Chiefs Kansas City Chiefs preseason first team defense: Bob Sutton's Science Lab

-King- · 08-21-2014, 07:25 PM

Kansas City Chiefs preseason first team defense: Bob Sutton's Science Lab
By Craig Stout on Aug 21 2014, 10:55a 156

The Chiefs defense was awful this week against the Panthers, and there's cause for concern ... right? Not quite. Let me bust some of those myths.

In the days following the Kansas City Chiefs' preseason loss against the Carolina Panthers, I read assessments from fans, pundits, and bloggers describing how bad the Chiefs will perform this season on the defensive side of the ball. The most common thread seemed to be the lack of a serious pass rush this week, even with new addition Dee Ford. So, instead of the usual post reviewing the performances of individual players, this week will be more of a recap, showing what the Chiefs did differently from the past, and hopefully quell some of the fears that the defense is in trouble.

Last week, I praised coach Bob Sutton for finally running a 2-4-5 defense with another coverage linebacker on the field. It helped with sideline to sideline coverage, allowed an extra man in the box (helping with run defense), and still afforded the team some short coverage without sacrificing the pass rush. Every element of that scheme changed this week. While the Panthers starters were on the field last Sunday, the Chiefs alternated between a base 3-4 defense and a 2-3-6 dime defense. I'm...less than enthusiastic about the Chiefs "auto-dime" defense, and here it was, cropping its ugly head again. But this time, somehow, it was worse:

Yes, that is Tamba Hali trailing the tight end at the bottom of your screen...and Dontari Poe is playing a short "contain" zone. The Chiefs blitzed Chris Owens and Husain Abdullah on this play, overloading the offense's right side of the line, but two of the Chiefs best three pass rushers were in coverage on the play. This was by design, a wrinkle in Bob Sutton's gameplan, because teams won't be expecting the Chiefs to drop their athletic nose tackle and speed rusher into coverage. In a regular season game, you'd see half of the team's normal pass rush in coverage once, maybe twice in a game. Not so this week. The Chiefs dropped Tamba Hali into coverage 7 times, Justin Houston into coverage 7 times, and both of them dropped into coverage together six times in one half.

There was also another circumstance that occurred a couple of times during Sunday's game, and that is shown above. As I discussed in the previous paragraph, both Tamba Hali and Justin Houston are in coverage, and the Chiefs are in their base 3-4 defense. However, the Panthers have motioned the running back out of the backfield, and they are now in a 4 WR set. One of my bigger complaints with the Chiefs defense and 3 WR sets was that the team switched to an auto-dime defense when it could have used a nickel defense. Running a base defense against a spread offense? That's an even bigger complaint. The Chiefs dropped eight men into coverage on both of these plays, flooding the secondary with bodies that aren't particularly good at pass coverage. The play shown above was an overthrow by Cam Newton to a wide open Kelvin Benjamin (who had beaten Hali and Abdullah over the top), and the second time it occurred turned into a 24 yard reception, beating Sean Smith. As pointed out by my friends and fellow AP writers Ryan Scott Hall and HisDirkness in their AHPKC podcast review of the game, there is no excuse to drop 8 into coverage if there are open players anyway. It just led to confusion in the secondary, a three man rush of Jaye Howard, Dontari Poe, and Allen Bailey (not exactly striking fear into the hearts of offensive coordinators), and ample time for any quarterback in the NFL to pick apart a defense. It just didn't work.

THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NO CHANCE THAT SUTTON CALLS THESE PACKAGES WITH ANY KIND OF FREQUENCY.

So why do I bring these things up? I haven't exactly enjoyed the packages the Chiefs put together in Week 2 of the preseason, and I'm supposed to try to make you guys feel better about the defense as a whole. Well, here it is: There is absolutely no chance that Sutton calls these packages with any kind of frequency. Bob Sutton is known as an aggressive playcaller as a defensive coordinator. He takes risks, calls blitzes, and likes to get after the passer. This week he blitzed 8 defensive backs in the first four drives, sometimes two at a time. Joe Mays was blitzed 4 times himself in one half! Sutton called these packages for almost an entire half to see what worked and what didn't this week. We all know Tamba Hali isn't great in coverage. It makes me cringe every time I see him do it, honestly. Bob Sutton knows this as well. He's not going to take his best speed rusher into coverage 15 times a game when he doesn't do it well. Because of this game, though, maybe he found a blitz or two that was more effective than the other six or seven he tried.

