Netflix: Making a Murderer

[BigRichard]

Originally Posted by Graystoke

I don't understand what you are saying. EDTA is an anticoagulant. The minute it hits the test tube, the sample becomes homogenous. So why wouldn't there be any EDTA on the swabs?

And for that purple cap (EDTA) to have a hole through the top is very indicative of a draw down, unless of course they have a chain of custody to prove there was a lab draw down.

The needle hole is not suspicious in my mind, the fact the evidence tape had been opened is to me though.

[Swanman]

Originally Posted by BigRichard

The needle hole is not suspicious in my mind, the fact the evidence tape had been opened is to me though.

In the documentary it said that the lab did not stick needles through the cap. I would assume they just remove the cap then for draws. Coupled with the clearly broken evidence tape, there's some 'splainin' to do.

[Graystoke]

Originally Posted by Swanman

In the documentary it said that the lab did not stick needles through the cap. I would assume they just remove the cap then for draws. Coupled with the clearly broken evidence tape, there's some 'splainin' to do.

The broken evidence tape is huge. It is common for labs to not open the cap and instead draw out of the tube. In fact many laboratory instruments do this. But again there would be lab chain of custody, why they drew out of said test tube, and testing parameters to back this.

[Swanman]

Originally Posted by Graystoke

The broken evidence tape is huge. It is common for labs to not open the cap and instead draw out of the tube. In fact many laboratory instruments do this. But again there would be lab chain of custody, why they drew out of said test tube, and testing parameters to back this.

I believe all they had was Lenk signing the log to access the evidence. Nothing about anything else. That's very damning.

[Chiefnj2]

According to Jessica McBride at OnMilwaukee, a nurse “who originally drew Steven Avery’s blood and put it into the vial” was originally scheduled to appear at the Avery trial to testify that she had put the hole in the rubber stopper when she originally put the blood in the vial. In fact, it was very common for these vials to have needle holes because that’s how the blood was added into the vials.
Furthermore, two national experts - including the chair of the committee that writes the industry standards on drawing blood samples - told OnMilwaukee that such blood vials are supposed to have holes pierced in their rubber stoppers. According to the experts, that’s how the blood gets into the vial.
Not only is it not uncommon, but it’s the way the vials - in this case, according to court records, a purple-stopped Vacutainer - are supposed to work.
Moreover, an expert “said that the only way such a blood vial would not have a hole is if the medical professional violated standards and did not properly insert the blood in the tube and instead just ‘dumped it in there.’”
The prosecution ultimately didn’t call the nurse because they felt it was unnecessary, that they had a strong enough case without her (the nurse has since passed away).
And what about the broken seal? That can be explained, too.
A review of court records in the case shows that the court was told by the defense that then Manitowoc County DA E. James Fitzgerald and members of Avery’s defense team met and opened packages of evidence in the 1985 court file with the court’s approval to determine what to send out for additional tests. On June 19, 2002 at 12:25 p.m., Fitzgerald opened the box with the blood vial in it and closed it again two minutes later. It was believed the evidence tape seal was broken at that time, the court records say.
In other words, the blood vial wasn’t as big a smoking gun as depicted in the documentary, and there’s some question about whether the blood needed to be tested for EDTA at all, if evidence that it had been tampered with could so easily be explained away.

[dlphg9]

Originally Posted by Chiefnj2

According to Jessica McBride at OnMilwaukee, a nurse “who originally drew Steven Avery’s blood and put it into the vial” was originally scheduled to appear at the Avery trial to testify that she had put the hole in the rubber stopper when she originally put the blood in the vial. In fact, it was very common for these vials to have needle holes because that’s how the blood was added into the vials.
Furthermore, two national experts - including the chair of the committee that writes the industry standards on drawing blood samples - told OnMilwaukee that such blood vials are supposed to have holes pierced in their rubber stoppers. According to the experts, that’s how the blood gets into the vial.
Not only is it not uncommon, but it’s the way the vials - in this case, according to court records, a purple-stopped Vacutainer - are supposed to work.
Moreover, an expert “said that the only way such a blood vial would not have a hole is if the medical professional violated standards and did not properly insert the blood in the tube and instead just ‘dumped it in there.’”
The prosecution ultimately didn’t call the nurse because they felt it was unnecessary, that they had a strong enough case without her (the nurse has since passed away).
And what about the broken seal? That can be explained, too.
A review of court records in the case shows that the court was told by the defense that then Manitowoc County DA E. James Fitzgerald and members of Avery’s defense team met and opened packages of evidence in the 1985 court file with the court’s approval to determine what to send out for additional tests. On June 19, 2002 at 12:25 p.m., Fitzgerald opened the box with the blood vial in it and closed it again two minutes later. It was believed the evidence tape seal was broken at that time, the court records say.
In other words, the blood vial wasn’t as big a smoking gun as depicted in the documentary, and there’s some question about whether the blood needed to be tested for EDTA at all, if evidence that it had been tampered with could so easily be explained away.

