Football IndyStar The Colts have no idea what they're doing - Page 8

oaklandhater · 09-10-2017, 09:23 PM

http://www.indystar.com/story/sports...ing/645793001/

The Colts have no idea what they're doing by Gregg Doyel,

LOS ANGELES – The Indianapolis Colts stink, and not just the players on the field for that 46-9 loss Sunday to the Los Angeles Rams in their 2017 NFL opener. The whole damn franchise stinks, starting with the owner and oozing downhill, as this sort of excrement tends to do.

The front office stinks. The coaching staff. The scouting department. The players? Bless their hearts, yes. The players stink, too.

A loss like this, it goes looking for people to blame and it does not go wanting. The difficulty is deciding where to start. Quarterback Scott Tolzien was terrible, but you don’t start there. Tolzien has been something less than an NFL quarterback for years, and he stayed in character Sunday from his first pass of the game: an interception the Rams returned for a touchdown. He threw a second pick-six, and flirted with a third and a fourth, before being benched for Jacoby Brissett.

Tolzien’s amateurish play Sunday – quarterback rating: 33.8 – was as predictable, if not as uncommon, as a lunar eclipse. Where were General Manager Chris Ballard and coach Chuck Pagano looking this summer when they chose Tolzien over Stephen Morris? Directly into the sun.

OK, that’s not the real answer. The real answer is even dumber.

While Morris was fabulous for a second consecutive year of preseason games, Ballard said last week that the job went to Tolzien because he was better than Morris in offseason OTAs and again in the early practices of training camp. And Pagano on Sunday said he “would never second-guess” that decision, because Chuck Pagano is nothing if not reliably prone to say things that sound blatantly untrue.

No, this loss wasn’t Tolzien’s fault, though he did try to take the blame for it. To his credit, he acknowledged that football “is a team effort, but I certainly want to own this” defeat. To Pagano’s credit, he accepted blame for this loss on multiple occasions, even as he referred to the Rams as "the 49ers." To the credit of star receiver T.Y. Hilton, who fumbled his first catch of the season as he was diving to avoid contact – read that again – he tried to take the blame as well, saying: “I fumbled. It started with me.”

Tolzien’s amateurish play Sunday – quarterback rating: 33.8 – was as predictable, if not as uncommon, as a lunar eclipse. Where were General Manager Chris Ballard and coach Chuck Pagano looking this summer when they chose Tolzien over Stephen Morris? Directly into the sun.

OK, that’s not the real answer. The real answer is even dumber.

While Morris was fabulous for a second consecutive year of preseason games, Ballard said last week that the job went to Tolzien because he was better than Morris in offseason OTAs and again in the early practices of training camp. And Pagano on Sunday said he “would never second-guess” that decision, because Chuck Pagano is nothing if not reliably prone to say things that sound blatantly untrue.

No, this loss wasn’t Tolzien’s fault, though he did try to take the blame for it. To his credit, he acknowledged that football “is a team effort, but I certainly want to own this” defeat. To Pagano’s credit, he accepted blame for this loss on multiple occasions, even as he referred to the Rams as "the 49ers." To the credit of star receiver T.Y. Hilton, who fumbled his first catch of the season as he was diving to avoid contact – read that again – he tried to take the blame as well, saying: “I fumbled. It started with me.”

Colts QBs Scott Tolzien and Jacoby Brissett talk to the media after the team's 46-9 loss to the Rams. Matt Kryger/IndyStar

Who’s right? They’re all right. A loss like this, a loss in need of a mercy rule given that one team belonged in Little League, it’s too heavy for any single set of shoulders. It falls on offensive coordinator Rob Chudzinski, who called two goal-line rushes, power running plays, with his power back – Robert Turbin – on the sideline. And after those two carries by home-run threat Marlon Mack resulted in a loss of 1 yard, Chud put in Turbin … and called for Tolzien to throw it. Rams cornerback Trumaine Johnson, who delivered the pick-six on the Colts’ first pass of the game, might’ve had another had he hung onto this amateurish toss by Tolzien.

This loss also falls on defensive coordinator Ted Monachino, who either chose converted safety T.J. Green to start and play most of the game at cornerback – or yielded that decision to Pagano, when what Monachino should have done was offer to resign before letting someone as lousy as T.J. Green undermine his defense.