Nothing is a stronger argument for this (for me) than the base 3-4 against a 4 WR set. If anything, this Chiefs defense is too eager to jump into a dime package when an extra WR hits the field. What those two calls told me was that Sutton wants to get caught with the base personnel on the field to see what happens. Do the players recognize it and shift? (Answer: they do - Abdullah was getting everyone organized before the snap) Is there mass confusion with who is covering whom? (Answer: 100 percent yes) These are things that can be practiced to an extent, but really can't be tested until it is a live situation ... and tested they were. Even more convincing: after the Panthers starting offense came off the field, the Chiefs immediately switched to a nickel defense in their sub package. They even ran a fun little 1-4-6 with Poe as the only down lineman, and DJ, JMJ, Hali, and Houston as the linebackers.

So, for anybody who was freaking out about the pass rush, front seven, or coverage schemes this week: fear not. Sutton may be a gambler, but he's not insane. The Chiefs got some very good experience with some blitz packages this week, and that's not something that teams normally do in the preseason. We'll see if they pay off.

http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2014/8...uttons-science

Pasta Little Brioni · 08-21-2014, 07:30 PM

Never understood the freaking out either way over a preseason game.

**BossChief** · 08-21-2014, 07:37 PM

I'd be pissed if he showed a bunch of blitz packages in preseason.

Save that for the regular season.

Please

Mr. Laz · 08-21-2014, 08:01 PM

Is Sutton related to Goonther?

John Dope · 08-21-2014, 08:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pasta Giant Meatball

Never understood the freaking out either way over a preseason game.

Nice read. I noticed Hali and Houston dropping back more than ever. They were getting practice in coverage and everyone else was getting practice blitzing. I love it and it is just preseason practice.

Quote:

Originally Posted by -King-

Last week, I praised coach Bob Sutton for finally running a 2-4-5 defense with another coverage linebacker on the field.

They even ran a fun little 1-4-6 with Poe as the only down lineman, and DJ, JMJ, Hali, and Houston as the linebackers.

http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2014/8...uttons-science

Does anyone know if Walker was the other down linemen in the 2-3-6?

John Dope · 08-22-2014, 06:06 AM

I wonder if he is showing more with the back ups? I doubt he is purposely putting them in bad situations like he is the starters although I did see Ford drop into coverage a couple of times against Carolina.

Jimmya · 08-22-2014, 06:31 AM

Sutton sucks.

Three7s · 08-22-2014, 06:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Dope

I wonder if he is showing more with the back ups? I doubt he is purposely putting them in bad situations like he is the starters although I did see Ford drop into coverage a couple of times against Carolina.

And got burned badly.

Reerun_KC · 08-22-2014, 06:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jimmya

Sutton sucks.

Is pure hot garbage... When its all said and done he will be remembered with the likes of Crennel, Herm and GROB...

Three7s · 08-22-2014, 06:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reerun_KC

Is pure hot garbage... When its all said and done he will be remembered with the likes of Crennel, Herm and GROB...

And Gunther?

I remember all of KC pining for him at one point thinking our defense would be "fixed".

Reerun_KC · 08-22-2014, 06:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Three7s

And Gunther?

I remember all of KC pining for him at one point thinking our defense would be "fixed".

Sure, we could add Gunther in there as well... His second stint in KC was nothing short of a disaster as well...

**loochy** · 08-22-2014, 08:15 AM

Preseason: DONT WORRY GUYS CUZ VANILLA. We don't want to give away our secrets for the season.

Early season: DONT WORRY GUYS CUZ VANILLA. It's only weaker teams that we are playing. We don't want to give away secrets to our division rivals.

Mid season: DONT WORRY GUYS CUZ VANILLA. We don't want to give away secrets to potential playoff opponents.

Late season: WHY IS EVERY TEAM RUNNING UP THE SCORE ON US? Err, something is wrong with this defense.

Postseason: DEFENSE LOST THE GAME FOR US!!! OH NOES

Conclusion: Sutton is not creative and the defense has gaping holes.

OldSchool · 08-22-2014, 08:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by loochy

Preseason: DONT WORRY GUYS CUZ VANILLA. We don't want to give away our secrets for the season.

Early season: DONT WORRY GUYS CUZ VANILLA. It's only weaker teams that we are playing. We don't want to give away secrets to our division rivals.

Mid season: DONT WORRY GUYS CUZ VANILLA. We don't want to give away secrets to potential playoff opponents.

Late season: WHY IS EVERY TEAM RUNNING UP THE SCORE ON US? Err, something is wrong with this defense.

Postseason: DEFENSE LOST THE GAME FOR US!!! OH NOES

Conclusion: Sutton is not creative and the defense has gaping holes.

