Finding Bigfoot

[Sorter]

Originally Posted by Fish

There are certainly many undiscovered species out there right now. But a 8 foot bipedal primate is not one of them. It's just not possible. For one, primates have only flourished in jungle environments with lots of rain. They are for the most part herbivores. It's been that way for millions of years, supported by fossil evidence. Meanwhile there is zero evidence of a stinky 8 foot hermit beast living in North America. It cannot provide a primate herbivore diet. No primate fossils have ever been found in North America. No hair or DNA evidence of any kind. Are we to believe that these beasts live solitary lives, yet never accidentally die leaving remains? There are thousands of men and women that spend their entire careers out in the wilderness, as well as cameras recording the areas of supposed Sasquatch territory. Millions of game hunters out there, many using trailcams. Some idiots make a full time career out of Bigfoot hunting. Yet nothing but stories.

It's just not possible for a primate to escape discovery unless we're talking about extreme environmental isolation. Which excludes North America.

This. WHile I acknowledge the pacific NW would provide optimal conditions for such a creature to exist, the fact that no hunters or remains have been found despite large groups consistently searching for it make me beyond skeptical.

[ThaVirus]

The Native Americans believed Bigfoot was a magical being..

You could only see one if it wanted you to.

[dmahurin]

Originally Posted by ThaVirus

The Native Americans believed Bigfoot was a magical being..

You could only see one if it wanted you to.

Kind of like Jesus, or angels?

[DaneMcCloud]

Sex Panther

[Cheater5]

I'm probably 90% against existence, but withhold 10% chance. Again, I am not a badass outdoorsman-'Great White Hunter'-type dude. But I have spent a considerable amount of time sleeping on the ground, and have never once come across a bear carcass for instance. Unless an animal was killed by predation- I haven't ever found it's remains and that includes mountain lion, wolves, bear, coyotes, or even a fox.

There are several photos of what appears to be a large predatory cat in the UK for instance, yet no remains have been found. Hell, people in Kansas say they've seen mountain lion/large cats and I remember as a kid down in Arkansas folks saying the same thing. Yes, those animals are known to exist and it isn't beyond imagination that a few might be roaming outside their range. But every now and then you read about the discovery of large animals/fish in the ocean that were thought to be extinct for 2 million years...recently a certain whale if I am not mistaken. All this is the open-minded ten percent side of me.

The overwhelming majority agrees that somehow, somewhere a person would have killed one and either cut a piece off, or gotten a very good up close photo.

Interesting if nothing else.

[Fish]

Originally Posted by Cheater5

I'm probably 90% against existence, but withhold 10% chance. Again, I am not a badass outdoorsman-'Great White Hunter'-type dude. But I have spent a considerable amount of time sleeping on the ground, and have never once come across a bear carcass for instance. Unless an animal was killed by predation- I haven't ever found it's remains and that includes mountain lion, wolves, bear, coyotes, or even a fox.

There are several photos of what appears to be a large predatory cat in the UK for instance, yet no remains have been found. Hell, people in Kansas say they've seen mountain lion/large cats and I remember as a kid down in Arkansas folks saying the same thing. Yes, those animals are known to exist and it isn't beyond imagination that a few might be roaming outside their range. But every now and then you read about the discovery of large animals/fish in the ocean that were thought to be extinct for 2 million years...recently a certain whale if I am not mistaken. All this is the open-minded ten percent side of me.

The overwhelming majority agrees that somehow, somewhere a person would have killed one and either cut a piece off, or gotten a very good up close photo.

Interesting if nothing else.

There's a big difference. Your wilderness experience aside, there have been countless carcasses of all the animals you listed found in the wild. And there's clearly fossil records of these animals in the North American ground. Enough so that we can see how the animal has changed over the past million years or so. Each of those animals has been clearly photographed thousands upon thousands of times. We have instances of each of those animals in captivity all across the world. You can go to Google right now, and find more results than you can click in a day of these animals appearing clearly on trail cams and all sorts of other pictures.

Just this last year, a mountain lion was photographed in Kansas, and it's clear as day. And the mountain lion is actually a really good example of a solitary predator being unable to escape discovery. Mountain lions are incredibly solitary and independent animals, not to mention being nocturnal. They don't live in packs, and they have a territorial range larger than any other animal in the Western hemisphere. So there's very very few of them, they cover a huge range of territory, they're very elusive and rarely out in daylight. But look at the evidence we have for their existence.



Yet we still have zero evidence of a large unknown North American primate. Zero. Nothing. Nada.

[Easy 6]

Originally Posted by Fish

There's a big difference. Your wilderness experience aside, there have been countless carcasses of all the animals you listed found in the wild. And there's clearly fossil records of these animals in the North American ground. Enough so that we can see how the animal has changed over the past million years or so. Each of those animals has been clearly photographed thousands upon thousands of times. We have instances of each of those animals in captivity all across the world. You can go to Google right now, and find more results than you can click in a day of these animals appearing clearly on trail cams and all sorts of other pictures.

