KC Star-Chiefs defend decision to draft Tyreek Hill

[DaneMcCloud]

http://www.kansascity.com/sports/nfl...#storylink=cpy

If there was any doubt as to whether or not Hill was guilty, this article removes all doubt.

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For the three-plus years they’ve been in Kansas City, Chiefs coach Andy Reid and general manager John Dorsey have consistently stated their desire to find high-character players who love football. They have said this time and time again, over and over. But on Saturday, at about 2:14 p.m., the Chiefs used a fifth-round draft pick to select a dynamic return man with a history that runs counter to all that.

The Chiefs used the 165th overall pick to select West Alabama receiver Tyreek Hill, who was kicked off Oklahoma State’s team on Dec. 12, 2014, after he was arrested and accused of punching and choking his pregnant girlfriend. Hill eventually pleaded guilty Aug. 21, 2015, to domestic abuse by strangulation. He was sentenced to three years’ probation — which ends Aug. 15, 2018 — and also was fined $500 plus fees and ordered to pay $263.14 in restitution.

The Chiefs were aware of the incident, but that didn’t deter them from selecting Hill, who transferred to West Alabama and appeared in 11 games in 2015 before blazing a 4.25-second 40-yard dash at his pro day in March. The decision thrust the Chiefs into the conversation about the sincerity of the NFL’s efforts to prevent and discourage domestic violence. Both Greg Hardy and Ray Rice, two players who have been thrust into the spotlight because of domestic violence issues in their personal lives, are currently unsigned.

Fan reaction to the move — which comes four years after the Chiefs’ Jovan Belcher murdered his girlfriend and committed suicide in the parking lot of the team training facility — was fast and swift, as fans flooded the franchise’s Twitter account with negative replies following the announcement of the pick. And in an unusual move, Dorsey met with reporters Saturday evening — he normally waits until Monday after the draft for his final press conference — to discuss Hill’s selection, along with Reid, and attempted to ease concerns.

“I just want everybody to understand that we have done our due diligence with regards to full vetting each one of our draft-class members,” said Dorsey, who added that he had “long discussions” with Reid and Chiefs chairman Clark Hunt before making the selection. “We would never put anybody in this community in harm’s way.”

Reid agreed, reiterating that the organization has “done its homework” on Hill and asking fans to essentially give them the benefit of the doubt, since they say they can’t publicly discuss whatever details they were able to dig up about Hill’s case. “There has to be a certain trust here, but there’s just things that we can’t go into and go through,” Reid said. “We want people to understand, like Dorsey said, we’re not going to do anything to put this community or this organization in a bind. “We uncovered every possible stone that we possibly could, and we feel very comfortable with that part of it.”

During their extensive research on Hill’s background — the Chiefs spoke to ex-teammates and coaches, but Reid wouldn’t say whether they spoke to the woman who was assaulted — the Chiefs also became enamored with Hill’s talent. The 5-foot-10, 185-pound Hill, who spent the first two seasons of his career at Garden City (Kan.) Community College, was a budding star at Oklahoma State, as he led the Cowboys with 1,811 all-purpose yards as a junior in 2014. “He’s got world-class speed,” said area scout Ryne Nutt, who served as the lead scout on Hill. “He ran a 4.25. I was at his pro day and it was one of the better pro days I was at all year. The kid’s explosive, he’s fast-twitched; he can obviously run and he’s very good with the ball in his hands.”

Nutt said Chiefs special-teams coach Dave Toub compared Hill’s return skills to Atlanta return specialist Devin Hester. “He’s probably the best returner I’ve done since I’ve been in the NFL — just elite explosiveness,” said Nutt, a seven-year NFL veteran scout. Hill’s 996 combined return yards in 2014 were the second-most in the nation, and on the field, he figures to give the Chiefs a much-needed alternative as a slot receiver and punt-return option to De’Anthony Thomas, who missed the last month of the 2015 season for undisclosed reasons but has rejoined the team. Hill could also help out on kick returns, where starter Knile Davis has been shopped all offseason. Yet, for all Hill’s electrifying talent, his past dominated discussion on draft day, and with good reason.

According to a Stillwater Police Department incident report, Hill got into a verbal altercation that turned physical with his girlfriend, who was two months pregnant with his child at the time. Hill allegedly punched her in the face and stomach and also choked her twice, busting open her lip and leaving her with a bruised left eye, according to the police report. The police officer’s notes also indicated that the right side of her neck was red where Hill choked her and she complained that her head and stomach hurt from the blows. Hill’s girlfriend also told police that he’d been physical with her before, “but it had not been this bad, just a lot of manhandling but Hill has never hit her,” according to the report.

Reid and Dorsey stressed the Chiefs understand the sensitivity of the matter, especially in regards to domestic violence on the NFL level, with both of them even attempting to speak on a personal level, with Dorsey mentioning that he has a son and a daughter, and Reid mentioning that his wife, Tammy, has contributed to multiple domestic-violence prevention ventures over the last 14 years.