The stupid man coverage scheme can't be effective if we don't have at least 2 very good man cover corners or 1 dominant one while the rest have to be adequate. If we don't have those, it becomes very difficult to cover for the weaknesses on this team by scheming without changing to a primarily zone concept.

I thought that this was a copy-cat league? Why can't Sutton get with the program and employ a cover 3 scheme similar to the Seahawks to make up for our lack of dominant man cover corners?

ThaVirus · 08-22-2014, 09:24 AM

They don't have the ability to play man and likely don't have the discipline to play a zone scheme.

They just suck.

Chiefnj2 · 08-22-2014, 10:23 AM

Cooper and Gaines - 2 young players that could develop.

You wonder why Carl always went the FA route? Because KC fans don't have the patience to develop anyone. 2 preseason games in and people are bitching about Ford and Gaines.

Give them a chance to develop the players they draft/sign.

08-21-2014, 07:25 PM
-King- ▓▓▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▓▓ Join Date: Jan 2009 Casino cash: $2505743	Kansas City Chiefs preseason first team defense: Bob Sutton's Science Lab Kansas City Chiefs preseason first team defense: Bob Sutton's Science Lab By Craig Stout on Aug 21 2014, 10:55a 156 The Chiefs defense was awful this week against the Panthers, and there's cause for concern ... right? Not quite. Let me bust some of those myths. In the days following the Kansas City Chiefs' preseason loss against the Carolina Panthers, I read assessments from fans, pundits, and bloggers describing how bad the Chiefs will perform this season on the defensive side of the ball. The most common thread seemed to be the lack of a serious pass rush this week, even with new addition Dee Ford. So, instead of the usual post reviewing the performances of individual players, this week will be more of a recap, showing what the Chiefs did differently from the past, and hopefully quell some of the fears that the defense is in trouble. Last week, I praised coach Bob Sutton for finally running a 2-4-5 defense with another coverage linebacker on the field. It helped with sideline to sideline coverage, allowed an extra man in the box (helping with run defense), and still afforded the team some short coverage without sacrificing the pass rush. Every element of that scheme changed this week. While the Panthers starters were on the field last Sunday, the Chiefs alternated between a base 3-4 defense and a 2-3-6 dime defense. I'm...less than enthusiastic about the Chiefs "auto-dime" defense, and here it was, cropping its ugly head again. But this time, somehow, it was worse: Yes, that is Tamba Hali trailing the tight end at the bottom of your screen...and Dontari Poe is playing a short "contain" zone. The Chiefs blitzed Chris Owens and Husain Abdullah on this play, overloading the offense's right side of the line, but two of the Chiefs best three pass rushers were in coverage on the play. This was by design, a wrinkle in Bob Sutton's gameplan, because teams won't be expecting the Chiefs to drop their athletic nose tackle and speed rusher into coverage. In a regular season game, you'd see half of the team's normal pass rush in coverage once, maybe twice in a game. Not so this week. The Chiefs dropped Tamba Hali into coverage 7 times, Justin Houston into coverage 7 times, and both of them dropped into coverage together six times in one half. There was also another circumstance that occurred a couple of times during Sunday's game, and that is shown above. As I discussed in the previous paragraph, both Tamba Hali and Justin Houston are in coverage, and the Chiefs are in their base 3-4 defense. However, the Panthers have motioned the running back out of the backfield, and they are now in a 4 WR set. One of my bigger complaints with the Chiefs defense and 3 WR sets was that the team switched to an auto-dime defense when it could have used a nickel defense. Running a base defense against a spread offense? That's an even bigger complaint. The Chiefs dropped eight men into coverage on both of these plays, flooding the secondary with bodies that aren't particularly good at pass coverage. The play shown above was an overthrow by Cam Newton to a wide open Kelvin Benjamin (who had beaten Hali and Abdullah over the top), and the second time it occurred turned into a 24 yard reception, beating Sean Smith. As pointed out by my friends and fellow AP writers Ryan Scott Hall and HisDirkness in their AHPKC podcast review of the game, there is no excuse to drop 8 into coverage if there are open players anyway. It just led to confusion in the secondary, a three man rush of Jaye Howard, Dontari Poe, and Allen Bailey (not exactly striking fear into the hearts of offensive coordinators), and ample time for any quarterback in the NFL to pick apart a defense. It just didn't work. THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NO CHANCE THAT SUTTON CALLS THESE PACKAGES WITH ANY KIND OF FREQUENCY. So why do I bring these things up? I haven't exactly enjoyed the packages the Chiefs put together in Week 2 of the preseason, and I'm supposed to try to make you guys feel better about the defense as a whole. Well, here it is: There is absolutely no chance that Sutton calls these packages with any kind of frequency. Bob Sutton is known as an aggressive playcaller as a defensive coordinator. He takes risks, calls blitzes, and likes to get after the passer. This week he blitzed 8 defensive backs in the first four drives, sometimes two at a time. Joe Mays was blitzed 4 times himself in one half! Sutton called these packages for almost an entire half to see what worked and what didn't this week. We all know Tamba Hali isn't great in coverage. It makes me cringe every time I see him do it, honestly. Bob Sutton knows this as well. He's not going to take his best speed rusher into coverage 15 times a game when he doesn't do it well. Because of this game, though, maybe he found a blitz or two that was more effective than the other six or seven he tried. Nothing is a stronger argument for this (for me) than the base 3-4 against a 4 WR set. If anything, this Chiefs defense is too eager to jump into a dime package when an extra WR hits the field. What those two calls told me was that Sutton wants to get caught with the base personnel on the field to see what happens. Do the players recognize it and shift? (Answer: they do - Abdullah was getting everyone organized before the snap) Is there mass confusion with who is covering whom? (Answer: 100 percent yes) These are things that can be practiced to an extent, but really can't be tested until it is a live situation ... and tested they were. Even more convincing: after the Panthers starting offense came off the field, the Chiefs immediately switched to a nickel defense in their sub package. They even ran a fun little 1-4-6 with Poe as the only down lineman, and DJ, JMJ, Hali, and Houston as the linebackers. So, for anybody who was freaking out about the pass rush, front seven, or coverage schemes this week: fear not. Sutton may be a gambler, but he's not insane. The Chiefs got some very good experience with some blitz packages this week, and that's not something that teams normally do in the preseason. We'll see if they pay off. http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2014/8...uttons-science
Posts: 63,876