Just this last year, a mountain lion was photographed in Kansas, and it's clear as day. And the mountain lion is actually a really good example of a solitary predator being unable to escape discovery. Mountain lions are incredibly solitary and independent animals, not to mention being nocturnal. They don't live in packs, and they have a territorial range larger than any other animal in the Western hemisphere. So there's very very few of them, they cover a huge range of territory, they're very elusive and rarely out in daylight. But look at the evidence we have for their existence.



Yet we still have zero evidence of a large unknown North American primate. Zero. Nothing. Nada.

You're completely ignoring the fact that many of the eyewitnesses testimony would be enough to send a person to prison.

You think a guy like the game warden i mentioned isnt qualified to state what he seen as fact? would a guy like that risk being the butt of every joke among his co-workers, if he wasnt 100% sure of what he'd seen?

Its all very mysterious and i claim to have no answers, but laughing off dead serious testimony from qualified observers makes no sense.

[Frazod]

Originally Posted by scott free

You're completely ignoring the fact that many of the eyewitnesses testimony would be enough to send a person to prison.

You think a guy like the game warden i mentioned isnt qualified to state what he seen as fact? would a guy like that risk being the butt of every joke among his co-workers, if he wasnt 100% sure of what he'd seen?

Its all very mysterious and i claim to have no answers, but laughing off dead serious testimony from qualified observers makes no sense.

This isn't a ghost, or a ninja, or Predator with stealth technology. It's a ****ing ape-man. If the only place this creature was seen was the Pacific Northwest, I'd buy it - there aren't thousands of square miles of forest, there are millions of square miles of forest for it to hide in. But people report seeing them all over the country. How in the hell is there no real evidence? It just doesn't make any sense.

[Easy 6]

Originally Posted by frazod

This isn't a ghost, or a ninja, or Predator with stealth technology. It's a ****ing ape-man. If the only place this creature was seen was the Pacific Northwest, I'd buy it - there aren't thousands of square miles of forest, there are millions of square miles of forest for it to hide in. But people report seeing them all over the country. How in the hell is there no real evidence? It just doesn't make any sense.

Like i said, i claim to have no answers.

But as far as evidence, there is quite a bit of it in the form of track castings with the kind of detailed dermal ridge patterns that would be extremely difficult to fake, tufts of hair that cannot be definitively pinned to a known animal and i've seen two different leading primatologists/physiologists say that the creature in the old Patterson footage couldnt have been faked by a man.

I'm not trying to convince anyone, i've never seen one either, but i wont ignore the testimony and evidence thats there.

[Fish]

Originally Posted by scott free

You're completely ignoring the fact that many of the eyewitnesses testimony would be enough to send a person to prison.

You think a guy like the game warden i mentioned isnt qualified to state what he seen as fact? would a guy like that risk being the butt of every joke among his co-workers, if he wasnt 100% sure of what he'd seen?

Its all very mysterious and i claim to have no answers, but laughing off dead serious testimony from qualified observers makes no sense.

Sorry, but unsubstantiated eyewitness testimonies are the most unreliable form of evidence possible. We could find eyewitness testimonies for just about anything you can dream up. We could find eyewitness testimony from multiple people claiming they've been visited by lizard aliens.

I've never heard this game warden's story, so I can't really comment on his alleged sighting. But it certainly goes against the overwhelming majority of reports from game warden types. You admit to that when you mention him being the butt of his coworkers' jokes. There's reason for that. I can't speak for why he would want to admit to something like that, but I can offer evidence for why he'd be greeted with skepticism and ridicule. He may be 100% convinced he saw a bigfoot. But it's not different than the people who are 100% convinced they've been visited by lizard aliens.

[Cheater5]

Originally Posted by Fish

There's a big difference. Your wilderness experience aside, there have been countless carcasses of all the animals you listed found in the wild. And there's clearly fossil records of these animals in the North American ground. Enough so that we can see how the animal has changed over the past million years or so. Each of those animals has been clearly photographed thousands upon thousands of times. We have instances of each of those animals in captivity all across the world. You can go to Google right now, and find more results than you can click in a day of these animals appearing clearly on trail cams and all sorts of other pictures.

Just this last year, a mountain lion was photographed in Kansas, and it's clear as day. And the mountain lion is actually a really good example of a solitary predator being unable to escape discovery. Mountain lions are incredibly solitary and independent animals, not to mention being nocturnal. They don't live in packs, and they have a territorial range larger than any other animal in the Western hemisphere. So there's very very few of them, they cover a huge range of territory, they're very elusive and rarely out in daylight. But look at the evidence we have for their existence.



Yet we still have zero evidence of a large unknown North American primate. Zero. Nothing. Nada.

Jaysus, dude. Do you live to argue? I'm not refuting any of the above, nor am I arguing for the existence of such an animal as bigfoot- it's like you're cherry-picking what you want to read and zeroing in on it. WTF have I said time and again? I AM NOT AN ADVOCATE FOR THE EXISTENCE OF BIGFOOT, SASQUATCH, MO-MO THE MISSOURI MONSTER OR THE SWAMP APE.

