Chiefs Hemingway so far - Page 5

**AustinChief** · 03:38 PM

So, how does everyone feel about Junior so far this year?

I am disappointed with the amount of targets (9) and he has 1 drop (and it was a bad one) but the rest of his stats are decent. 9.8 yds per reception. 24 yards after catch. And all 4 of his catches have been for 1st downs.

The one thing that has been impressive has been his downfield blocking. Of our WRs he is head and shoulders beyond anyone in this category. I'd actually like to see a stat for yardage on runs/screens/swing passes to his side when he is on the field.

So any thoughts on why he isn't seeing the field more(as a receiving threat and not just a blocker)? I know Htismaqe will say it's because he has trouble learning the offense(any offense) and this may be true. I agree with this to an extent but I expected him to be able to pick it up by now.

O.city · 10-02-2014, 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Detoxing

You claimed that McCluster was being force fed. Isn't that a coaches decision? Or do you just think Smith likes McCluster's hair more than Hemingway's?

By the previous regime coaching staff, he was force fed to justify draft slot.

ModSocks · 10-02-2014, 02:19 PM

Look at the way the Chiefs spread the ball around. Look at all of the different players that were targeted on Monday night. Reid and Smith spread the ball around, no question about that.

So why is Hemingway not getting as many targets in a system that LOVES to spread the ball around despite the fact that he's frequently on the field?

Maybe...just maybe....he's not as good as you think he is.

ModSocks · 10-02-2014, 02:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city

By the previous regime coaching staff, he was force fed to justify draft slot.

I didn't realize Reid and Dorsey felt an allegiance to Pioli's picks, considering his best year came under those two.

O.city · 10-02-2014, 02:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Detoxing

I didn't realize Reid and Dorsey felt an allegiance to Pioli's picks, considering his best year came under those two.

In the flow of th offense, yes he was targeted. None of that get it to him in space blah blah. Or having him at running back.

And after his best year he was let walk and replaced by a fourth round rookie.

Again, he was a decent possession slot wr, picked about 3 rounds too soon

O.city · 10-02-2014, 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Detoxing

Look at the way the Chiefs spread the ball around. Look at all of the different players that were targeted on Monday night. Reid and Smith spread the ball around, no question about that.

So why is Hemingway not getting as many targets in a system that LOVES to spread the ball around despite the fact that he's frequently on the field?

Maybe...just maybe....he's not as good as you think he is.

We threw it 26 times. Of course the majority of those should go to Bowe/Kelce/etc, they're better.

Me saying I think Hemingway is better than Dex speaks to the fact that I don't think Dexter was very good,more so than anything with Hemingway.

ModSocks · 10-02-2014, 02:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city

In the flow of th offense, yes he was targeted. None of that get it to him in space blah blah. Or having him at running back.

And after his best year he was let walk and replaced by a fourth round rookie.

Again, he was a decent possession slot wr, picked about 3 rounds too soon

Judging by the players taken in that draft, not sure how you can come to that conclusion. He's a top 5-8 player in his ROUND. It was an awful draft. Pure shit. And out of that draft we got a player who produced fore us, which is more than 75% of the league can say about their 2010 2nd round picks.

Your point was that Hemingway is better. There is nothing to support that argument. And devolving it into "He was drafted too high" doesn't change that, but it does show where the source of your bias comes from.

**The Franchise** · 10-02-2014, 02:29 PM

Hemingway is what...like 4th or 5th read when he's on the field? That's not going to get you a lot of targets.

Bowe, Charles, Fasano, Avery, Kelce are all higher than him when it comes to reads. And it's not like their running plays where Hemingway is the primary read.

ModSocks · 10-02-2014, 02:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city

We threw it 26 times. Of course the majority of those should go to Bowe/Kelce/etc, they're better.

Me saying I think Hemingway is better than Dex speaks to the fact that I don't think Dexter was very good,more so than anything with Hemingway.