That's what I was trying to say

[GloucesterChief]

Originally Posted by dlphg9

That's what I was trying to say

I have had my blood drawn many times due to being a Type II diabetic. The needle they use is very thin and leaves an incredibly small hole that is almost invisible to the naked eye. Not the huge hole shown in the documentary. Also, a sticker is usually put over the top of the vial indicating date of draw and who it was drawn from. Usually with a barcode.

[dlphg9]

Originally Posted by GloucesterChief

I have had my blood drawn many times due to being a Type II diabetic. The needle they use is very thin and leaves an incredibly small hole that is almost invisible to the naked eye. Not the huge hole shown in the documentary. Also, a sticker is usually put over the top of the vial indicating date of draw and who it was drawn from. Usually with a barcode.

I've worked as a lab tech the last 6 years and have done over 1000 draws. I always put my sticker on the side of the tube. Sometimes you are able to see the hole from where the needle went into the rubber stopper and sometimes blood pools on the rubber stopper.

[Fire Me Boy!]

Originally Posted by dlphg9

I've worked as a lab tech the last 6 years and have done over 1000 draws. I always put my sticker on the side of the tube. Sometimes you are able to see the hole from where the needle went into the rubber stopper and sometimes blood pools on the rubber stopper.

I get mine drawn 1-2 times per month, and the sticker always goes on the side. Haven't looked for s hole, but I will next time.

[PAChiefsGuy]

Originally Posted by Chiefnj2

According to Jessica McBride at OnMilwaukee, a nurse “who originally drew Steven Avery’s blood and put it into the vial” was originally scheduled to appear at the Avery trial to testify that she had put the hole in the rubber stopper when she originally put the blood in the vial. In fact, it was very common for these vials to have needle holes because that’s how the blood was added into the vials.
Furthermore, two national experts - including the chair of the committee that writes the industry standards on drawing blood samples - told OnMilwaukee that such blood vials are supposed to have holes pierced in their rubber stoppers. According to the experts, that’s how the blood gets into the vial.
Not only is it not uncommon, but it’s the way the vials - in this case, according to court records, a purple-stopped Vacutainer - are supposed to work.
Moreover, an expert “said that the only way such a blood vial would not have a hole is if the medical professional violated standards and did not properly insert the blood in the tube and instead just ‘dumped it in there.’”
The prosecution ultimately didn’t call the nurse because they felt it was unnecessary, that they had a strong enough case without her (the nurse has since passed away).
And what about the broken seal? That can be explained, too.
A review of court records in the case shows that the court was told by the defense that then Manitowoc County DA E. James Fitzgerald and members of Avery’s defense team met and opened packages of evidence in the 1985 court file with the court’s approval to determine what to send out for additional tests. On June 19, 2002 at 12:25 p.m., Fitzgerald opened the box with the blood vial in it and closed it again two minutes later. It was believed the evidence tape seal was broken at that time, the court records say.
In other words, the blood vial wasn’t as big a smoking gun as depicted in the documentary, and there’s some question about whether the blood needed to be tested for EDTA at all, if evidence that it had been tampered with could so easily be explained away.

Very compelling evidence but if it was that much of a slam dunk then why the hell were the cops planting evidence? Which I think we all can agree they did.

Sorry.. Not buying it.. The guy was setup.. It's pretty obvious.. It doesn't take a genius to figure it out...