08-21-2014, 07:30 PM	#2
Pasta Little Brioni Consuming CP souls Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: U.S.A. Casino cash: $3998880	Never understood the freaking out either way over a preseason game.
Posts: 68,455

08-21-2014, 07:37 PM	#3
BossChief SuperBowl or bust Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: BF Iowa Casino cash: $1894088	I'd be pissed if he showed a bunch of blitz packages in preseason. Save that for the regular season. Please __________________ Dreams do come true... http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showp...postcount=1407
Posts: 47,124

08-21-2014, 08:01 PM	#4
Mr. Laz Don't Tease Me Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: KS Casino cash: $11047037	Is Sutton related to Goonther? __________________
Posts: 95,626

08-22-2014, 06:06 AM	#6
John Dope Banned Join Date: Jul 2014 Casino cash: $10009960	I wonder if he is showing more with the back ups? I doubt he is purposely putting them in bad situations like he is the starters although I did see Ford drop into coverage a couple of times against Carolina.
Posts: 1,180

08-22-2014, 06:31 AM	#7
Jimmya Veteran Join Date: Dec 2012 Casino cash: $10024530	Sutton sucks.
Posts: 2,743

08-22-2014, 08:15 AM	#12
loochy Hey Loochy, I'm hooome! Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: PooPooKaKaPeePeeShire Casino cash: $2160752	Preseason: DONT WORRY GUYS CUZ VANILLA. We don't want to give away our secrets for the season. Early season: DONT WORRY GUYS CUZ VANILLA. It's only weaker teams that we are playing. We don't want to give away secrets to our division rivals. Mid season: DONT WORRY GUYS CUZ VANILLA. We don't want to give away secrets to potential playoff opponents. Late season: WHY IS EVERY TEAM RUNNING UP THE SCORE ON US? Err, something is wrong with this defense. Postseason: DEFENSE LOST THE GAME FOR US!!! OH NOES Conclusion: Sutton is not creative and the defense has gaping holes. __________________ Hey Loochy, I'm hoooome!
Posts: 40,456

08-22-2014, 09:24 AM	#14
ThaVirus Settle this once and forever Join Date: Sep 2007 Casino cash: $2102369	They don't have the ability to play man and likely don't have the discipline to play a zone scheme. They just suck.
Posts: 44,237

08-22-2014, 10:23 AM	#15
Chiefnj2 In Search of a Life Join Date: Mar 2007 Casino cash: $7883688	Cooper and Gaines - 2 young players that could develop. You wonder why Carl always went the FA route? Because KC fans don't have the patience to develop anyone. 2 preseason games in and people are bitching about Ford and Gaines. Give them a chance to develop the players they draft/sign. __________________ Mismanaging the clock.
Posts: 22,388