Game of Thrones (spoiler-free zone)

[keg in kc]

A few have suggested it, might as well test the waters. The idea is to give people who haven't read the books a safe place to talk about the show.

A few quick ground rules:

• No Spoilers!!!!! for upcoming episodes.
• Larger Song of Ice and Fire discussion should be limited to the other thread although I think a tiny bit of book delving to fill in holes should be okay (example of this would be talking about Catelyn and her treatment of the wolves in the novel, which was alluded to on TV but never really made clear...)
• Everything that happened that week is fair game once an episode airs. So if you don't watch on Sunday night, I'd stay outta here until you do...

[Skyy God]

Originally Posted by Fire Me Boy!

I'm so sick and tired of these slow ass episodes and exposition. Bring on the white walkers!!! If they don't turn it around soon, I'm outta here.

This is the Walking Dead thread, right?

Ok, strawman. The 2 shows are on completely different planes of quality.

[KC_Connection]

Originally Posted by Silock

It's not that so much as it's a story about a bunch of dudes with ****ing armies who never actually do any fighting.

If I wanted to watch a show that was all about teasing, I'd go for late-night Cinemax.

Of the five kings from the war, three are already dead and another lost a massive battle and is in relative ruin. Characters are dropping like flies all over the place. Seems like a rather specious complaint.

GoT has never been a show about war anyway, though, it's a show about politics and "playing the game" (with some fantasy elements thrown in). And a great one at that.

[KcMizzou]

You're not going to get epic battles on screen. It's a TV show not a blockbuster movie. Even The Battle of the Blackwater was pretty confined. (yet still AWESOME).

Most of the big fights happen off screen because there simply isn't the cash to do epic LOTR style battles. The money they have is better spent on set design, authenticity. I think they've done a fantastic job.

[KC_Connection]

Originally Posted by KcMizzou

You're not going to get epic battles on screen. It's a TV show not a blockbuster movie. Even The Battle of the Blackwater was pretty confined. (yet still AWESOME).

Most of the big fights happen off screen because there simply isn't the cash to do epic LOTR style battles. The money they have is better spent on set design, authenticity. I think they've done a fantastic job.

Yes, they just don't have the budget to show all that much.

I don't know if you've seen the show Rome, but they had to do something similar with all the wars/battles in that time period due to costs (and there were a lot). It certainly never had anything like the Battle of the Blackwater, though.

[KcMizzou]

Honestly, you don't get much about the "epic battles" in the books, either. They're left "off screen" there too. It's not so much about the battles as it is the players... the build up, the outcome and the aftermath.

[BigRedChief]

Originally Posted by Fire Me Boy!

It was a joke based on the TWD thread.

cool

[Silock]

Originally Posted by KC_Connection

Of the five kings from the war, three are already dead and another lost a massive battle and is in relative ruin. Characters are dropping like flies all over the place. Seems like a rather specious complaint.

GoT has never been a show about war anyway, though, it's a show about politics and "playing the game" (with some fantasy elements thrown in). And a great one at that.

Except it has always alluded that it would be about that. "Winter is coming!" Mother of dragons gets huge army. Watchers on the wall and all that.

I didn't read the books. All I have to go on is the build up in the story I see on TV, which is less than fulfilling. Yes, some crazy shit has happened. But it's always confined to just a few characters here and there. Nothing . . . spectacular. Sure, I enjoy seeing the intrigue and all that, but at some point, you've got to ****ing shit or get off the pot. The **** is the point of all the maneuvering if you don't actually DO anything once you get the ****ing power?

[KC_Connection]

Originally Posted by Silock

I didn't read the books. All I have to go on is the build up in the story I see on TV, which is less than fulfilling.

Would have to disagree there. It's all been incredibly fulfilling so far.

Yes, some crazy shit has happened. But it's always confined to just a few characters here and there. Nothing . . . spectacular. Sure, I enjoy seeing the intrigue and all that, but at some point, you've got to ****ing shit or get off the pot. The **** is the point of all the maneuvering if you don't actually DO anything once you get the ****ing power?