Overwhelming lack of evidence suggests there is no such animal. But, when I'm in a VA retirement home in 40 years and if I happen to read that some dude killed a gigantopithecus with his pickup truck in Oregon or Montana...I'll pause and go "son of a b*tch..."

[penguinz]

Originally Posted by Cheater5

I AM NOT AN ADVOCATE FOR THE EXISTENCE OF BIGFOOT, SASQUATCH, MO-MO THE MISSOURI MONSTER OR THE SWAMP APE.

It is Skunk Ape!

[ThaVirus]

Originally Posted by Cheater5

I'm probably 90% against existence, but withhold 10% chance. Again, I am not a badass outdoorsman-'Great White Hunter'-type dude. But I have spent a considerable amount of time sleeping on the ground, and have never once come across a bear carcass for instance. Unless an animal was killed by predation- I haven't ever found it's remains and that includes mountain lion, wolves, bear, coyotes, or even a fox.

There are several photos of what appears to be a large predatory cat in the UK for instance, yet no remains have been found. Hell, people in Kansas say they've seen mountain lion/large cats and I remember as a kid down in Arkansas folks saying the same thing. Yes, those animals are known to exist and it isn't beyond imagination that a few might be roaming outside their range. But every now and then you read about the discovery of large animals/fish in the ocean that were thought to be extinct for 2 million years...recently a certain whale if I am not mistaken. All this is the open-minded ten percent side of me.

The overwhelming majority agrees that somehow, somewhere a person would have killed one and either cut a piece off, or gotten a very good up close photo.

Interesting if nothing else.

Originally Posted by Fish

There's a big difference. Your wilderness experience aside, there have been countless carcasses of all the animals you listed found in the wild. And there's clearly fossil records of these animals in the North American ground. Enough so that we can see how the animal has changed over the past million years or so. Each of those animals has been clearly photographed thousands upon thousands of times. We have instances of each of those animals in captivity all across the world. You can go to Google right now, and find more results than you can click in a day of these animals appearing clearly on trail cams and all sorts of other pictures.

Just this last year, a mountain lion was photographed in Kansas, and it's clear as day. And the mountain lion is actually a really good example of a solitary predator being unable to escape discovery. Mountain lions are incredibly solitary and independent animals, not to mention being nocturnal. They don't live in packs, and they have a territorial range larger than any other animal in the Western hemisphere. So there's very very few of them, they cover a huge range of territory, they're very elusive and rarely out in daylight. But look at the evidence we have for their existence.



Yet we still have zero evidence of a large unknown North American primate. Zero. Nothing. Nada.

Originally Posted by Cheater5

Jaysus, dude. Do you live to argue? I'm not refuting any of the above, nor am I arguing for the existence of such an animal as bigfoot- it's like you're cherry-picking what you want to read and zeroing in on it. WTF have I said time and again? I AM NOT AN ADVOCATE FOR THE EXISTENCE OF BIGFOOT, SASQUATCH, MO-MO THE MISSOURI MONSTER OR THE SWAMP APE.

Overwhelming lack of evidence suggests there is no such animal. But, when I'm in a VA retirement home in 40 years and if I happen to read that some dude killed a gigantopithecus with his pickup truck in Oregon or Montana...I'll pause and go "son of a b*tch..."

This little exchange reminded me of an argument I had with a friend of mine a while back.

He's one of those super-logical types. No imagination whatsoever and zero grasp on the concept of possibility. If it's not 100% backed by current scientific theory then it just isn't real or isn't possible.

I can't remember how the exchange started, but I mentioned something about time travel and dinosaurs still living in remote parts of the Congo being possible. He flipped his shit and has brought it up on a consistent basis in an attempt to make me feel like an idiot. He couldn't seem to grasp the fact that I wasn't arguing that they exist, but that I was arguing for the possibility that they could exist. No one really knows what's is and isn't possible so arguing against it is pretty much futile..

[jd1020]

No one is going to convince me that there are hundreds of man like 9' tall bipedal apes living in NA that just haven't been discovered.

Pretty big difference between NA and the Congo.

[InChiefsHeaven]

Originally Posted by Fish

There's a big difference. Your wilderness experience aside, there have been countless carcasses of all the animals you listed found in the wild. And there's clearly fossil records of these animals in the North American ground. Enough so that we can see how the animal has changed over the past million years or so. Each of those animals has been clearly photographed thousands upon thousands of times. We have instances of each of those animals in captivity all across the world. You can go to Google right now, and find more results than you can click in a day of these animals appearing clearly on trail cams and all sorts of other pictures.

Just this last year, a mountain lion was photographed in Kansas, and it's clear as day. And the mountain lion is actually a really good example of a solitary predator being unable to escape discovery. Mountain lions are incredibly solitary and independent animals, not to mention being nocturnal. They don't live in packs, and they have a territorial range larger than any other animal in the Western hemisphere. So there's very very few of them, they cover a huge range of territory, they're very elusive and rarely out in daylight. But look at the evidence we have for their existence.



Yet we still have zero evidence of a large unknown North American primate. Zero. Nothing. Nada.

Party pooper. I BELIEVE!!