And make no mistake: T.J. Green is lousy. Moved from safety midway through the preseason because all he'd consistently done there since last season was miss tackles and deliver cheap shots, Green missed a tackle early in the second quarter when Rams running back Todd Gurley was fighting for extra yardage near the goal line. With Gurley’s entire body as a target, Green went for a cheap shot – he targeted Gurley’s head – but glanced off Gurley’s helmet, allowing the Rams running back to fall forward, into the end zone for a touchdown.

Oh, and Green was in coverage on Rams receiver Cooper Kupp’s 18-yard TD catch that gave the Rams a 24-3 lead. At the NFL Scouting Combine in Indianapolis, Kupp ran the 40-yard dash in 4.62 seconds. Green ran it in 4.34 seconds. On the touchdown in question, Kupp was wide open because he was running away from Green.

Don’t ask me to explain that. Still can’t believe I saw it.

Can’t believe what happened on the Colts’ second series, either, after Tolzien completed a short pass to Marlon Mack and Mack sprinted toward the end zone. When 5-8, 190-pound Rams safety Lamarcus Joyner approached near the goal line, he nudged the 5-11, 210-pound Mack pushed out of bounds. It was a soft play by Mack, a play the Colts have become famous for in recent years as their blowout losses have mounted – and then it became something much worse.

Because Chuck Pagano didn’t challenge the official ruling that Mack was pushed out of bounds before reaching the end zone.

No, Pagano was too busy hurrying his next play onto the field – a power rush that Chudzinski gave to speed back Marlon Mack, who had just demonstrated that power is not his thing. With the Rams unable to substitute, Pagano was looking for a personnel mismatch, and he found one: His personnel was outmatched.

Pagano outsmarted himself, the only NFL coach I’ve ever seen him outsmart, and afterward said that whole sequence was on him.

And it was. But other sequences were on the defense, which put almost no pressure on Rams quarterback Jared Goff (career-best 117.9 quarterback rating) and allowed multiple Rams receivers to run wide open. The defense has been completely remade from the Colts’ 2016 opener, literally 11 new starters, which means that’s on the general manger who put the unit together. And his name isn’t Ryan Grigson.

The Colts offensive line, meanwhile, allowed four sacks and nine quarterback hits in a game where they attempted just 21 passes. It was this past week when Pagano had decided “I’ve never felt better about an offensive line,” but again, that’s what he does: He says things that simply don’t sound honest. Pushed on that piece of Pollyanna a few days ago, Pagano doubled down:

“Never felt better,” he said again. “You guys can write it. You can put it on the record and hold it to me.”

Done. And now let's move on and remember what Colts owner Jim Irsay had said this summer about the biggest problem of the Andrew Luck era: his lack of protection.

“I’m telling you,” Irsay said in June, “the offensive line is fixed.”

I'm telling you something else: The people who run this team, from the owner on down, have no idea what they’re seeing, saying or doing.

Marcellus · 09-12-2017, 07:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wazu

Kaep was good last year with garbage coaching, surrounded by garbage players.

No he wasnt, thats hyped up bullshit.

HIs QBR which is the best "stat" used for QB's was the second lowest of his career.

Half the games he played in his QBR was well below 50.

http://www.espn.com/nfl/player/gamel...lin-kaepernick

Look at these stats and tell me how you can have a passer rating of 97 in a game you lost by 13 points and had a completion % of 53%

Look at his QBR vs QB rating last season.

Marcellus · 09-12-2017, 07:44 PM

Is he better than Tolzien yea, but everyone keeps forgetting he wants starters $$$$$$.

If the talent reaches the $ he would be on a damn team.

JohnV · 09-12-2017, 08:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marcellus

No he wasnt, thats hyped up bullshit.

HIs QBR which is the best "stat" used for QB's was the second lowest of his career.

Half the games he played in his QBR was well below 50.

http://www.espn.com/nfl/player/gamel...lin-kaepernick

Look at these stats and tell me how you can have a passer rating of 97 in a game you lost by 13 points and had a completion % of 53%

Look at his QBR vs QB rating last season.

He played for an expansion team last year, and he doesn't want starter money

**RealSNR** · 09-13-2017, 02:43 AM

Nick Wright makes a convincing argument. Regardless of your feelings for Kap and what kind of distraction you believe he might be, a team that DOESN'T want to tank would do better than Scott Tolzien.

The Colts are doing what they've always done. They're selectively tanking. Don't have a healthy QB? Let's tank! This is a proclaimed great draft to have the #1 overall!

"That's just how events worked out! We're not tanking!"

Bullshit. Contract the ****ing Colts. Get them out of here. Take Jim Irsay's money and make him live as a homeless dude in Indianapolis the rest of his life.

