Defense: Will We Still Be in the 3-4 in 2013?

[Setsuna]

Originally Posted by Sorter

odd front from the Ravens. Unlike our odd front, their DEs align in the 4-tech straight over the tackle as opposed to us which our DEs align in the 5-tech.



Under front from the Ravens. Weak side DE is playing the 3 tech, with a shaded NT, and the other DE playing the 4-tech. The strongside DE typically has 2-gap responsibilities.

I'm copying this. Might make it my desktop background. I need to know more about football.

[mcan]

It'll have a lot to do with our DC choice, but I think we are at least one decent good middle linebacker away from a successful 3-4 scheme. Say what you will about 1 gap, 2 gap, linemen... For the most part, if they are talented they can do the job with some coaching. But try running a 3-4 with only one decent middle linebacker and you'll be sorry. (see also: Chiefs).

[Sorter]

Originally Posted by mcan

It'll have a lot to do with our DC choice, but I think we are at least one decent good middle linebacker away from a successful 3-4 scheme. Say what you will about 1 gap, 2 gap, linemen... For the most part, if they are talented they can do the job with some coaching. But try running a 3-4 with only one decent middle linebacker and you'll be sorry. (see also: Chiefs).

If we switch to the 4-3 (Wide 9 I'm assuming), we need a new NT or 3-tech depending on where our DC wants to play Poe and assuming Powe/Bailey aren't the answer, a new DE, and a new Will and Mike (DJ is an acceptable stop gap playing the Will or Mike IMO.

[htismaqe]

Originally Posted by Sorter

If we switch to the 4-3 (Wide 9 I'm assuming), we need a new NT or 3-tech depending on where our DC wants to play Poe and assuming Powe/Bailey aren't the answer, a new DE, and a new Will and Mike (DJ is an acceptable stop gap playing the Will or Mike IMO.

DJ was thoroughly inconsistent playing OLB in the 4-3. I'd almost be inclined to say leave him at Mike but in reality, he really doesn't have a great position in the 4-3.

Hali and Houston both played DE in college but both are now hovering around 270 and have become used to playing standing up. Hali showed flashes in the 4-3 but he really came on in the 3-4.

Poe could probably play the 3T but we don't know if any of the other guys we have would fit the 4-3 at all. I'm convinced Dorsey's legs are shot - it was a concern coming out of college.

All in all, we could probably cobble together a 4-3 defense. But in the end, I think we'd ultimately have to replace ALL SEVEN guys in the front 7 to play it WELL.

[Exoter175]

This defense is built around a basic 3-4, with a few plug and play guys who are actually talented, I could see Andy Reid coming up with some crazy blitz happy 3-4 based scheme here in KC.

I wouldn't at all be surprised if he comes here, looks at our talent, and decides to mock up some 3-4 base cover 3 blitz schemes to incorporate Barry more actively in the blitz and to utilize him at his best, in my opinion, strength, which is ball hawking ability in run defense.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by Exoter175

This defense is built around a basic 3-4, with a few plug and play guys who are actually talented, I could see Andy Reid coming up with some crazy blitz happy 3-4 based scheme here in KC.

I wouldn't at all be surprised if he comes here, looks at our talent, and decides to mock up some 3-4 base cover 3 blitz schemes to incorporate Barry more actively in the blitz and to utilize him at his best, in my opinion, strength, which is ball hawking ability in run defense.

We have to be careful. Reid has a 3-4 coach in Bowles develop a 4-3 philosophy. Heckert turned the Browns' 2-gap 3-4 into a 4-3.

The good news is, while I don't trust Reid whatsoever with our defensive scheme, Heckert was doing a good job in Cleveland. But I'd much, much rather have Reid stay out of the defensive scheme and instead focus on hiring a DC whose scheme fits the players. Right now, that scheme has to be a 3-4, and it should be a progressive 1-gap vs. the 2-gap we play today.

[CoMoChief]

Putting DJ back at OLB in a 4-3 is going to kill his production.

[Gonzo]

I'd be surprised if they went back to a 4-3 right away, if at all. I don't see Johnson being nearly as effective in that type of setup. Maybe they'd switch in a couple years after making some personnel changes.

[htismaqe]

Originally Posted by Gonzo

I'd be surprised if they went back to a 4-3 right away, if at all. I don't see Johnson being nearly as effective in that type of setup. Maybe they'd switch in a couple years after making some personnel changes.

Johnson.

Or Hali. Or Houston. Or anybody else in the front 7.

We'd have to COMPLETELY gut the front 7 to run a 4-3 next year. No thanks.

[ct]

Move Hali back to LDE, get him to add some weight back. Houston moves to ROLB in the DT mold, with a run stuffing RDE inside him (who that is i'm not sure at this point). We've got Poe and Powe and Smith and all kinds of other big DT types to move inside, and quite likely some of them might function well in the RDE role w/ pass rushing as secondary. DJ as MLB or LOLB and use Siler or draftee at Mike.

We do need a CB and FS in the draft and/or FA, and additional pass rushers off the bench are a MUST!!

I think it could work well in a couple years.

[suds79]

Originally Posted by ct

Move Hali back to LDE, get him to add some weight back. Houston moves to ROLB in the DT mold, with a run stuffing RDE inside him.

What about this? Forget run stuffing RDE. League is about the pass anyways.

Lets just get as many pass rushers on the field as possible like the Giants do. Start Allen Bailey at RDE.

[ct]

Originally Posted by suds79

What about this? Forget run stuffing RDE. League is about the pass anyways.

Lets just get as many pass rushers on the field as possible like the Giants do. Start Allen Bailey at RDE.

i'm good w/ that, just remembering the days of DT. we didn't really need much of a pass rush from that DE spot. they pretty much bull rush the inside to keep double teams off of DT, very much like a 3-4 end on that side of the ball. now if we can find the perfect guy who excels at both, obviously that's ideal, but those dudes are rare.

[htismaqe]

Originally Posted by ct

i'm good w/ that, just remembering the days of DT. we didn't really need much of a pass rush from that DE spot. they pretty much bull rush the inside to keep double teams off of DT, very much like a 3-4 end on that side of the ball. now if we can find the perfect guy who excels at both, obviously that's ideal, but those dudes are rare.

We played a 30 or hybrid front for most of the time DT was here. Under Cowher is was true 3-4. They switched to a true 4-3 for a few games in 1992 under Dave Adolph but after seeing Derrick Thomas in pass coverage, they switched to a hybrid front. Gunther also tried 4-3 but ended up with a hybrid front with that stupid Falcon thing.

[CoMoChief]

I'm more than sure player personnel on the defensive side was discussed during that 9hr long meeting.

Hali is playing better as a OLB than he was at DE
DJ is much better playing at ILB than OLB
Houston is too small for DE, and is too slow for covering at OLB

It would be criminal to switch to a 43 now.

[htismaqe]

Originally Posted by CoMoChief

I'm more than sure player personnel on the defensive side was discussed during that 9hr long meeting.

Hali is playing better as a OLB than he was at DE
DJ is much better playing at ILB than OLB
Houston is too small for DE, and is too slow for covering at OLB

It would be criminal to switch to a 43 now.

This team needs offense.

I gotta think Reid is a smart guy. Get a QB, build up the offense, WIN.