Reading Nothing But Positives About Our D Line

[Mr. Laz]

Originally Posted by saphojunkie

I'm kind of confused by the vitriol for Sutton. The way people talk, you'd think been fielding shitty defenses for years.

Am I the only person who thinks it's unwise to make decisions about new coaching staffs/schemes after one season?

Did i not mention that it's only been 1-year and explain why it's still worrisome?

[milkman]

Originally Posted by saphojunkie

I'm kind of confused by the vitriol for Sutton. The way people talk, you'd think been fielding shitty defenses for years.

Am I the only person who thinks it's unwise to make decisions about new coaching staffs/schemes after one season?

I started a thread discussing this.

I have no idea if he is a good or bad DC because he was so limited by the player's limitations he had to work with.

Hoping the young guys that are replacing the limited players that left are more talented and versatile, allowing us to get better read on Sutton.

[Mav]

Originally Posted by milkman

I started a thread discussing this.

I have no idea if he is a good or bad DC because he was so limited by the player's limitations he had to work with.

Hoping the young guys that are replacing the limited players that left are more talented and versatile, allowing us to get better read on Sutton.

Welp. I knew someday we would see eye to eye. It's funny. The chiefs were up, holding down the chargers when a freak thing happened and the chiefs premiere pass rushers both went down. All of a sudden a suspect secondary was completely exposed, and people blame sutton for lack of adjustments. Jesus Christ.

[RealSNR]

Originally Posted by saphojunkie

I'm kind of confused by the vitriol for Sutton. The way people talk, you'd think been fielding shitty defenses for years.

Am I the only person who thinks it's unwise to make decisions about new coaching staffs/schemes after one season?

For me, it just stinks knowing that we could have and SHOULD have had Ray Horton in as defensive coordinator, but got cock blocked by the Cardinals completely unnecessarily. I don't think Sutton was being tabbed by any other team looking to form a new coaching staff, so I wish Reid would have been patient and waited to see what the Horton situation was before hiring Sutton anyway.

We still would have had Kendrick Lewis and Dunta Robinson problems last year, but I'd be a lot more confident that we'd try to change things up to keep offenses second-guessing themselves. Instead, teams like Denver and even ****ing Cleveland sat back and exploited the scheme's weak spot all game- NEVER deviating from that strategy.

Yes, better CBs would have helped, but it shouldn't be necessary. There are other ways you can make this defense work for you besides allowing your secondary to get gashed by the dink and dunk all game.

[New World Order]

Originally Posted by SNR

For me, it just stinks knowing that we could have and SHOULD have had Ray Horton in as defensive coordinator, but got cock blocked by the Cardinals completely unnecessarily. I don't think Sutton was being tabbed by any other team looking to form a new coaching staff, so I wish Reid would have been patient and waited to see what the Horton situation was before hiring Sutton anyway.

We still would have had Kendrick Lewis and Dunta Robinson problems last year, but I'd be a lot more confident that we'd try to change things up to keep offenses second-guessing themselves. Instead, teams like Denver and even ****ing Cleveland sat back and exploited the scheme's weak spot all game- NEVER deviating from that strategy.

Yes, better CBs would have helped, but it shouldn't be necessary. There are other ways you can make this defense work for you besides allowing your secondary to get gashed by the dink and dunk all game.

Ugh, nothing was worse than Peyton Manning repeatedly throwing td bombs with no safety help.

[milkman]

Originally Posted by Mr. Laz

weird

out of all our Olinemen, Hudson is the guy i have the least hope for

Fisher - potential is their regardless of how much CP wants to bitch
Allen - might be in the wrong position but physical potential is there
Hudson - seems to me like he always going to be a liability against power
RG - some young guys with some talent who might become really solid
Stephenson - I think he has talent to be a solid guy at either OT position

imo Hudson is also one of the key issues in short yardage. When defenses clog the middle and your center can't handle a solo block then it's going to be difficult to run up the middle.

I'm with sac on Hudson.

Dude was a hell of a college guard.

He's struggled transitioning to center, but he should be at the point where he is far more comfortable.

[Mr. Laz]

Originally Posted by milkman

I'm with sac on Hudson.

Dude was a hell of a college guard.

He's struggled transitioning to center, but he should be at the point where he is far more comfortable.

let's hope

we needed a guard, maybe he should have moved there and then we could have just drafted a center.

[Saccopoo]

Originally Posted by Mr. Laz

let's hope

we needed a guard, maybe he should have moved there and then we could have just drafted a center.

You are about to enter the vicious Branden Albert "what if" conversation.