Hoopsdoc · 09-13-2017, 04:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BryanBusby

That's reeruned. Kaep is absolutely better than Tolzien and Chud is smart enough to retool the Offense around him.

The Colts are a stupid franchise.

In a vacuum, sure he's better than Tolzien. He's not better on this team, which makes incredulous coaching blunders on the norm, and has a rookie UDFA starting at center.

There is NO WAY these fools are smart enough to build a working offense around Kap.

Hoopsdoc · 09-13-2017, 05:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RealSNR

Nick Wright makes a convincing argument. Regardless of your feelings for Kap and what kind of distraction you believe he might be, a team that DOESN'T want to tank would do better than Scott Tolzien.

The Colts are doing what they've always done. They're selectively tanking. Don't have a healthy QB? Let's tank! This is a proclaimed great draft to have the #1 overall!

"That's just how events worked out! We're not tanking!"

Bullshit. Contract the ****ing Colts. Get them out of here. Take Jim Irsay's money and make him live as a homeless dude in Indianapolis the rest of his life.

Stupid. They wouldn't be this bad if their 3 best players weren't hurt. Luck, Kelly, and V Davis all going down has killed them.

Unless they hurt them on purpose, that's not tanking.

**007** · 09-13-2017, 05:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bugeater

And on the topic, there is literally nothing bad enough that could happen to that team that would ever make me feel sorry for them. Nothing.

The only glimmer of pain I feel is for my relatives in Indy. I know how much they love them and they understand how much I loathe their team. The only reason I even care that much is because they are Chiefs fans second.

Mile High Mania · 09-13-2017, 06:15 AM

Teams do not want the baggage that comes with Kap, bottom line.

**ChiefGator** · 09-13-2017, 06:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mile High Mania

Teams do not want the baggage that comes with Kap, bottom line.

He isn't worth the baggage really. If he was Tom Brady on the field, that would be something else.

Over the last two years, he won 15% of the games he started.

Mile High Mania · 09-13-2017, 07:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChiefGator

He isn't worth the baggage really. If he was Tom Brady on the field, that would be something else.

Over the last two years, he won 15% of the games he started.

Exactly right, and this is a league that loves to rehire the journeyman stopgap QB. Guys like Brian Hoyer will make millions over 15 year careers that really are forgettable and when they're broadcasting 10 years after they retire, few will remember they actually played the game.

Kap has shown flashes of greatness, but the attitude and baggage stop any team from saying "I'll take a flyer on that guy". If he brought them a chance to win, you better believe he would be on a team.

Kap's success in SF was more about the team, not him. That doesn't mean he lacks anything to add to a team. Kap should definitely be on a roster this year, there aren't 64 QBs better than him - those that claim this are accurate. Problem is, the upside isn't there.

Hoopsdoc · 09-13-2017, 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RealSNR

Nick Wright makes a convincing argument. Regardless of your feelings for Kap and what kind of distraction you believe he might be, a team that DOESN'T want to tank would do better than Scott Tolzien.

The Colts are doing what they've always done. They're selectively tanking. Don't have a healthy QB? Let's tank! This is a proclaimed great draft to have the #1 overall!

"That's just how events worked out! We're not tanking!"

Bullshit. Contract the ****ing Colts. Get them out of here. Take Jim Irsay's money and make him live as a homeless dude in Indianapolis the rest of his life.

Also, don't forget, Ballard went out and spent north of 40 million dollars to upgrade the roster on guys like Johnathon Hankins, John Simon, Jabaal Sheard, Brian Shwenke, Barkevious Mingo. So it's not like they haven't tried hard to improve the roster.

Ballards hamstrung by the fact that Irsay made it a condition that he had to keep Pagano, the worst coach I've ever SEEN, for at least one more year, and injuries.

Skyy God · 09-13-2017, 09:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hoopsdoc

Also, don't forget, Ballard went out and spent north of 40 million dollars to upgrade the roster on guys like Johnathon Hankins, John Simon, Jabaal Sheard, Brian Shwenke, Barkevious Mingo. So it's not like they haven't tried hard to improve the roster.

Ballards hamstrung by the fact that Irsay made it a condition that he had to keep Pagano, the worst coach I've ever SEEN, for at least one more year, and injuries.

Uh, none of those signings sound like a particularly great use of resources and cap space.

Not Grigson-level bad, but still bad.

**wazu** · 09-13-2017, 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marcellus

No he wasnt, thats hyped up bullshit.

HIs QBR which is the best "stat" used for QB's was the second lowest of his career.

