Chiefs Mellinger article on Hill - Page 3

**jjchieffan** · 10-24-2016, 10:55 AM

DJ''s left nut, TTC, and Clay, you may want to avoid this thread. It may get your panties in a wad.

Five seconds on a perfect afternoon is all you need to see to know why. It's why the men in charge of the Chiefs put their own credibility on the line for an admitted domestic abuser. It's why they were willing to drag the franchise through another messy argument, at least temporarily turning much of what they say they stand for into laughable propaganda.

This is a column about football, not morals. But this is also a column about Tyreek Hill, which means the line is blurry. Tyreek Hill made the most exciting, most breathtaking play in the Chiefs' 27-21 win over the Saints on Sunday.

That sentence will make Chiefs fans feel, something. Maybe all you care about is the touchdown. Maybe you will never forgive Hill for his monstrous act two years ago, or the Chiefs for bringing him to Kansas City.

Maybe you're like me, and go sad and sick whenever you think about what he did, and are disappointed the franchise of Jovan Belcher drafted Hill, but think the blame should be less on a football team and more on a justice system shamefully light on sentencing for convicted abusers of women.

No matter where you are on that issue, this column is not intended to change your mind.

This is about why the Chiefs took that risk in the fifth round of the draft back in May, why they've made sure Hill attends his court-mandated counseling, and why they thought the muck would be worth it.

It’s because of these five seconds.

"He's still a rookie, but he's off to the right start," veteran receiver Jeremy Maclin said.

First and 10 at the Saints' 38, and this is a perfect time to throw deep. If it goes incomplete, you have two more downs, and you're already on the edge of field goal range. Coach Andy Reid and quarterback Alex Smith are famously reluctant to go downfield. You know that, they know that, the other team knows that.

So it's doubly important for them to take those shots, to at least show they can, because otherwise they're throwing tunnel screens against 11 men close to the line of scrimmage.

Hill is freakishly fast — 4.24 seconds in the 40 at his pro day — and could be the Chiefs' best deep threat since, what, J.J. Birden?

"He opens everything up for all of the rest of us," Maclin says.

So, about those five seconds. Smith sees the read he wants — single coverage on Hill, with no safety over the top. He takes a short drop back and makes a trust throw high and long, believing that his guy will win the play. When Smith throws, Saints cornerback Ken Crawley is three or four yards closer to the ball's landing spot than Hill.

"Alex just told me to run as fast as I can," Hill said.

At the 14, the ball still in the air, Crawley is still a yard or two ahead of Hill. From that moment to the goal line, Hill takes seven steps. He runs past Crawley around the 10. By the six, Hill is a step behind the corner. Crawley knows it, too. He starts tugging and shoving at Hill around the five.

Hill is small — 5-foot-10 and 185 pounds, the third-smallest man on the roster — but he is also strong. Crawley's hands aren't effective. Receivers coach David Culley has talked about this moment all week, telling his guys they will have to fight downfield against a physical group of defensive backs.

Hill shakes off the coverage, plants his left foot at the 1, and leaps into the end zone. Smith's pass is perfectly placed, and in midair, Hill makes a one-handed basket catch with his left hand, rolling onto the ground with the touchdown.

There is nobody else on the roster who could've made this play. Nobody on any Chiefs roster in recent history could've made this play.

Maybe the Chiefs could've scored on this drive anyway. The Saints' defense stinks. But this was the Chiefs' one big play that was more about a singular talent than preparation or scheme, and the Chiefs won by six.

The front office did not take this kind of risk for a singles hitter.

"We're asking him to do a lot of different things," Reid said. "He's a sharp kid. So we've been able to give him maybe a little bit more than I thought as a rookie that you'd probably be able to do, but he's handled it."

Funny moment after the game. Someone asked Hill about Smith, and to be fair, Smith has played very well two games in a row — 36 for 46 for 438 yards, two touchdowns and no interceptions in two wins.

Tyreek Hill says extra work with Alex Smith paid off
Chiefs wide receiver Tyreek Hill said extra work with quarterback Alex Smith paid off with a touchdown reception Sunday against the New Orleans Saints.
Blair Kerkhoff The Kansas City Star
But, then, well, Hill said something of Smith that no serious person has said about Smith since, well, ever.

