Misc What is your stance on aliens? - Page 17

mr. tegu · 05-30-2015, 07:46 PM

I am curious to see where everyone stands on this. Asking about a stance on UFOs could be a different topic with different options so feel to give your thoughts on that as well.

stevieray · 06-02-2015, 05:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Easy 6

Its pretty hilarious that some people want to slam my "appeal to the authority" of people like the highest military officer in the US, or the head of the CIA... but then they turn right around and quote Neil Tyson as a rebuttal.

If "appeals to authority" are good enough for them, they're good enough for me.

"For the government to continue to maintain that ufo's are nonexistent in the face of documents already released and other cogent evidence presented, is puerile and in a sense an insult to the American people".

"I have begun to feel that there is a tendency in 20th century science to forget that there will be a 21st century science, and indeed a 30th century science, from which vantage points of our knowledge of our universe may appear quite different than it does to us. We suffer perhaps, from a temporal provincialism, a form of arrogance that has always irritated posterity".

"Ridicule is not part of the scientific method and the public should not be taught that it is".

Those are three quotes from J. Allen Hynek, one of the leading scientists for Project Blue Book.

"I know other astronauts share my feelings, and we know that the government is sitting on hard evidence of ufo's". - Colonel Gordon Cooper.

"The phenomenon of ufo's does exist, and it must be treated seriously". - Mikhail Gorbachev

"Interstellar space flight is far beyond our present our present technical capabilities, but there seems to be no fundamental physical objections to preclude, from our own vantage point, the possibility of its development by other civilizations". - Carl Sagan

"I would do it (study ufo's), but before agreeing to do it, we must insist on full access to the disc recovered. For instance in the L.A. case, the Army grabbed it and would not let us have it for cursory examination". - J. Edgar Hoover

"Its time for the truth to be brought out... behind the scenes high ranking Air Force personnel are soberly concerned about the ufo's. But through official secrecy and ridicule, many citizens are led to believe the ufo's are nonsense. I urge immediate congressional action to reduce the dangers from secrecy about ufo's". Admiral Roscoe Hillenkoetter, first director of the CIA 1947-1950

So again, no amount of disbelief can change their words... this is my last post here, dont know why I even bother, but theres plenty more where these came from for the enquiring minds who arent so sure they have it all figured out.

the quote of Neal's pretty much says he prolly shouldn't ever debate the subject of God.

**Easy 6** · 06-02-2015, 05:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stevieray

the quote of Neal's pretty much says he prolly shouldn't ever debate the subject of God.

I forget exactly what his quote was, but he's very much the typical scientist in that respect... if they cant put it under a microscope... or kinda more to the point, dont want to put it under their microscope for fear of ridicule, then it doesnt exist.

Thank God for guys like Friedman, Hynek and Kelleher.

eDave · 06-02-2015, 05:45 PM

Sweet Daddy Hate · 06-02-2015, 05:55 PM

Advanced hologram technology; nothing to see here folks. (literally)

**Easy 6** · 06-02-2015, 06:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sweet Daddy Williams

Advanced hologram technology; nothing to see here folks. (literally)

So, even back in the 40's-50's-60's it was all just an incredibly complex and technologically waaay ahead of its time government hoax?

Its fooled astronauts and Blue Book scientists, among others?

Thats ****ing impressive, seriously.

Sweet Daddy Hate · 06-02-2015, 06:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Easy 6

So, even back in the 40's-50's-60's it was all just an incredibly complex and technologically waaay ahead of its time government hoax?

Its fooled astronauts and Blue Book scientists, among others?

Thats ****ing impressive, seriously.

Much like an Alex Smith-led Chiefs, I do not believe.

Fish · 06-02-2015, 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Easy 6

Its pretty hilarious that some people want to slam my "appeal to the authority" of people like the highest military officer in the US, or the head of the CIA... but then they turn right around and quote Neil Tyson as a rebuttal.

