**2016 Official NBA Playoffs Thread**

[KC_Connection]

Round 1:

EAST:

#8 Pistons @ #1 Cavs
#7 Pacers @ #2 Raptors
#6 Hornets @ #3 Heat
#5 Celtics @ #4 Hawks

WEST:
#8 Rockets @ #1 Warriors
#7 Grizzlies @ #2 Spurs
#6 Mavericks @ #3 Thunder
#5 Blazers @ #4 Clippers

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by OldSchool

Warriors might have actually lost that Blazers series without Curry coming back. Just saying. Without his clutch ability to sink shots and draw attention on the offensive side of the ball, they would have easily lost the last two games of the series with the way they were going.

Also, you act like Curry being the the floor has no effect on what other teams are forced to do defensively. Warriors don't get anywhere close to 73 wins this year without Curry and they sure as hell don't win a championship last year without him either.

I didn't so curry is a bad player or isn't a difference maker. He's an elite player and of course hes important to their lineup. But the Warriors hung tough against a very good Portland team without him. Maybe the blazers pull it off against golden state without curry. But they were good enough to keep it at least close. They are a legit playoff team even without him. The Cavs have repeatedly shown that their team is a complete mess when they don't have LeBron.

It's not a knock on curry. We're talking best on the game here. Trust me, I'm not a LeBron apologist by any stretch. But even if I don't like him that much, I can appreciate how much of a difference maker he is

[-King-]

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

Here's what it boils down to for me. There's a few snapshots in the playoffs/finals that tells a story about how important these players are to their team.

First, the Cavs are 4-13 the past 2 seasons with Lebron out. The Warriors were 4-2 without Curry in playoff games.

Second, the finals last year was an interesting snapshot. Lebron had maybe the highest usage rate in playoff history and winded up having a monster series. Not figuratively... but literally, he was the only guy on the entire Cavs team making any shots (Kyrie/Love were out, JR smith had a horrendous series, Shumpert was playing at 50%, Mozgov/Tristan/Delly aren't scorers). The Cavs ran the entire offense through Lebron including having him play PG. Meanwhile, the Cavs doubled Curry/Klay all series long. He was neutralized until game 5 when Iguodala started hitting open shots. Moral of the story? Curry beats you because if you put more attention on him, they have unbelievable shooters even at both Forward positions who can hit shots.

So the question is, if you put Curry in a finals series with Dellavadova, Tristan Thompson, Mozgov, and JR Smith as your supporting cast... how would he do? That's where I see Lebron with the clear advantage.

Maybe he would score 45ppg. I wouldn't put it past him.
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[PAChiefsGuy]

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

I didn't so curry is a bad player or isn't a difference maker. He's an elite player and of course hes important to their lineup. But the Warriors hung tough against a very good Portland team without him. Maybe the blazers pull it off against golden state without curry. But they were good enough to keep it at least close. They are a legit playoff team even without him. The Cavs have repeatedly shown that their team is a complete mess when they don't have LeBron.

It's not a knock on curry. We're talking best on the game here. Trust me, I'm not a LeBron apologist by any stretch. But even if I don't like him that much, I can appreciate how much of a difference maker he is

A very good Portland team? They went 44-38... The only reason they made it to the 2nd round was because the Clippers had injuries to their two best players. They definitely are not a bad team but saying they are "really good," is an exaggeration...

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by -King-

Maybe he would score 45ppg. I wouldn't put it past him.
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How did he do in the finals last year when the Cavs doubled him up and took away his outside shot? He was good but not curry good. He went off once iguodola started hitting open 3s and the Cavs had to back off of him. He has a supporting vast that makes it impossible to put any extra attention on him, especially when you have an elite spacer like draymond.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by PAChiefsGuy

A very good Portland team? They went 44-38... The only reason they made it to the 2nd round was because the Clippers had injuries to their two best players. They definitely are not a bad team but saying they are "really good," is an exaggeration...

They are a playoff team in the West. They are better than any team in the east that's not the Cavs. It's not at all an exaggeration to call them very good especially the way they were shooting all series.

[KC_Connection]

A few things:

There's one aspect of basketball that Curry is better at than LeBron and it's a pretty important thing (shooting the basketball). LeBron is better at everything else by a significant margin over him, even 3 years past his prime. Also, the idea that Curry is even an average defender is being pretty kind to him if you have even spent one game watching him. He's lucky that he plays with a group of good team defenders that allow him to be hidden on the opponent's worst offensive player each game or he'd be even more exposed in that regard.

As weak as the West has become, the Golden State Warriors also might even be a 60 win team without Curry. As much as I hate him, Draymond Green has developed himself into one of the best players in the league over the last year (he probably should have won Most Improved, not McCollum). With him leading them under Kerr's disciplined system full of great two-way players, it's likely that only the Spurs and Thunder would be better than them.

The Cavs, on the other hand, turn into a relative joke whenever LeBron is off the floor. The plus/minus numbers throughout the season and into the playoffs have been just incredible in that regard. If LeBron somehow got hurt over the next week, we could see a team as bad as the Heat or Raptors in the NBA Finals. Does that make him the "most valuable player?" I suppose that depends on how you define that award, but I tend to think it should still go to the best player during the regular season (which would mean that LeBron should have won about eight of them and that Curry should win this year).