"He could be a future Hall of Famer, who knows?"

Well, Smith knows. Smith's family knows. His coaches know. You know. I know. But that's not the point. This is where Hill is at the moment, and it's who he's been with the Chiefs. He is eager. He is earnest. He calls everyone sir. Compliments his coaches constantly. Talks more about his mistakes than his successes, and more about his weaknesses than strengths.

He spent training camp driving an enormous old clunker, literally getting around in what his coaches saw as a symbol of humility.

Hill still has much to clean up. He made a mistake with the Chiefs leading late in the fourth quarter, going out of bounds on an end-around, stopping the clock. His teammates say his route running is more advanced than he's shown in games, but so far he's been limited mostly to screens and go routes.

DEFENSE STEPS UP, CHIEFS HOLD ON FOR 27-21 WIN OVER SAINTS

The rest of it may or may not come, of course. He's still young. His ultimate success or failure will be digested by many fans and media as a statement of his character. That will be misguided. It will only be a statement of his ability to play in the NFL. We don't know how any of that will work out.

All we know now is that he's doing the right things, and showing enough to see why the Chiefs took on this significant risk in the first place.

"I feel pretty good," he said. "I'm laughing, each and every day. I'm having fun with these guys. The guys are starting to trust me, and I'm starting to trust them. Once you get that down, you're comfortable."

Read more here: http://www.kansascity.com/sports/spt...#storylink=cpy

**jjchieffan** · 10-24-2016, 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KC Tattoo

You are one ****ed up dude. He hurt her bad enough to go to the hospital that is beating her up. He also tried choking the life out of her and your just playing that off like no big deal.

You are ****ed up in the head.

That's not the way I heard it. And no I am not playing it off as no big deal. I specifically said that it was bad. All I was saying is that what you are saying is an exaggeration of what I understand it to be. Regardless. It happened before he was a Chief. He has a clean record before and after this incident. He made a mistake. He admits that he made a terrible mistake, and he is just living his life now. Some of you guys act like she was your sister, daughter, mother, whatever. I wonder how the victim feels? Does she think he deserves to be in the NFL? Has she forgiven him? Because frankly, her opinion is the only one that matters in this instance. If she has forgiven him and wishes him well, then, in the words of Dr Phil, "Who do you think you are?" to judge him?

**jjchieffan** · 10-24-2016, 01:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RealSNR

He punched her in the face. And the STOMACH. WHILE SHE WAS PREGNANT.

You're gonna have to link that. I never heard it that way. This is starting to sound like the exaggerated story in Unforgiven. "They cut her all up and even cut her tits off"

Chromatic · 10-24-2016, 01:39 PM

I'm all for keeping him on the team provided he's shown that he's willing to take the steps to be a better person, but he should permanently be on strike 2.

He deserves a chance but absolutely no leeway.

Hydrae · 10-24-2016, 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigBeauford

We live in a society where ordinary citizens have higher standards placed on them than our celebrities. A teacher in Washington shows up to class drunk, gets fired and dragged through the media mud then commits suicide, while we are stuck voting for Trump or Hilary, the Wells Fargo ceo gets to leave with over $100 million in compensation, and a man who beats the **** out of his pregnant girlfriend gets cheered by millions to catch a football. **** Tyreek Hill.

I don't know the story to any deep level when it comes to Tyreek but I though in this society we allowed people to pay their debt to society (as mandated by the court system) and then move on with their lives. Is that not the case here? Has he paid his debt as dictated by the courts?

If the answer to those two questions is yes then I do not understand the issue here. What he did was bad, very, very bad but that is in the past now and he should be allowed to pursue a career. Or do people think that because of this in his past he should not be allowed into certain professions like playing in the NFL? Should he be relegated to flipping burgers for the rest of his life?

I just don't understand why this (or any) young man should not be allowed to have a life even after such an egregious mistake.

Marcellus · 10-24-2016, 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chromatic

I'm all for keeping him on the team provided he's shown that he's willing to take the steps to be a better person, but he should permanently be on strike 2.

He deserves a chance but absolutely no leeway.

Its not like there is much leeway to be given in this circumstance, its a pretty clear line.

