The Combine's Here, Bitch! - Page 42

CleveSteve · 02-26-2014, 08:38 AM

Here are my takeaways from the DB Drills:

http://www.cornerblitz.com/2014/Combine/DB.aspx

Defensive Back drills are my favorite event at the NFL Scouting Combine. I think you can learn more about the DBs in positional drills at the event than you can at any other position, short of maybe the medical or the team interviews (which obviously we as fans are not privvy to.) Seeing the way the participants react and move without contact best-translates, in my opinion, to the product seen on the field. Very little contact is permitted for these players, so as a defender, raw change-of-direction skills are paramount.

The Tuesday combine coverage started off with contradictions: Mike Mayock questioning whether Darqueze Dennard would be able to show the sub-4.5 speed he would need to justify a top pick, then the statistic was given that last year's average time was a 4.49. He stated Dennard had everything else you look for in a corner but needed to show better-than-average speed. Deion Sanders is celebrating his 25th-Combine Anniversary and stated "for corners... the 40 is everything. You have to run a 4.4." The NFL Network then showed a graphic with "notable CB 40 times", showing Pro Bowlers Brandon Flowers (4.55), Richard Sherman (4.60), and Joe Haden (4.62) all running well outside 4.4 range. Of course, that's not to say that speed doesn't matter, but it's far from the most-important skills on display for the DBs at the combine. The thing about the 40, is that a defensive back is never going to run a 40 unless he's on special teams or he's already been burned and he's trying to chase a player down. The most important thing for a DB is, again, change-of-direction.

Defensive Backs: Group 1

Florida State Free Safety Terrence Brooks ran a terrific 40 . Mike Mayock commented on Brooks, saying "I've got a second round grade on him, with an arrow pointing up." When Deion asked Rich Eisen if he also had an arrow, Mayock reiterated "I've gotta tell you... the arrow is pointing up." We get it, Mike... Brooks showed well in drills throughout the day.

Ross Cockrell of Duke really helped himself with a terrific 40 time in the low 4.4s. Most prognosticators have him as a 4th round pick, and if a team can pick him up there, they've got themselves a steal. I think he's a second-round talent. He was high in his backpedal all day.

Michigan State's Darqueze Dennard answered Mike Mayock's reservations with a 4.42 40 time. He stumbled pretty clearly in transition out of his backpedal, though. That's one thing I noticed about Dennard is that he doesn't backpedal in games, rather choosing to play press off the line and turn immediately.

Kyle Fuller of Virginia Tech, whom I agree with Mayock is a first-round talent, ran a 4.40 40 time.

Justin Gilbert of Oklahoma State clocked in at 4.35 unofficially. Mayock showed a very nice brief breakdown of Gilbert's body control and change-of-direction and said he is likely the first DB to be taken in the upcoming draft. Gilbert backpedaled and transitioned well, but as my wife said "he's got a goofy hand thing going on." Gilbert later made a spectacular, natural snatch catch in drills while covering deep in drills.

Vanderbilt's Andre Hal also ran in the low 4.4s. Hal is a guy with terrific ball skills and good ability to play in zone, but for some reason is not a good man cover corner. He lets receivers get right into him and turns too late. I think that can be coached, though, and he can become a regular contributor. Most projections have him in the 6th or 7th round, which would represent great value if the team is willing to coach him up.

Lindenwood's Pierre Desir is one of the more interesting defensive back prospects in that his skill floor and ceiling are so far apart. He is huge with a long wingspan and ran a 4.52 40 yard dash. He transitioned extremely well for his size in the backpedal-and-go drill. He showed hot and cold at the Shrine Game and Senior Bowl. A team with an extra pick in the 3rd or 4th round could do well to gamble on him.

Rice's Phillip Gaines timed the fastest of all the DBs in the first group, checking in at 4.34 unofficial times twice. He also covers a lot of ground in his backpedal. Very smooth in drills. He was clearly the most capable and prepared in executing the drills.

Clemson's Bashaud Breeland showed a very smooth flip in the backpedal-and-go drill.

Safety Deone Bucannon of Washington State stumbled a little in transition from backpedal in drills after running a good time in the 40.

Virginia Tech's Antone Exum is clumsy backpedaling and turning.

Wyoming's Marqueston Huff was too high in his backpedal and looked like he might trip. He didn't time his jumps well and didn't catch the ball.

Ha Ha Clinton-Dix of Alabama showed good speed but was somewhat awkward in drills.

Victor Hampton of South Carolina performed really well in drills, especially the deep cover drill. He is completely ripped and looks like he can make a real mess in the defensive backfield.

Jonathon Dowling of Western Kentucky showed terrific ball skills, actually understanding and putting into practice the concept of "high-pointing" the ball, extending back behind his head to make a terrific catch at full extension.

