 PM   #16
Ming the Merciless Ming the Merciless is online now
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I found this question on another test of the same company




with no curved lines

maybe u got instructors manual???? NICE
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Old 09-05-2014, 04:00 PM   #17
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B B B B B B B B B B B B B B

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Old 09-05-2014, 04:06 PM   #18
Don Corlemahomes Don Corlemahomes is offline
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Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins View Post
Doesn't the first resonance arrow suggest that you are moving the pi bond in the upper right hand of the benzene ring to the C-N bond, and won't that gobble up that lone pair?
I think the instructions in the lower righthand box are suggesting you indicate the movement of electrons in that last structure from the double bond between C1 and nitrogen back onto the nitrogen as a lone pair.

****, been 5 years and a near total dump of the concepts from that awful class.
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Old 09-05-2014, 04:12 PM   #19
Don Corlemahomes Don Corlemahomes is offline
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****, no. Maybe you have to complete each by adding arrows to show the movement of electrons onto each carbon in the ring, and also show the movement of electrons back onto the nitrogen in the fourth, a la this one:

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Old 09-05-2014, 04:19 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Cunning Linguist View Post
****, no. Maybe you have to complete each by adding arrows to show the movement of electrons onto each carbon in the ring, and also show the movement of electrons back onto the nitrogen in the fourth, a la this one:
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Old 09-05-2014, 06:01 PM   #21
Buehler445 Buehler445 is offline
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I have no idea. But I have a buddy that has a doctorate and some post doc work in chemistry. PM me if you want me to call him.
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Old 09-05-2014, 06:06 PM   #22
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Old 09-05-2014, 06:18 PM   #23
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So in that first picture, if you moved the double bond to the amine, the nitrogen would have a negative charge, because it's going to have a double bond, plus 2 hydrogen, plus it's electron pair. nitrogen doesn't like that (octet rule). also the carbon that loses that double bond is going to be positively charged since it will be only bound to 2 carbons and a hydrogen and is missing a valence electron. It's been years since I've done something like that example. But you have a conjugated system.

The electron pair moves from the N to the carbon closest to it to form the double bond, and an electron pair moves from that carbon to the one adjacent to it. I'm a little confused by how they drew it though. but it's been a long time for me and we only went over ortho, para, and meta for one session

here's a decent picture of what I mean


basically the nitrogen has a partial positive charge and all of the carbons have a partial negative if that makes sense

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Old 09-05-2014, 06:18 PM   #24
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Old 09-05-2014, 06:22 PM   #25
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Two single bonds and two lone pairs on N
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Old 09-05-2014, 06:25 PM   #26
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You dipwad, That's already answered . I jerk off friggin pigs and know that !
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Old 09-05-2014, 06:40 PM   #27
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When you all get this sorted - I have a few Algebra II questions.

Thanks!
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Old 09-05-2014, 06:47 PM   #28
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When you all get this sorted - I have a few Algebra II questions.

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Old 09-05-2014, 06:57 PM   #29
Don Corlemahomes Don Corlemahomes is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrunkBassGuitar View Post
So in that first picture, if you moved the double bond to the amine, the nitrogen would have a negative positive charge, because it's going to have a double bond, plus 2 hydrogen, plus it's electron pair electron pair is lost. nitrogen doesn't like that (octet rule). also the carbon that loses that double bond is going to be positively chargedNo since it will be only bound to 2 carbons and a hydrogen and is missing a valence electron. It's been years since I've done something like that example. But you have a conjugated system.

The electron pair moves from the N to the carbon closest to it to form the double bond, and an electron pair moves from that carbon to the one adjacent to it. (Yes, which is why N isn't negative and C isn't positive, but the exact opposite) I'm a little confused by how they drew it though. but it's been a long time for me and we only went over ortho, para, and meta for one session

here's a decent picture of what I mean


basically the nitrogen has a partial positive charge and all of the carbons have a partial negative if that makes sense
You haven't really provided any solution, other than describing what you see. OP can do that, but he needs a solution other than "it's already done, and this is happening" offered by others.
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Old 09-05-2014, 07:00 PM   #30
'Hamas' Jenkins 'Hamas' Jenkins is offline
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Ok, so moving the lone pair on the last benzene ring on the carbon with the negative formal charge to form a double bond in the upper left hand corner is correct, but my attempts for the other three were not.
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