**Iowanian** · 10-24-2016, 01:44 PM

There are probably a dozen players on every team who have done worse. There is likely someone you work with right now who has done worse.

I don't support hitting women and as a rule of thumb wish bad things on those people.

That said, I'm watching a football game and when I watch with my kids, we aren't looking at anyone there as a life coach o role model.
I'd wager all of us have done things or made decisions we'd re-do if we had a chance. Most people learn from those moments and move on.

If he helps the Chiefs win, great. We'll cheer that. I'll handle the life coaching and role modeling at home.

Red Dawg · 10-24-2016, 01:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KC Tattoo

Smith has played very well two games in a row — 36 for 46 for 438 yards, two touchdowns and no interceptions in two wins.

This is all we get out of Smith from playing two of the worst defense this year has to offer? I mean I think we need to do better because defenses don't get much easier well maybe against the Colts but they can also put points on the board with Luck.

I agree. That is the best he can do. It's just the way he is but in year 4 of the same coaches and system it's pretty sad we can't put up more points. We have the players to do it but Smith is not the guy to take advantage.

I really hope they move on next season.

BigBeauford · 10-24-2016, 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hydrae

I don't know the story to any deep level when it comes to Tyreek but I though in this society we allowed people to pay their debt to society (as mandated by the court system) and then move on with their lives. Is that not the case here? Has he paid his debt as dictated by the courts?

If the answer to those two questions is yes then I do not understand the issue here. What he did was bad, very, very bad but that is in the past now and he should be allowed to pursue a career. Or do people think that because of this in his past he should not be allowed into certain professions like playing in the NFL? Should he be relegated to flipping burgers for the rest of his life?

I just don't understand why this (or any) young man should not be allowed to have a life even after such an egregious mistake.

Debt to society means a lot of things. One guy can rape a woman and get 15 years, while another gets 3 months. One guy could beat the **** out of his pregnant girlfriend and get his nursing liscence revoked, thus relegating him to burger flipping status, and the other might be signing autographs for your kid.

**jjchieffan** · 10-24-2016, 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hydrae

I don't know the story to any deep level when it comes to Tyreek but I though in this society we allowed people to pay their debt to society (as mandated by the court system) and then move on with their lives. Is that not the case here? Has he paid his debt as dictated by the courts?

If the answer to those two questions is yes then I do not understand the issue here. What he did was bad, very, very bad but that is in the past now and he should be allowed to pursue a career. Or do people think that because of this in his past he should not be allowed into certain professions like playing in the NFL? Should he be relegated to flipping burgers for the rest of his life?

I just don't understand why this (or any) young man should not be allowed to have a life even after such an egregious mistake.

Exactly.

**The Franchise** · 10-24-2016, 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jjchieffan

You're gonna have to link that. I never heard it that way. This is starting to sound like the exaggerated story in Unforgiven. "They cut her all up and even cut her tits off"

So you know.....that was ****ing hard to find.

http://newsok.com/article/5399812

Quote:

Espinal said Hill was upset and did not want to talk, then threw her phone and laptop into the hallway outside his room. Espinal went to retrieve those items and Hill shut the door. She says the assault — which includes alleged choking, tearing of her shirt, punching of her face and stomach — occurred when she returned to the room.

http://www.si.com/college-football/2...plea-agreement

Quote:

Hill's girlfriend at the time said they were arguing at his residence when the incident "escalated into a physical altercation." She told police that Hill, 20, hit her in the face and stomach and proceeded to choke her. She was treated and later released from the hospital. She told police she was eight-weeks pregnant with Hill's child.

But let me guess.....she's probably lying....right?

Marcellus · 10-24-2016, 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tuckdaddy

I agree. That is the best he can do. It's just the way he is but in year 4 of the same coaches and system it's pretty sad we can't put up more points. We have the players to do it but Smith is not the guy to take advantage.

I really hope they move on next season.