[KC_Connection]

Originally Posted by -King-

Spoelstra is 1 game away from reaching the eastern conference finals.
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So is Dwane Casey.

[-King-]

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

How did he do in the finals last year when the Cavs doubled him up and took away his outside shot? He was good but not curry good. He went off once iguodola started hitting open 3s and the Cavs had to back off of him. He has a supporting vast that makes it impossible to put any extra attention on him, especially when you have an elite spacer like draymond.

He had a bad series. LeBron also had a series in which he scored 17ppg. So what? We know Curry is capable of scoring 45 per game if needed so I wouldn't doubt he would do it if it came to that.
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[-King-]

Originally Posted by KC_Connection

A few things:

There's one aspect of basketball that Curry is better at than LeBron and it's a pretty important thing (shooting the basketball). LeBron is better at everything else by a significant margin over him, even 3 years past his prime. Also, the idea that Curry is even an average defender is being pretty kind to him if you have even spent one game watching him. He's lucky that he plays with a group of good team defenders that allow him to be hidden on the opponent's worst offensive player each game or he'd be even more exposed in that regard.

As weak as the West has become, the Golden State Warriors also might even be a 60 win team without Curry. As much as I hate him, Draymond Green has developed himself into one of the best players in the league over the last year (he probably should have won Most Improved, not McCollum). With him leading them under Kerr's disciplined system full of great two-way players, it's likely that only the Spurs and Thunder would be better than them.

The Cavs, on the other hand, turn into a relative joke whenever LeBron is off the floor. The plus/minus numbers throughout the season and into the playoffs have been just incredible in that regard. If LeBron somehow got hurt over the next week, we could see a team as bad as the Heat or Raptors in the NBA Finals. Does that make him the "most valuable player?" I suppose that depends on how you define that award, but I tend to think it should still go to the best player during the regular season (which would mean that LeBron should have won about eight of them and that Curry should win this year).

Win shares disagrees with you. I know how much you love win shares and think they're gospel.
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[KC_Connection]

Originally Posted by -King-

Win shares disagrees with you. I know how much you love win shares and think they're gospel.
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Offensive win shares, sure (which is partly why Curry deserves the MVP in my mind). I know how much you hate LeBron because he supplanted Kobe, but there's no denying his enormous impact on the Cavs this season.

[-King-]

Originally Posted by KC_Connection

Offensive win shares, sure (which is partly why Curry deserves the MVP in my mind). I know how much you hate LeBron because he supplanted Kobe, but there's no denying his enormous impact on the Cavs this season.

No. Not just offensive win shares. Win shares period.

Last year Curry was 3rd in win shares and LeBron was 11th.

This year Curry was 1st in win shares and LeBron was 5th.

And I don't hate LeBron. It's weird why you always say that.

[New World Order]

Originally Posted by KC_Connection

A few things:

There's one aspect of basketball that Curry is better at than LeBron and it's a pretty important thing (shooting the basketball). LeBron is better at everything else by a significant margin over him, even 3 years past his prime. Also, the idea that Curry is even an average defender is being pretty kind to him if you have even spent one game watching him. He's lucky that he plays with a group of good team defenders that allow him to be hidden on the opponent's worst offensive player each game or he'd be even more exposed in that regard.

As weak as the West has become, the Golden State Warriors also might even be a 60 win team without Curry. As much as I hate him, Draymond Green has developed himself into one of the best players in the league over the last year (he probably should have won Most Improved, not McCollum). With him leading them under Kerr's disciplined system full of great two-way players, it's likely that only the Spurs and Thunder would be better than them.

The Cavs, on the other hand, turn into a relative joke whenever LeBron is off the floor. The plus/minus numbers throughout the season and into the playoffs have been just incredible in that regard. If LeBron somehow got hurt over the next week, we could see a team as bad as the Heat or Raptors in the NBA Finals. Does that make him the "most valuable player?" I suppose that depends on how you define that award, but I tend to think it should still go to the best player during the regular season (which would mean that LeBron should have won about eight of them and that Curry should win this year).

Are you rooting for Miami tomorrow?

They are going to lock up your boy Derozan if they go to the east finals.

[KC_Connection]

Originally Posted by -King-

No. Not just offensive win shares. Win shares period.

Last year Curry was 3rd in sin shares and LeBron was 11th.

This year Curry was 1st in win shares and LeBron was 5th.

What exactly do you think I'm disputing here? I already said Curry was the better regular season player. LeBron doesn't even try during the regular seasons these days.

[KC_Connection]

Originally Posted by New World Order

Are you rooting for Miami tomorrow?

They are going to lock up your boy Derozan if they go to the east finals.

I'll be at the game and mostly indifferent to the outcome, like I've been the entire series. It's hard to root for a stupid team that allows a scrub like Demar DeRozan to hold them hostage. The NBA/ESPN are clearly pushing for the Heat in the next round, so it would not be a surprise to see the Raptors go down even at home.

[-King-]

Originally Posted by KC_Connection

What exactly do you think I'm disputing here? I already said Curry was the better regular season player. LeBron doesn't even try during the regular seasons these days.

Curry was the leader in playoff win shares last year even with the average finals performance.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/..._yearly_p.html
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