If "appeals to authority" are good enough for them, they're good enough for me.

It's funny that when you get called out for the logical fallacy of Appeal to Authority, you double down with even more Appeal to Authority...

I never mentioned NDT, but it's nice that you admit to the logical fallacy...

**Easy 6** · 06-02-2015, 07:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fish

It's funny that when you get called out for the logical fallacy of Appeal to Authority, you double down with even more Appeal to Authority...

I never mentioned NDT, but it's nice that you admit to the logical fallacy...

How about you stop talking about logical fallacies and try to refute the quoted persons, try to change their words through a series of mental gymnastics... and when you're finished, please quote the black science dude as a rebuttal.

Thank you.

**Dave Lane** · 06-02-2015, 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SeeingRed

Roswell supposedly contained valuable in formation....thats was in 1947 correct? Less than 10 years later space travel started. Coincidence?

Listen aliens that crashed their craft aren't going to have anything valuable on board that we could utilize. If they're too stupid to land their craft after a multi trillion mile journey I have no interest in what they have.

**Dave Lane** · 06-02-2015, 07:43 PM

And why the **** do people keep thinking UFOs are going to hover a few hundred feet up. That has to be the stupidest idea ever. We can read a license plate from space but these advanced creatures have to hover 500 feet off the ground. reeruned.

Fish · 06-02-2015, 07:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Easy 6

How about you stop talking about logical fallacies and try to refute the quoted persons, try to change their words through a series of mental gymnastics... and when you're finished, please quote the black science dude as a rebuttal.

Thank you.

Well that's the entire point of the Appeal to Authority fallacy. A handful of people's personal claims aren't to be taken more seriously than a mountain of evidence to the contrary. No matter who that individual is. The complete lack of physical evidence for UFOs isn't a fact overcome by individual eyewitness testimony or opinion. And crazy youtube hoax videos and alleged eyewitness accounts aside, there is a complete lack of physical evidence.

mr. tegu · 06-02-2015, 07:51 PM

So what you are saying is the only UFOs that might exist are those that are seen with the naked eye? If they are alien they can only be millions of miles away or a few hundred feet above the earth and nothing in between?

**Easy 6** · 06-02-2015, 07:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fish

Well that's the entire point of the Appeal to Authority fallacy. A handful of people's personal claims aren't to be taken more seriously than a mountain of evidence to the contrary. No matter who that individual is. The complete lack of physical evidence for UFOs isn't a fact overcome by individual eyewitness testimony or opinion. And crazy youtube hoax videos and alleged eyewitness accounts aside, there is a complete lack of physical evidence.

So no matter how many witnesses come forward that are above and beyond credible, some being the highest officers in American government, no matter how many FOIA documents are released that spell out the reality in extremely plain terms... you wont even give it a second thought until you can crawl up inside a ufo?

Fact is, you suffer from the same "temporal provincialism" that Hynek described... nothing short of the object in front of you will change your mind, thats not scientific thinking at all, there is MORE than enough documented evidence out there in the form of air traffic controller radar readouts alone, to merit extremely serious scientific study.

I dont give a shit how smart you are about everything else, you're wearing some serious blinders about this subject... its unbelievable, its sad, and I'm finished with this.

keg in kc · 06-02-2015, 08:23 PM

This is like a religious discussion. People just pick their side and go with it.

Personally I think the universe is most likely teeming with life. Whether anything other than native Earth live has visited here or not I don't know. UAP's could be something closed system (meaning terrestrial) and not require extraterrestial origin.

And there's logical fallacies all over the place. The biggest argument to the contrary is generally that the distances required to travel are impossible. Of course everyone arguing the point conveniently leaves out the caveat "at our current level of understanding". A hundred years from now, a thousand years from now, two months from now, who knows, our own understanding of what's possible and what's not may change completely. We act like we're at the pinnacle of science, that we know enough to make hard and fast statements, when the reality is that our understanding is not even in its infancy yet. We're still fetal.