Ahmad Brooks of Baylor showed pretty poor footwork, but his game is more reacting to the play than man coverage skills.

The throwing quarerbacks during the DB drills were terrible.

Defensive Backs: Group 2

Stanley Jean-Baptiste of Nebraska ran a 4.53. He has been the focus of a lot of the draft season coverage for the defensive secondary due to his 6'2 5/8" height and the success that Seattle has had with tall corners. He didn't get low in his backpedal, which essentially eliminates its usefulness. The purpose of a defensive back's backpedal is not to help them see the play, it is to allow them to plant and drive to the ball if the receiver breaks a route in front of them or if the ball is thrown in front of them. He did do a better job on his second run through the transition drill.

Immediately following Jean-Baptiste was NC State's Dontae Johnson, a 6'2" corner who ran a 4.45. Johnson showed some superior agility to Jean-Baptiste.

Florida State's Lamarcus Joyner isn't winning any contests with measurables. At 5'8" running a 4.53 isn't going to help him, but the guy just makes huge plays when the game starts. He reminds me a lot of Tyrann Mathieu in terms of his knack for creating in the defensive secondary without being a crazy person. Mike Mayock had the identical comparison on the broadcast. Joyner seems to have some really long arms. He moves very fluidly through positional drills.

Keith McGill of Utah ran terrific 40s at 6'3 1/2" at 4.47 and 4.44. He will probably get drafted in the top 75 on measureables and athleticism alone. Hos long legs did start to get a little clumsy in the deep cover drill.

Louchiez Purifoy of Florida exploded out of the blocks on the 40, but was a bit out of control and only managed a 4.55. He was also out of control in the backpedal drill.

Marcus Roberson of Florida turned up disappointing 40 times of a 4.66 and a 4.59. Both of the highly-rated Florida corners showed poorly. They've looked good every time I've seen them play, but in this apples-to-apples athleticism comparison, they looked plain bad.

Maine's Kendall James overcame some nervousness to show decent transition skills in positional drills.

Jason Verrett leans back in his backpedal, which again eliminates its usefulness. He was a grabby player at TCU and typically was in follow coverage, so it's not very natural for him. He did run a fast 40 at 4.38.

Calvin Pryor of Louisville, considered by many to be the top safety in the class had problems with his long speed in the deep cover drill. Pryor also had trouble coming forward out of his bakpedal with all that weight he carries around. While only listed at 207, he looks really bulky. He is not going to be a good centerfielder in the NFL.

htismaqe · 02-26-2014, 08:47 AM

Dontae Johnson made some money this weekend.

CleveSteve · 02-26-2014, 08:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by htismaqe

Dontae Johnson made some money this weekend.

Yeah I agree.

OldSchool · 02-26-2014, 11:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by htismaqe

Dontae Johnson made some money this weekend.

He got beat repeatedly in coverage when they faced Clemson's WR core. Didn't matter if it was Watkins, Bryant, or one of their freshmen. Johnson just looked bad and was always late getting out of his pedal. Really flat footed. He was fine most of the time when he had to make a play in front of him, but he got burned repeatedly on routes that went past 10 yards.

htismaqe · 02-26-2014, 11:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OldSchool

He got beat repeatedly in coverage when they faced Clemson's WR core. Didn't matter if it was Watkins, Bryant, or one of their freshmen. Johnson just looked bad and was always late getting out of his pedal. Really flat footed. He was fine most of the time when he had to make a play in front of him, but he got burned repeatedly on routes that went past 10 yards.

Right. But he's 6.2 and ran a sub-4.5. He probably raised his stock a full round.

OldSchool · 02-26-2014, 12:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by htismaqe

Right. But he's 6.2 and ran a sub-4.5. He probably raised his stock a full round.

I think teams are looking at him as a FS because he is a lot better playing with everything in front of him than in a trail technique. He just doesn't have the make-up speed on tape unless the QB underthrows the ball or floats it.

CleveSteve · 02-26-2014, 12:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OldSchool

He got beat repeatedly in coverage when they faced Clemson's WR core. Didn't matter if it was Watkins, Bryant, or one of their freshmen. Johnson just looked bad and was always late getting out of his pedal. Really flat footed. He was fine most of the time when he had to make a play in front of him, but he got burned repeatedly on routes that went past 10 yards.

Cool, thanks for the info.

That being said, Bryant and Watkins are both studs. Still, you have to be able to hold up against studs every week in the NFL.

OldSchool · 02-26-2014, 01:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CleveSteve

Cool, thanks for the info.

That being said, Bryant and Watkins are both studs. Still, you have to be able to hold up against studs every week in the NFL.