If Dex wasn't very good, then what does that say about Hemingway? No matter which angle you come from, your argument doesn't hold water.

Not only that, but the only difference between last year's offensive players and this years is Kelce.

Despite pretty much having the same players, Dexter still saw more targets last season than Hemingway is seeing. Hell, he saw more targets even with Hemingway ON THE TEAM.

Why? According to you, Hemingway is better than Dexter. The results and the facts simply to work with that line of thinking.

**RealSNR** · 10-02-2014, 02:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pestilence

Hemingway is what...like 4th or 5th read when he's on the field? That's not going to get you a lot of targets.

Bowe, Charles, Fasano, Avery, Kelce are all higher than him when it comes to reads. And it's not like their running plays where Hemingway is the primary read.

That's what I don't get. There's this surge of people who are excited to replace Hemingway.

Hemingway has a job to do and he does it. He's Hank Basket or James Thrash or whatever shitty WR you want to compare him to that was 3rd/4th on the depth chart in Philly.

The Chiefs WRs don't suck because Hemingway is the 4th option. They suck because of options #1-3.

ModSocks · 10-02-2014, 02:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pestilence

Hemingway is what...like 4th or 5th read when he's on the field? That's not going to get you a lot of targets.

Bowe, Charles, Fasano, Avery, Kelce are all higher than him when it comes to reads. And it's not like their running plays where Hemingway is the primary read.

There are two seperate arguments here, and yes i agree with you. The other targets are higher up on the list hence the reason Hemingway isn't targeted that often.

The question is, why isn't he higher up on the list? Probably because he isn't as A. Reliable or B. Simply as good.

Yet McCluster seemed to get his targets despite having those exact players on the team.

Why?

ModSocks · 10-02-2014, 02:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SNR

That's what I don't get. There's this surge of people who are excited to replace Hemingway.

Hemingway has a job to do and he does it. He's Hank Basket or James Thrash or whatever shitty WR you want to compare him to that was 3rd/4th on the depth chart in Philly.

The Chiefs WRs don't suck because Hemingway is the 4th option. They suck because of options #1-3.

Right. I agree.

He is.....what he is.

**AustinChief** · 10-02-2014, 02:37 PM

Let's look at the first drive of the season.

3 yd Run - No Hemingway
6 yd Run - Hemingway as a potential blocker
14 yard swing pass - Hemingway as a potential blocker
3 yd Pass - Hemingway wide open (not targeted)
4 yd FB run - No Hemingway
Passing play/Smith Sacked - Hemingway WIDE open.

I'm done checking this game because A)it's depressing and B)Bowe was out so that is going to skew things.

I'll check a few more drives from other games and I'll bet you you'll see the same situation.

Mr. Laz · 10-02-2014, 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AustinChief

No doubt in my mind he is better than Dex. The few times he has been on the field this year his blocking has absolutely been fantastic. I have seen multiple plays where if Dex had been in the same position we wouldn't have picked up the extra 3-5 yards we did.

It's not sexy but it is effective.

My problem is, he is rarely put in a position that ISN'T blocking.

Also, where the hell do you get the idea that isn't quick enough to get open? He gets open the majority of the times he is asked to, the rest of the time he is blocking for a run/screen/swing pass. Check his 3 cone time.

The only legitimate argument I have heard knocking him comes from Htis... the coaches aren't using him because he is limited in his knowledge of the offense. I'm just not sure I buy that but I have no proof against it.

beyond stupid

Hemingway might have the potential to be better than McCluster but until he actually DOES IT then he is just a ST guy who can block.

So you think that Reid just doesn't feel like using Hemingway for no reason? There is a reason and since Hemingway seems to have the physical ability it only make sense that it's the mental aspect of the game.

McCluster wasn't great but at least he actually DID something.

still waiting on Hemingway

ModSocks · 10-02-2014, 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AustinChief

Let's look at the first drive of the season.