Half the games he played in his QBR was well below 50.

http://www.espn.com/nfl/player/gamel...lin-kaepernick

Look at these stats and tell me how you can have a passer rating of 97 in a game you lost by 13 points and had a completion % of 53%

Look at his QBR vs QB rating last season.

If QBR is what you care about, Kaepernick finished 2016 ahead of Newton, Wentz, Manning, and Tannehill.

**RealSNR** · 09-13-2017, 11:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hoopsdoc

Stupid. They wouldn't be this bad if their 3 best players weren't hurt. Luck, Kelly, and V Davis all going down has killed them.

Unless they hurt them on purpose, that's not tanking.

Why did they knowingly roll into the season with Scott Tolzien as the starter?

He's Tyler Palko bad

oaklandhater · 09-13-2017, 12:41 PM

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10 reasons why Jim Harbaugh will be the Indianapolis Colts head coach (VIDEO) | FOX Sports
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09-10-2017, 09:23 PM
oaklandhater future chiefs fans Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: oakland california Casino cash: $7598993	IndyStar The Colts have no idea what they're doing http://www.indystar.com/story/sports...ing/645793001/ The Colts have no idea what they're doing by Gregg Doyel, LOS ANGELES – The Indianapolis Colts stink, and not just the players on the field for that 46-9 loss Sunday to the Los Angeles Rams in their 2017 NFL opener. The whole damn franchise stinks, starting with the owner and oozing downhill, as this sort of excrement tends to do. The front office stinks. The coaching staff. The scouting department. The players? Bless their hearts, yes. The players stink, too. A loss like this, it goes looking for people to blame and it does not go wanting. The difficulty is deciding where to start. Quarterback Scott Tolzien was terrible, but you don’t start there. Tolzien has been something less than an NFL quarterback for years, and he stayed in character Sunday from his first pass of the game: an interception the Rams returned for a touchdown. He threw a second pick-six, and flirted with a third and a fourth, before being benched for Jacoby Brissett. Tolzien’s amateurish play Sunday – quarterback rating: 33.8 – was as predictable, if not as uncommon, as a lunar eclipse. Where were General Manager Chris Ballard and coach Chuck Pagano looking this summer when they chose Tolzien over Stephen Morris? Directly into the sun. OK, that’s not the real answer. The real answer is even dumber. While Morris was fabulous for a second consecutive year of preseason games, Ballard said last week that the job went to Tolzien because he was better than Morris in offseason OTAs and again in the early practices of training camp. And Pagano on Sunday said he “would never second-guess” that decision, because Chuck Pagano is nothing if not reliably prone to say things that sound blatantly untrue. No, this loss wasn’t Tolzien’s fault, though he did try to take the blame for it. To his credit, he acknowledged that football “is a team effort, but I certainly want to own this” defeat. To Pagano’s credit, he accepted blame for this loss on multiple occasions, even as he referred to the Rams as "the 49ers." To the credit of star receiver T.Y. Hilton, who fumbled his first catch of the season as he was diving to avoid contact – read that again – he tried to take the blame as well, saying: “I fumbled. It started with me.” Tolzien’s amateurish play Sunday – quarterback rating: 33.8 – was as predictable, if not as uncommon, as a lunar eclipse. Where were General Manager Chris Ballard and coach Chuck Pagano looking this summer when they chose Tolzien over Stephen Morris? Directly into the sun. OK, that’s not the real answer. The real answer is even dumber. While Morris was fabulous for a second consecutive year of preseason games, Ballard said last week that the job went to Tolzien because he was better than Morris in offseason OTAs and again in the early practices of training camp. And Pagano on Sunday said he “would never second-guess” that decision, because Chuck Pagano is nothing if not reliably prone to say things that sound blatantly untrue. No, this loss wasn’t Tolzien’s fault, though he did try to take the blame for it. To his credit, he acknowledged that football “is a team effort, but I certainly want to own this” defeat. To Pagano’s credit, he accepted blame for this loss on multiple occasions, even as he referred to the Rams as "the 49ers." To the credit of star receiver T.Y. Hilton, who fumbled his first catch of the season as he was diving to avoid contact – read that again – he tried to take the blame as well, saying: “I fumbled. It started with me.” Colts QBs Scott Tolzien and Jacoby Brissett talk to the media after the team's 46-9 loss to the Rams. Matt Kryger/IndyStar Who’s right? They’re all right. A loss like this, a loss in need of a mercy rule given that one team belonged in Little