Yeah, I know. I'm just saying that he'll get burned by the TY Hiltons of this league just as badly as our DBs were.

saphojunkie · 02-26-2014, 01:00 PM

Why don't they make DB's run the forty backwards for the first split?

OldSchool · 02-26-2014, 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by saphojunkie

Why don't they make DB's run the forty backwards for the first split?

I think they time the backpedal and flip drill, just not with official timers.

Jakemall · 02-26-2014, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OldSchool

I think they time the backpedal and flip drill, just not with official timers.

I didn't realize they timed those.

It'd still be useful to have a 30 yard dash version of the drill so you could see how quickly they get up to speed out of the flip.

OldSchool · 02-26-2014, 01:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jakemall

I didn't realize they timed those.

It'd still be useful to have a 30 yard dash version of the drill so you could see how quickly they get up to speed out of the flip.

For us armchair GMs, yeah, lol. You could always try to use your own timer and time it with whatever is on the feed.

Jakemall · 02-26-2014, 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by saphojunkie

Why don't they make DB's run the forty backwards for the first split?

I think everyone should wear gear (standard weights by position).

I'd be okay with having DBs run a 30 yard dash where they start backwards and have to turn after 10 yards. It'd be even better if they had to turn both ways and they run it twice.

I think it would be in addition to the 40 which is useful for other things.

saphojunkie · 02-26-2014, 04:19 PM

But seriously, why isn't that an official timing thing? I don't care how much fluidity their hips appear to have if they can't get back up to speed after they turn.

OldSchool · 02-26-2014, 08:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by saphojunkie

But seriously, why isn't that an official timing thing? I don't care how much fluidity their hips appear to have if they can't get back up to speed after they turn.

It's pretty much just an eye test, no need to put a timer on it. You have film to go off of as well.