3 yd Run - No Hemingway
6 yd Run - Hemingway as a potential blocker
14 yard swing pass - Hemingway as a potential blocker
3 yd Pass - Hemingway wide open (not targeted)
4 yd FB run - No Hemingway
Passing play/Smith Sacked - Hemingway WIDE open.

I'm done checking this game because A)it's depressing and B)Bowe was out so that is going to skew things.

I'll check a few more drives from other games and I'll bet you you'll see the same situation.

Don't waste your time. You can sub in any player and make the same silly argument. Change the name to Avery and the results will be the same.

And it STILL has nothing to do with why Hemingway isn't being targeted. We already know that he's a good blocking receiver.

**The Franchise** · 10-02-2014, 02:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AustinChief

Let's look at the first drive of the season.

3 yd Run - No Hemingway
6 yd Run - Hemingway as a potential blocker
14 yard swing pass - Hemingway as a potential blocker
3 yd Pass - Hemingway wide open (not targeted)
4 yd FB run - No Hemingway
Passing play/Smith Sacked - Hemingway WIDE open.

I'm done checking this game because A)it's depressing and B)Bowe was out so that is going to skew things.

I'll check a few more drives from other games and I'll bet you you'll see the same situation.

So then this was against the Titans.

Either Smith doesn't have the trust in Hemingway to look his way when he's in trouble or Hemingway isn't anything but the 3rd or 4th read on a play. And if the latter is the case....our offensive line wouldn't let Smith get past his 2nd read before he had to run.

10-02-2014, 12:32 PM
AustinChief Administrator Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Austin Casino cash: $2669112	Hemingway so far So, how does everyone feel about Junior so far this year? I am disappointed with the amount of targets (9) and he has 1 drop (and it was a bad one) but the rest of his stats are decent. 9.8 yds per reception. 24 yards after catch. And all 4 of his catches have been for 1st downs. The one thing that has been impressive has been his downfield blocking. Of our WRs he is head and shoulders beyond anyone in this category. I'd actually like to see a stat for yardage on runs/screens/swing passes to his side when he is on the field. So any thoughts on why he isn't seeing the field more(as a receiving threat and not just a blocker)? I know Htismaqe will say it's because he has trouble learning the offense(any offense) and this may be true. I agree with this to an extent but I expected him to be able to pick it up by now. Last edited by AustinChief; 10-03-2014 at 03:38 PM..
Posts: 19,495

10-02-2014, 02:19 PM	#62
ModSocks Needs more middle fingers Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: San Diego Casino cash: $4284563	Look at the way the Chiefs spread the ball around. Look at all of the different players that were targeted on Monday night. Reid and Smith spread the ball around, no question about that. So why is Hemingway not getting as many targets in a system that LOVES to spread the ball around despite the fact that he's frequently on the field? Maybe...just maybe....he's not as good as you think he is. __________________ Life is like a dick. Sometimes it gets hard for no reason, but it can't stay hard forever.
Posts: 64,332

10-02-2014, 02:29 PM	#67
The Franchise Most Valuable Villain Join Date: Dec 2006 Casino cash: $3105047	Hemingway is what...like 4th or 5th read when he's on the field? That's not going to get you a lot of targets. Bowe, Charles, Fasano, Avery, Kelce are all higher than him when it comes to reads. And it's not like their running plays where Hemingway is the primary read.
Posts: 92,178

10-02-2014, 02:37 PM	#72
AustinChief Administrator Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Austin Casino cash: $2669112	Let's look at the first drive of the season. 3 yd Run - No Hemingway 6 yd Run - Hemingway as a potential blocker 14 yard swing pass - Hemingway as a potential blocker 3 yd Pass - Hemingway wide open (not targeted) 4 yd FB run - No Hemingway Passing play/Smith Sacked - Hemingway WIDE open. I'm done checking this game because A)it's depressing and B)Bowe was out so that is going to skew things. I'll check a few more drives from other games and I'll bet you you'll see the same situation.
Posts: 19,495