The official Eric Fisher thread take 2

[Bufkin]

Since the original one was deleted due to posting overload, let's try this again.

[O.city]

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

If he improves at left tackle the way he did on the right side last year, he could easily be a passable starter. If he's a passable starter, he'll be in the league. He's the 19th highest paid left tackle in the league right now.

So?

Passable starter is terrible for where he was drafted and what he was sold as, by the front office.

Are we now settling for passable starter from the highest and most valuable pick the franchise has ever had?

Maybe it's just me, but I think there should be a higher standard.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by O.city

It's not really the only point.

It goes deeper than that. If he doesn't live up to the pick, it speaks massively to the ineptitude that is the Front Office in the drafting and stocking of the roster with players.

The front office made a lot of bad moves in 2013, but most of the moves in 2014 seem consistent with Dorsey's philosophy he learned from Ted Thompson. I feel that 2014 is much more representative of what we have in a front office than last year. I'm much more interested to see how the 2014 class performs. I've already put Fisher in my rear view mirror.

[Tombstone RJ]

I think Fisher, long term, is going to be a solid LT. The kc oline is just going through a lot of changes in a short amount of time. Ultimately I think it will be ok as Reid has always had (from what I remember in his Philly days) solid olines. Where Reid is a moron is his refusal to run the friggen ball instead of passing it 40+ times a game.

[O.city]

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

The front office made a lot of bad moves in 2013, but most of the moves in 2014 seem consistent with Dorsey's philosophy he learned from Ted Thompson. I feel that 2014 is much more representative of what we have in a front office than last year. I'm much more interested to see how the 2014 class performs. I've already put Fisher in my rear view mirror.

It's still too early to judge a draft class, even from last year, but it really doesn't matter. It's more of an expectation kind of thing with Fisher.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by O.city

So?

Passable starter is terrible for where he was drafted and what he was sold as, by the front office.

Are we now settling for passable starter from the highest and most valuable pick the franchise has ever had?

Maybe it's just me, but I think there should be a higher standard.

No. We're not rating the quality of the pick. It was a terrible pick. But the fact is, on CP, most people would have been okay with not re-signing Albert and Donald Stephenson starting at left tackle because the team didn't take a big step back. So if Fisher plays the same level as Stephenson, then CP should feel like this o-line didn't take a big step back.

Of course I would hope that Fisher improves much more than being passable. But that's not what we're arguing here. I'm arguing against comments (yours included) that he doesn't belong in this league based on how he's playing right now. That is a MUCH different comment than asking if he lived up to his pick.

[O.city]

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

No. We're not rating the quality of the pick. It was a terrible pick. But the fact is, on CP, most people would have been okay with not re-signing Albert and Donald Stephenson starting at left tackle because the team didn't take a big step back. So if Fisher plays the same level as Stephenson, then CP should feel like this o-line didn't take a big step back.

Of course I would hope that Fisher improves much more than being passable. But that's not what we're arguing here. I'm arguing against comments (yours included) that he doesn't belong in this league based on how he's playing right now. That is a MUCH different comment than asking if he lived up to his pick.

Up to this point, he's a below average LT. For the first overall pick of the draft, thats terrible.

Of course there are other factors which may be out of his control that are influencing that (injuries etc) but up to this point, it's pretty hard to argue that he's starter level LT type player.

[OldSchool]

Fisher has great athleticism but average, at best, power. He hasn't gotten back the strong punch that he showed in college and throughout the draft process, which is why Hardy seemed to just shrug him off like he was nothing a few times in the game. He also isn't very technically sound with his feet yet and sometimes stays rooted when he should be moving them to stay in front of the DE.

Jumping from the MAC straight to the NFL was a huge leap in not only physical abilities, but technical levels too. It was always going to take a couple of year before Fisher could become a solid LT, and likely 4 before he can really be considered a franchise LT, if he ever gets there.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by O.city

Up to this point, he's a below average LT. For the first overall pick of the draft, thats terrible.

Of course there are other factors which may be out of his control that are influencing that (injuries etc) but up to this point, it's pretty hard to argue that he's starter level LT type player.

"Up to this point" is 2 preseason games and the coaching acknowledges that early on, he may have some issues with his shoulder he'll have to work out. I certainly think he can play Stephenson level left tackle by mid-season, and if he can spend next season with a healthy shoulder to add much needed bulk, could continue to improve. I think there are plenty of reasons to think he could become a starter level LT. But not if people think it's going to happen in his second preseason game.

[O.city]

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

"Up to this point" is 2 preseason games and the coaching acknowledges that early on, he may have some issues with his shoulder he'll have to work out. I certainly think he can play Stephenson level left tackle by mid-season, and if he can spend next season with a healthy shoulder to add much needed bulk, could continue to improve. I think there are plenty of reasons to think he could become a starter level LT. But not if people think it's going to happen in his second preseason game.

This is where we differ in our expectations then.

He was the first overall pick in the draft. Basically, I expect there to be a short learning curve and yes, him to be a starter level LT basically right away.

[O.city]

Originally Posted by OldSchool

Fisher has great athleticism but average, at best, power. He hasn't gotten back the strong punch that he showed in college and throughout the draft process, which is why Hardy seemed to just shrug him off like he was nothing a few times in the game. He also isn't very technically sound with his feet yet and sometimes stays rooted when he should be moving them to stay in front of the DE.

Jumping from the MAC straight to the NFL was a huge leap in not only physical abilities, but technical levels too. It was always going to take a couple of year before Fisher could become a solid LT, and likely 4 before he can really be considered a franchise LT, if he ever gets there.

Basically, it was a terrible draft pick.

[Red Dawg]

Originally Posted by O.city

This is where we differ in our expectations then.

He was the first overall pick in the draft. Basically, I expect there to be a short learning curve and yes, him to be a starter level LT basically right away.

I agree. He should not have performed so shitty at this point. He should be solid and he looks awful.

[OldSchool]

Originally Posted by O.city

Basically, it was a terrible draft pick.

Dorsey rolled the dice and bet on our Coaching staff to get him up to snuff sooner rather than later. Dorsey is always going to go with the athletic upside if his choice comes down to picking between two players, thus Fisher over the more pro-ready but lower ceiling Joeckel.

[O.city]

Originally Posted by OldSchool

Dorsey rolled the dice and bet on our Coaching staff to get him up to snuff sooner rather than later. Dorsey is always going to go with the athletic upside if his choice comes down to picking between two players, thus Fisher over the more pro-ready but lower ceiling Joeckel.

Again, it's alot easier to just say

"It was a shitty pick" . Save yourself some trouble.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by O.city

This is where we differ in our expectations then.

He was the first overall pick in the draft. Basically, I expect there to be a short learning curve and yes, him to be a starter level LT basically right away.

I don't get why his draft position affects our grade for him as a 'can he start in this league' left tackle.

Yes, if we are talking about the 1.1,he is miles away from living up to the draft position and I don't think he will be even close. But you made a comment that the way he's played, he won't be in the league by 25. Not only do I think he will be in this league, he will probably earn a job as a starter. But not if the req is that he has to play like a top 5 pick to earn his job. That's silly.

Right now, I am not evaluating him based on draft position. I am evaluating him like the 19th highest paid left tackle. I don't see why he couldn't live up to that this year.

[OldSchool]

Originally Posted by O.city

Again, it's alot easier to just say

"It was a shitty pick" . Save yourself some trouble.

Or we shouldn't really judge a pick until their 3rd season, 1st overall or not? It sucks that Fisher hasn't been consistently good or solid right away, but that's not a reason to write him off completely already.