League, it’s too heavy for any single set of shoulders. It falls on offensive coordinator Rob Chudzinski, who called two goal-line rushes, power running plays, with his power back – Robert Turbin – on the sideline. And after those two carries by home-run threat Marlon Mack resulted in a loss of 1 yard, Chud put in Turbin … and called for Tolzien to throw it. Rams cornerback Trumaine Johnson, who delivered the pick-six on the Colts’ first pass of the game, might’ve had another had he hung onto this amateurish toss by Tolzien. This loss also falls on defensive coordinator Ted Monachino, who either chose converted safety T.J. Green to start and play most of the game at cornerback – or yielded that decision to Pagano, when what Monachino should have done was offer to resign before letting someone as lousy as T.J. Green undermine his defense. And make no mistake: T.J. Green is lousy. Moved from safety midway through the preseason because all he'd consistently done there since last season was miss tackles and deliver cheap shots, Green missed a tackle early in the second quarter when Rams running back Todd Gurley was fighting for extra yardage near the goal line. With Gurley’s entire body as a target, Green went for a cheap shot – he targeted Gurley’s head – but glanced off Gurley’s helmet, allowing the Rams running back to fall forward, into the end zone for a touchdown. Oh, and Green was in coverage on Rams receiver Cooper Kupp’s 18-yard TD catch that gave the Rams a 24-3 lead. At the NFL Scouting Combine in Indianapolis, Kupp ran the 40-yard dash in 4.62 seconds. Green ran it in 4.34 seconds. On the touchdown in question, Kupp was wide open because he was running away from Green. Don’t ask me to explain that. Still can’t believe I saw it. Can’t believe what happened on the Colts’ second series, either, after Tolzien completed a short pass to Marlon Mack and Mack sprinted toward the end zone. When 5-8, 190-pound Rams safety Lamarcus Joyner approached near the goal line, he nudged the 5-11, 210-pound Mack pushed out of bounds. It was a soft play by Mack, a play the Colts have become famous for in recent years as their blowout losses have mounted – and then it became something much worse. Because Chuck Pagano didn’t challenge the official ruling that Mack was pushed out of bounds before reaching the end zone. No, Pagano was too busy hurrying his next play onto the field – a power rush that Chudzinski gave to speed back Marlon Mack, who had just demonstrated that power is not his thing. With the Rams unable to substitute, Pagano was looking for a personnel mismatch, and he found one: His personnel was outmatched. Pagano outsmarted himself, the only NFL coach I’ve ever seen him outsmart, and afterward said that whole sequence was on him. And it was. But other sequences were on the defense, which put almost no pressure on Rams quarterback Jared Goff (career-best 117.9 quarterback rating) and allowed multiple Rams receivers to run wide open. The defense has been completely remade from the Colts’ 2016 opener, literally 11 new starters, which means that’s on the general manger who put the unit together. And his name isn’t Ryan Grigson. The Colts offensive line, meanwhile, allowed four sacks and nine quarterback hits in a game where they attempted just 21 passes. It was this past week when Pagano had decided “I’ve never felt better about an offensive line,” but again, that’s what he does: He says things that simply don’t sound honest. Pushed on that piece of Pollyanna a few days ago, Pagano doubled down: “Never felt better,” he said again. “You guys can write it. You can put it on the record and hold it to me.” Done. And now let's move on and remember what Colts owner Jim Irsay had said this summer about the biggest problem of the Andrew Luck era: his lack of protection. “I’m telling you,” Irsay said in June, “the offensive line is fixed.” I'm telling you something else: The people who run this team, from the owner on down, have no idea what they’re seeing, saying or doing.
Posts: 23,762

09-12-2017, 07:44 PM	#107
Marcellus Diablo Negro Join Date: Sep 2003 Casino cash: $3102662	Is he better than Tolzien yea, but everyone keeps forgetting he wants starters $$$$$$. If the talent reaches the $ he would be on a damn team.
Posts: 69,208

09-13-2017, 06:15 AM	#113
Mile High Mania #triggering Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Tejas Casino cash: $3697229	Teams do not want the baggage that comes with Kap, bottom line. __________________
Posts: 30,270

09-13-2017, 12:41 PM	#120
oaklandhater future chiefs fans Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: oakland california Casino cash: $7598993	10 reasons why Jim Harbaugh will be the Indianapolis Colts head coach 10 reasons why Jim Harbaugh will be the Indianapolis Colts head coach (VIDEO) \| FOX Sports Colin Cowherd outlines 10 reasons why Jim Harbaugh will leave the University of Michigan to be the Indianapolis Colts head coach.
Posts: 23,762