Are you absolutely sure this is how you feel about Alex Smith? I think some of us are still not sure since you only post this about 10x a day.

bishop_74 · 10-24-2016, 01:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jjchieffan

You're gonna have to link that. I never heard it that way. This is starting to sound like the exaggerated story in Unforgiven. "They cut her all up and even cut her tits off"

Looks like that is what she told police. Man. I didn't really look in to it either.

http://www.si.com/college-football/2...plea-agreement

Hill's girlfriend at the time said they were arguing at his residence when the incident "escalated into a physical altercation." She told police that Hill, 20, hit her in the face and stomach and proceeded to choke her. She was treated and later released from the hospital. She told police she was eight-weeks pregnant with Hill's child.

Marcellus · 10-24-2016, 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pestilence

So you know.....that was ****ing hard to find.

http://newsok.com/article/5399812

http://www.si.com/college-football/2...plea-agreement

But let me guess.....she's probably lying....right?

8 weeks pregnant? Still plenty of time to get an abortion that most of would have had no issue with.

Hydrae · 10-24-2016, 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigBeauford

Debt to society means a lot of things. One guy can rape a woman and get 15 years, while another gets 3 months. One guy could beat the **** out of his pregnant girlfriend and get his nursing liscence revoked, thus relegating him to burger flipping status, and the other might be signing autographs for your kid.

What you list there as discrepancies are court related issues. If the violator has completed paying his debt to society as dictated by the court where the case was heard then they must be allowed to move ahead with their lives. Otherwise you should just put a bullet in their head or expect to support them on welfare for the rest of their lives because you are giving them no other options.

Not going to stick around and argue because I don't want to derail the thread any further and because it won't change any minds. I just hate seeing a young person made a (terrible) mistake and have it screw them for the next 50+ years they have to live and contribute to our society.

**RealSNR** · 10-24-2016, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jjchieffan

You're gonna have to link that. I never heard it that way. This is starting to sound like the exaggerated story in Unforgiven. "They cut her all up and even cut her tits off"

Pestilence already linked you, but here's another one. Do you trust the Washington Post to get facts right?
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...iolence-issue/

Yeah, I just made shit up because I saw it in a movie.

You're a ****ing idiot.