I get your point. Too much maneuvering and not enough "doing" for your liking. To me, though, that would seem to suggest GoT isn't exactly the show for you because I wouldn't expect that aspect of it to change. In fact, that's what the show is very much about.

[Baby Lee]

[Silock]

Originally Posted by KC_Connection

Would have to disagree there. It's all been incredibly fulfilling so far.


I get your point. Too much maneuvering and not enough "doing" for your liking. To me, though, that would seem to suggest GoT isn't exactly the show for you because I wouldn't expect that aspect of it to change. In fact, that's what the show is very much about.

And I like that part of it, but it's a bit stale when every episode is "hey, check it out! More intrigue and people being dicks to each other!" At some point, it becomes more like a soap opera than proper fantasy. I guess I just prefer it to be more well-rounded. I would get bored with constant fighting, too, I think.

[Baby Lee]

Been looking for one of these



Full story in images

http://imgur.com/gallery/0EQr6

[KC_Connection]

Originally Posted by Silock

And I like that part of it, but it's a bit stale when every episode is "hey, check it out! More intrigue and people being dicks to each other!" At some point, it becomes more like a soap opera than proper fantasy. I guess I just prefer it to be more well-rounded. I would get bored with constant fighting, too, I think.

I suppose GoT has its soap opera elements, but I'm not sure there's much wrong with that. For me, I quite enjoy following so many character arcs in this fascinating world. And while it may not seem like it right now, eventually their stories will have a finite ending.

[Hawk]

Originally Posted by Silock

And I like that part of it, but it's a bit stale when every episode is "hey, check it out! More intrigue and people being dicks to each other!" At some point, it becomes more like a soap opera than proper fantasy. I guess I just prefer it to be more well-rounded. I would get bored with constant fighting, too, I think.

I just don't think you are being realistic. There has been tons of sword fights, and small scale fighting and killing throughout the series. But TV shows don't do huge battle scenes, and they certainly don't do them often (we at least got the Battle of Blackwater in Season 2). That is 99% due to budget restraints. GoT has one of the highest per episode budgets in television at $6 million per episode this season (it has been less than that in prior seasons and has increased as ratings have grown). But your average 2 hour action/war movie would have a budget of well over $100 million, some that are over $200 million.

You simply can't do the same type of production at $12 million for two hours as you can with $100-$200 million for two hours, so they are forced to gloss over battles unless they are critical to the story telling for some reason. It is what it is. This is why GRRM has said it might make sense to do a full length feature movie (or two) to end the series because you are going to need more than $6 million to do the seemingly inevitable battle to come between the dragons and the white walkers.

All that being said, Mance Rayder is marching his wildling army on the wall, and the Thenns and other wildlings are preparing to attack castle black from the south. Mance has giants, mammoths, and all kinds of crazy wildlings to use for his attack. My assumption is they will show that battle at the wall near the end of this season, and it should be pretty cool if they do it right.

[Silock]

Even so, that chick has been marching with her army for like 4 seasons and all we've gotten so far from her is a rehash of David and Goliath or the scene from Achilles with Brad Pitt.

[Hawk]

Originally Posted by Silock

Even so, that chick has been marching with her army for like 4 seasons and all we've gotten so far from her is a rehash of David and Goliath or the scene from Achilles with Brad Pitt.

Haha, well, yeah sort of. She is a long way from Westeros, and at first had no army at all. Then she married into the Dothraki and got an army, but she lost that when Drogo died. She didn't get another army until she burned the slavers and killed the Masters in Astapor in episode 4 last season. Since then she has taken two more cities in Yunkai and Mereen, but you are 100% right that they have not shown any real battles in taking those cities, once again due to budget mostly, though even the books pretty much glossed over those battles, or avoided them by having the slaves uprise against the masters.

You are not the only one who wants to move her story forward more quickly, but not sure you will get what you want. I still think the big battle this season should be the wildling battle with the NW. That one has a lot of potential to be awesome, we'll see if they can pull it off with the limited CGI budget they have.