Hudson was actually a very powerful, very technically sound guard and left tackle at Florida State. (Played center a couple of times as well - a very versatile player.) One of the best I've ever seen. However, like Shields, he was relatively short of arms and will always be around 300 lb. max. As such, in the modern NFL, his best position was projected at center where he could operate more effectively in a short space/area.

However, as the center is usually the one handling the line calls as well as the snaps to the QB, it's a more difficult transition than, say, switching to one side of the line or the other (IMO). However, Hudson graded out as our top lineman numerous times last season and should be fully immersed in the system at this point.

I think that the broken leg is well behind him and he's going to play with the power, skills and confidence that you saw during his college career.

He's the guy I would worry least about on the offensive line at this point.

[saphojunkie]

I wasn't talking directly about you, actually. But across the board, Sutton is HATED.

[Easy 6]

Originally Posted by saphojunkie

I wasn't talking directly about you, actually. But across the board, Sutton is HATED.

I wouldnt say HATED, but there were some legitimate bones to pick with him last year... some of which can atleast partially be explained by the terrible depth last year.

[milkman]

Originally Posted by scott free

I wouldnt say HATED, but there were some legitimate bones to pick with him last year... some of which can atleast partially be explained by the terrible depth last year.

It wasn't just depth.

It was lack of versatility and talent at key positions.

Kendrick Lewis to start.

But we had a corner who sucks in zone coverage, another that struggles in man, a third who is just learning the position, an ILB that couldn't cover and DEs that are one dimensional.

That's a shit ton of limitations to overcome.

[Easy 6]

Originally Posted by milkman

It wasn't just depth.

It was lack of versatility and talent at key positions.

Kendrick Lewis to start.

But we had a corner who sucks in zone coverage, another that struggles in man, a third who is just learning the position, an ILB that couldn't cover and DEs that are one dimensional.

That's a shit ton of limitations to overcome.

Agreed, he was hamstrung in many ways, its easier to see and forgive in hindsight.

[Coochie liquor]

Originally Posted by milkman

It wasn't just depth.

It was lack of versatility and talent at key positions.

Kendrick Lewis to start.

But we had a corner who sucks in zone coverage, another that struggles in man, a third who is just learning the position, an ILB that couldn't cover and DEs that are one dimensional.

That's a shit ton of limitations to overcome.

Exactly. It's hard to run your scheme when you're that limited, and then your top pass rushers get injured. I by no means think Sutton is perfect but he needs the type of players and depth to run HIS defense before we can make a true judgment of his abilities.

[WhiteWhale]

Originally Posted by milkman

It wasn't just depth.

It was lack of versatility and talent at key positions.

Kendrick Lewis to start.

But we had a corner who sucks in zone coverage, another that struggles in man, a third who is just learning the position, an ILB that couldn't cover and DEs that are one dimensional.

That's a shit ton of limitations to overcome.

Late last year KC's D was putting up 'career day defense' numbers. Dick Vermeil defense numbers.

You compare KC's 2013 D with the 2004 D in terms of talent... there's no excuse for them to be playing at that level. I understand the struggles, but there's a difference between struggling and being completely and utterly outclassed in every area. That should only happen when you're rolling with an entire squad of 2nd string caliber players like KC used to do back in DV's day.

You simply cannot convince me that the holes in KC"s D excuses how bad that D actually played late last season. The goddamn 2nd team defense completely outclassed them in the 1 game they played when you compare it to later in the season.

I've never seen a defense switch from performing so well to performing so poorly. I've seen better performances from more limited personnel.

[milkman]

Originally Posted by WhiteWhale

Late last year KC's D was putting up 'career day defense' numbers. Dick Vermeil defense numbers.

You compare KC's 2013 D with the 2004 D in terms of talent... there's no excuse for them to be playing at that level. I understand the struggles, but there's a difference between struggling and being completely and utterly outclassed in every area. That should only happen when you're rolling with an entire squad of 2nd string caliber players like KC used to do back in DV's day.

You simply cannot convince me that the holes in KC"s D excuses how bad that D actually played late last season. The goddamn 2nd team defense completely outclassed them in the 1 game they played when you compare it to later in the season.

I've never seen a defense switch from performing so well to performing so poorly. I've seen better performances from more limited personnel.

You combine those weaknesses with the loss of Houston to injury for most of the 2nd half, Hali playing at less than 100%, and a fatigued Poe, you have a recipe for collapse.

That first half performance was also enhanced by playing a bunch of scrub QBs and bad teams.

This defense wasn't nearly as good as it's first half performance, but neither was it as bad as it's second half.

There was something of a smoke and mirrors quality to the entire season.