10-24-2016, 10:55 AM
jjchieffan Supporter Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Highlandville, MO Casino cash: $3302247	Mellinger article on Hill DJ''s left nut, TTC, and Clay, you may want to avoid this thread. It may get your panties in a wad. Five seconds on a perfect afternoon is all you need to see to know why. It's why the men in charge of the Chiefs put their own credibility on the line for an admitted domestic abuser. It's why they were willing to drag the franchise through another messy argument, at least temporarily turning much of what they say they stand for into laughable propaganda. This is a column about football, not morals. But this is also a column about Tyreek Hill, which means the line is blurry. Tyreek Hill made the most exciting, most breathtaking play in the Chiefs' 27-21 win over the Saints on Sunday. That sentence will make Chiefs fans feel, something. Maybe all you care about is the touchdown. Maybe you will never forgive Hill for his monstrous act two years ago, or the Chiefs for bringing him to Kansas City. Maybe you're like me, and go sad and sick whenever you think about what he did, and are disappointed the franchise of Jovan Belcher drafted Hill, but think the blame should be less on a football team and more on a justice system shamefully light on sentencing for convicted abusers of women. No matter where you are on that issue, this column is not intended to change your mind. This is about why the Chiefs took that risk in the fifth round of the draft back in May, why they've made sure Hill attends his court-mandated counseling, and why they thought the muck would be worth it. It’s because of these five seconds. "He's still a rookie, but he's off to the right start," veteran receiver Jeremy Maclin said. First and 10 at the Saints' 38, and this is a perfect time to throw deep. If it goes incomplete, you have two more downs, and you're already on the edge of field goal range. Coach Andy Reid and quarterback Alex Smith are famously reluctant to go downfield. You know that, they know that, the other team knows that. So it's doubly important for them to take those shots, to at least show they can, because otherwise they're throwing tunnel screens against 11 men close to the line of scrimmage. Hill is freakishly fast — 4.24 seconds in the 40 at his pro day — and could be the Chiefs' best deep threat since, what, J.J. Birden? "He opens everything up for all of the rest of us," Maclin says. So, about those five seconds. Smith sees the read he wants — single coverage on Hill, with no safety over the top. He takes a short drop back and makes a trust throw high and long, believing that his guy will win the play. When Smith throws, Saints cornerback Ken Crawley is three or four yards closer to the ball's landing spot than Hill. "Alex just told me to run as fast as I can," Hill said. At the 14, the ball still in the air, Crawley is still a yard or two ahead of Hill. From that moment to the goal line, Hill takes seven steps. He runs past Crawley around the 10. By the six, Hill is a step behind the corner. Crawley knows it, too. He starts tugging and shoving at Hill around the five. Hill is small — 5-foot-10 and 185 pounds, the third-smallest man on the roster — but he is also strong. Crawley's hands aren't effective. Receivers coach David Culley has talked about this moment all week, telling his guys they will have to fight downfield against a physical group of defensive backs. Hill shakes off the coverage, plants his left foot at the 1, and leaps into the end zone. Smith's pass is perfectly placed, and in midair, Hill makes a one-handed basket catch with his left hand, rolling onto the ground with the touchdown. There is nobody else on the roster who could've made this play. Nobody on any Chiefs roster in recent history could've made this play. Maybe the Chiefs could've scored on this drive anyway. The Saints' defense stinks. But this was the Chiefs' one big play that was more about a singular talent than preparation or scheme, and the Chiefs won by six. The front office did not take this kind of risk for a singles hitter. "We're asking him to do a lot of different things," Reid said. "He's a sharp kid. So we've been able to give him maybe a little bit more than I thought as a rookie that you'd probably be able to do, but he's handled it." Funny moment after the game. Someone asked Hill about Smith, and to be fair, Smith has played very well two games in a row — 36 for 46 for 438 yards, two touchdowns and no interceptions in two wins. Tyreek Hill says extra work with Alex Smith paid off Chiefs wide receiver Tyreek Hill said extra work with quarterback Alex Smith paid off with a touchdown reception Sunday against the New Orleans Saints. Blair Kerkhoff The Kansas City Star But, then, well, Hill said something of Smith that no serious person has said about Smith since, well, ever. "He could be a future Hall of Famer, who knows?" Well, Smith knows. Smith's family knows. His coaches know. You know. I know. But that's not the point. This is where Hill is at the moment, and it's who he's been with the Chiefs. He is eager. He is earnest. He calls everyone sir. Compliments his coaches constantly. Talks more about his mistakes than his successes, and more about his weaknesses than strengths. He spent training camp driving an enormous old clunker, literally getting around in what his coaches saw as a symbol of humility. Hill still has much to clean up. He made a mistake with the Chiefs leading late in the fourth quarter, going out of bounds on an end-around, stopping the clock. His teammates say his route running is more advanced than he's shown in games, but so far he's been limited mostly to screens and go routes. DEFENSE STEPS UP, CHIEFS HOLD ON FOR 27-21 WIN OVER SAINTS The rest of it may or may not come, of course. He's still young. His ultimate success or failure will be digested by many fans and media as a statement of his character. That will be misguided. It will only be a statement of his ability to play in the NFL. We don't know how any of that will work out. All we know now is that he's doing the right things, and showing enough to see why the Chiefs took on this significant risk in the first place. "I feel pretty good," he said. "I'm laughing, each and every day. I'm having fun with these guys. The guys are starting to trust me, and I'm starting to trust them. Once you get that down, you're comfortable." Read more here: http://www.kansascity.com/sports/spt...#storylink=cpy
Posts: 12,613

10-24-2016, 01:39 PM	#33
Chromatic Veteran Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Earth Casino cash: $10018551	I'm all for keeping him on the team provided he's shown that he's willing to take the steps to be a better person, but he should permanently be on strike 2. He deserves a chance but absolutely no leeway.
Posts: 1,305

10-24-2016, 01:44 PM	#36
Iowanian Supporter Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Utopia Casino cash: $4718454	There are probably a dozen players on every team who have done worse. There is likely someone you work with right now who has done worse. I don't support hitting women and as a rule of thumb wish bad things on those people. That said, I'm watching a football game and when I watch with my kids, we aren't looking at anyone there as a life coach o role model. I'd wager all of us have done things or made decisions we'd re-do if we had a chance. Most people learn from those moments and move on. If he helps the Chiefs win, great. We'll cheer that. I'll handle the life coaching and role modeling at home.
Posts: 61,540