Which doesn't mean that anything other than us has ever been here. Just that we're unbelievably arrogant to believe so, simply because we can't traverse the distance.

DenverChief · 06-02-2015, 08:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sweet Daddy Williams

Much like an Alex Smith-led Chiefs, I do not believe.

Sounds like a KU basketball fan right before losing to KState

View Poll Results: What is your stance on aliens?
They come here and the government has some understanding and talks with them, has ships and bodies, and knows something about what they are.	25	16.23%
They come here, and the government investigates sightings and keeps secrets and has evidence but they don't know much.	31	20.13%
They exist and they come here but no one (including government) has any solid physical evidence or shocking secrets.	11	7.14%
They exist and are intelligent and could come here but they don't.	18	11.69%
Intelligent life exists in some form but can't come here because of distance/technology challenges.	54	35.06%
Something exists out there somewhere but it isn't intelligent.	8	5.19%
There are no life forms anywhere else.	7	4.55%
Voters: 154. You may not vote on this poll

05-30-2015, 07:46 PM
mr. tegu Forever Royal Join Date: Mar 2012 Casino cash: $1971300	What is your stance on aliens? I am curious to see where everyone stands on this. Asking about a stance on UFOs could be a different topic with different options so feel to give your thoughts on that as well.
Posts: 24,059

06-02-2015, 05:45 PM	#243
eDave Banned Join Date: Jan 2013 Casino cash: $9998560
Posts: 53,803

06-02-2015, 05:55 PM	#244
Sweet Daddy Hate Unsparing Join Date: Aug 2008 Casino cash: $10004900	Advanced hologram technology; nothing to see here folks. (literally) __________________ 1. Merciless, severe. 2. Given freely and generously. 100% refusal to overrate 20 year Head Coaches with ZERO **ing rings as a Head Coach. CP's Official Professor of 'Dem Blues for 2019/2020!**
Posts: 77,135

06-02-2015, 07:43 PM	#250
Dave Lane Space Cadet and Aczabel Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Kanab, UT, USA Casino cash: $9333275 VARSITY	And why the **** do people keep thinking UFOs are going to hover a few hundred feet up. That has to be the stupidest idea ever. We can read a license plate from space but these advanced creatures have to hover 500 feet off the ground. reeruned. __________________ Thanks, Trump for the civics lesson. We are learning so much about RICO, espionage, sedition, impeachment, the 25th Amendment, order of succession, nepotism, separation of powers, 1st Amendment, obstruction of justice, the emoluments clause, conflicts of interest, collusion, sanctions, oligarchs, money laundering and so much more.
Posts: 40,584

06-02-2015, 07:51 PM	#252
mr. tegu Forever Royal Join Date: Mar 2012 Casino cash: $1971300	So what you are saying is the only UFOs that might exist are those that are seen with the naked eye? If they are alien they can only be millions of miles away or a few hundred feet above the earth and nothing in between?
Posts: 24,059

06-02-2015, 08:23 PM	#254
keg in kc oxymoron Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: OP/KC/Whatever Casino cash: $9556299	This is like a religious discussion. People just pick their side and go with it. Personally I think the universe is most likely teeming with life. Whether anything other than native Earth live has visited here or not I don't know. UAP's could be something closed system (meaning terrestrial) and not require extraterrestial origin. And there's logical fallacies all over the place. The biggest argument to the contrary is generally that the distances required to travel are impossible. Of course everyone arguing the point conveniently leaves out the caveat "at our current level of understanding". A hundred years from now, a thousand years from now, two months from now, who knows, our own understanding of what's possible and what's not may change completely. We act like we're at the pinnacle of science, that we know enough to make hard and fast statements, when the reality is that our understanding is not even in its infancy yet. We're still fetal. Which doesn't mean that anything other than us has ever been here. Just that we're unbelievably arrogant to believe so, simply because we can't traverse the distance.
Posts: 58,682