02-26-2014, 08:38 AM	#1
CleveSteve Veteran Join Date: Mar 2013 Location: Pflugerville, TX Casino cash: $10010636	Here are my takeaways from the DB Drills: http://www.cornerblitz.com/2014/Combine/DB.aspx Defensive Back drills are my favorite event at the NFL Scouting Combine. I think you can learn more about the DBs in positional drills at the event than you can at any other position, short of maybe the medical or the team interviews (which obviously we as fans are not privvy to.) Seeing the way the participants react and move without contact best-translates, in my opinion, to the product seen on the field. Very little contact is permitted for these players, so as a defender, raw change-of-direction skills are paramount. The Tuesday combine coverage started off with contradictions: Mike Mayock questioning whether Darqueze Dennard would be able to show the sub-4.5 speed he would need to justify a top pick, then the statistic was given that last year's average time was a 4.49. He stated Dennard had everything else you look for in a corner but needed to show better-than-average speed. Deion Sanders is celebrating his 25th-Combine Anniversary and stated "for corners... the 40 is everything. You have to run a 4.4." The NFL Network then showed a graphic with "notable CB 40 times", showing Pro Bowlers Brandon Flowers (4.55), Richard Sherman (4.60), and Joe Haden (4.62) all running well outside 4.4 range. Of course, that's not to say that speed doesn't matter, but it's far from the most-important skills on display for the DBs at the combine. The thing about the 40, is that a defensive back is never going to run a 40 unless he's on special teams or he's already been burned and he's trying to chase a player down. The most important thing for a DB is, again, change-of-direction. Defensive Backs: Group 1 Florida State Free Safety Terrence Brooks ran a terrific 40 . Mike Mayock commented on Brooks, saying "I've got a second round grade on him, with an arrow pointing up." When Deion asked Rich Eisen if he also had an arrow, Mayock reiterated "I've gotta tell you... the arrow is pointing up." We get it, Mike... Brooks showed well in drills throughout the day. Ross Cockrell of Duke really helped himself with a terrific 40 time in the low 4.4s. Most prognosticators have him as a 4th round pick, and if a team can pick him up there, they've got themselves a steal. I think he's a second-round talent. He was high in his backpedal all day. Michigan State's Darqueze Dennard answered Mike Mayock's reservations with a 4.42 40 time. He stumbled pretty clearly in transition out of his backpedal, though. That's one thing I noticed about Dennard is that he doesn't backpedal in games, rather choosing to play press off the line and turn immediately. Kyle Fuller of Virginia Tech, whom I agree with Mayock is a first-round talent, ran a 4.40 40 time. Justin Gilbert of Oklahoma State clocked in at 4.35 unofficially. Mayock showed a very nice brief breakdown of Gilbert's body control and change-of-direction and said he is likely the first DB to be taken in the upcoming draft. Gilbert backpedaled and transitioned well, but as my wife said "he's got a goofy hand thing going on." Gilbert later made a spectacular, natural snatch catch in drills while covering deep in drills. Vanderbilt's Andre Hal also ran in the low 4.4s. Hal is a guy with terrific ball skills and good ability to play in zone, but for some reason is not a good man cover corner. He lets receivers get right into him and turns too late. I think that can be coached, though, and he can become a regular contributor. Most projections have him in the 6th or 7th round, which would represent great value if the team is willing to coach him up. Lindenwood's Pierre Desir is one of the more interesting defensive back prospects in that his skill floor and ceiling are so far apart. He is huge with a long wingspan and ran a 4.52 40 yard dash. He transitioned extremely well for his size in the backpedal-and-go drill. He showed hot and cold at the Shrine Game and Senior Bowl. A team with an extra pick in the 3rd or 4th round could do well to gamble on him. Rice's Phillip Gaines timed the fastest of all the DBs in the first group, checking in at 4.34 unofficial times twice. He also covers a lot of ground in his backpedal. Very smooth in drills. He was clearly the most capable and prepared in executing the drills. Clemson's Bashaud Breeland showed a very smooth flip in the backpedal-and-go drill. Safety Deone Bucannon of Washington State stumbled a little in transition from backpedal in drills after running a good time in the 40. Virginia Tech's Antone Exum is clumsy backpedaling and turning. Wyoming's Marqueston Huff was too high in his backpedal and looked like he might trip. He didn't time his jumps well and didn't catch the ball. Ha Ha Clinton-Dix of Alabama showed good speed but was somewhat awkward in drills. Victor Hampton of South Carolina performed really well in drills, especially the deep cover drill. He is completely ripped and looks like he can make a real mess in the defensive backfield. Jonathon Dowling of Western Kentucky showed terrific ball skills, actually understanding and putting into practice the concept of "high-pointing" the ball, extending back behind his head to make a terrific catch at full extension. Ahmad Brooks of Baylor showed pretty poor footwork, but his game is more reacting to the play than man coverage skills. The throwing quarerbacks during the DB drills were terrible. Defensive Backs: Group 2 Stanley Jean-Baptiste of Nebraska ran a 4.53. He has been the focus of a lot of the draft season coverage for the defensive secondary due to his 6'2 5/8" height and the success that Seattle has had with tall corners. He didn't get low in his backpedal, which essentially eliminates its usefulness. The purpose of a defensive back's backpedal is not to help them see the play, it is to allow them to plant and drive to the ball if the receiver breaks a route in front of them or if the ball is thrown in front of them. He did do a better job on his second run through the transition drill. Immediately following Jean-Baptiste was NC State's Dontae Johnson, a 6'2" corner who ran a 4.45. Johnson showed some superior agility to Jean-Baptiste. Florida State's Lamarcus Joyner isn't winning any contests with measurables. At 5'8" running a 4.53 isn't going to help him, but the guy just makes huge plays when the game starts. He reminds me a lot of Tyrann Mathieu in terms of his knack for creating in the defensive secondary without being a crazy person. Mike Mayock had the identical comparison on the broadcast. Joyner seems to have some really long arms. He moves very fluidly through positional drills. Keith McGill of Utah ran terrific 40s at 6'3 1/2" at 4.47 and 4.44. He will probably get drafted in the top 75 on measureables and athleticism alone. Hos long legs did start to get a little clumsy in the deep cover drill. Louchiez Purifoy of Florida exploded out of the blocks on the 40, but was a bit out of control and only managed a 4.55. He was also out of control in the backpedal drill. Marcus Roberson of Florida turned up disappointing 40 times of a 4.66 and a 4.59. Both of the highly-rated Florida corners showed poorly. They've looked good every time I've seen them play, but in this apples-to-apples athleticism comparison, they looked plain bad. Maine's Kendall James overcame some nervousness to show decent transition skills in positional drills. Jason Verrett leans back in his backpedal, which again eliminates its usefulness. He was a grabby player at TCU and typically was in follow coverage, so it's not very natural for him. He did run a fast 40 at 4.38. Calvin Pryor of Louisville, considered by many to be the top safety in the class had problems with his long speed in the deep cover drill. Pryor also had trouble coming forward out of his bakpedal with all that weight he carries around. While only listed at 207, he looks really bulky. He is not going to be a good centerfielder in the NFL.
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02-26-2014, 08:47 AM	#2
htismaqe 'Tis my eye! Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Chiefsplanet Casino cash: $10269900	Dontae Johnson made some money this weekend.
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02-26-2014, 01:00 PM	#9
saphojunkie MVP Join Date: Aug 2011 Casino cash: $4596550	Why don't they make DB's run the forty backwards for the first split?
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02-26-2014, 04:19 PM	#14
saphojunkie MVP Join Date: Aug 2011 Casino cash: $4596550	But seriously, why isn't that an official timing thing? I don't care how much fluidity their hips appear to have if they can't get back up to speed after they turn.
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