“The unique part of this — and I think the part that we have to understand is — very seldom does the other side try to right the wrong,” Reid said, his voice starting to crack. “We see this kid trying to do that — he’s trying to make the effort to right the wrong — and I think that can be a great example to so many people that have fallen into this situation.” Both men firmly stressed that the Chiefs wouldn’t have made the decision to draft Hill if they didn’t believe he was on the right track. “Before you’re given a second chance, you better be doing the right things,” Reid said. “So he’s been in counseling, he’ll continue to be in counseling, we’ve got a great support system here for that with quality people. “We feel good that he’s trying to right a wrong, a big wrong. But he’s trying to do better, and be a better person for it. And that part, we feel very confident in.”

The Chiefs said that over the last year, Hill has had to complete a domestic-abuse evaluation, an anger-management course and a yearlong batterer’s program. And during a teleconference with Kansas City media on Saturday, Hill expressed regret for his role in the incident, and noted that the teams that interviewed him during the predraft process — the Chiefs showed the most interest, he added — asked him plenty about the incident.

“I got questions everywhere I went, so it wasn’t anything new to me,” Hill said. “I would have just told them straight up, ‘I’m trying to move on from that. I’m trying to be a better young man. I’m trying to show who I truly am.’ Stuff like that. “The only thing I did say was, ‘I’m sorry. I messed up. I embarrassed the program at OSU. I embarrassed the coaches. I embarrassed a lot of people back at home.’ That’s it. That’s how I explained it. I really don’t want to go into detail.” Asked what he’s done to improve himself and avoid a similar incident, Hill said, “I just try to choose my friends wisely. I’m not trying to point any fingers at anybody, but I’ve just got to be better at choosing my friends and who I hang around, stuff like that.”

Hill also expressed appreciation to the Chiefs for taking a chance on him.

“It’s life-changing, for real, to just be around guys like that I’ve watched on TV all of my life,” Hill said. “I’m just really happy for the chance, and I just want to thank the Chiefs’ organization, the coaches and everybody that just believes in me.”

This is not the first time the Chiefs have brought in somebody with domestic violence issues in the recent past. Last May, they signed Mississippi State cornerback Justin Cox and Iowa State defensive lineman David Irving as undrafted free agents. Both were charged with domestic violence in 2014, but both charges were dropped before they signed with the Chiefs. Cox was eventually released in July 2015 when he was arrested for domestic violence for the second time in less than a year. Irving, meanwhile, stayed out of trouble, but was signed off the Chiefs’ practice squad by the Cowboys in September 2015.

Chiefs chairman Clark Hunt said during training camp last summer that the Chiefs don’t have a hard-and-fast policy for bringing in players who have had trouble with the law because “every situation is different.” “It’s up to John (Dorsey) and his staff to do the research when the player has an incident and make a judgement call on as to whether it’s going to work out,” Hunt said at the time. “That particular situation (with Cox), it didn’t, but John is very aware that we don’t want guys who are going to be a problem in the community with the Kansas City Chiefs, and as a result, he and his team have to do a lot of work.”

And when the Chiefs first brought Cox in, Reid said they did their background work on him, just like they’re saying now. “John and I talk about it, and he knows that we want to be a leader in the NFL, not a team that has a lot of guys that are getting in trouble,” Hunt said. “It’s up to him to make those decisions within the parameters I allow him to do that.” With Hunt’s desire’s clear — and the fact Hunt was consulted on the Hill decision — there appears to be plenty, including the team’s credibility, to an extent, staked on Hill not getting into any more trouble.

So why even take the risk? Well Reid insists there’s a human element involved. He noted that he went through a similar situation with Michael Vick, who signed with the Eagles in 2009 after he became the object of scorn for dogfighting. “He’s been under the gun, just like this, and all eyes were on him,” Reid said of Vick. “He tried to come out of prison and right the wrong; I saw that and was sensitive to it and gave him a second chance. It was the greatest thing to ever happen to anti-dogfighting, and he’s been on a mission to help stop that. Every situation is different, and you’ve got to study it, see the person and see the heart that belongs to that person.”

Both Reid and Dorsey insist their mission of bringing good people, not just good players, into the organization has not been changed by the addition of Hill. “I believe words mean something, I really do,” Dorsey said. “And I’ve said early on, I was going to bring guys with character in here, guys that were going to be good people in this community. I said that when I first got here, and I still mean that.”

Reid added: “We think there will be a positive end to this. And I just ask that we let the young man get on with his work and life and help encourage him so we can get a positive out of this. That would be great for humanity itself, and then whatever he does on the football field is icing on the cake.

“So it can be a win-win, bringing him to this great city of Kansas City.”

[the Talking Can]

Originally Posted by DenverChief

Nobody knows for sure. It could very well have been the first time. Either way it's irrelevant as speculation.

it's not irrelevant, it speaks directly to who he is


and it is true, he's been abusing women for a long time...the idea that someone snaps and hits a woman just once in their life is a self-serving fiction for movies

[CapsLockKey]

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

Plenty of crimes where the public wants more than just paying a debt. I would never, for example, ever want a pedophile to enjoy an NFL career. Domestic violence is one thing, but to a pregnant woman? Think we demand more than that.

Michael Vick paid his debt. He had to lose everything first. Ray Rice and Adrian Peterson lost a lot. If this kid had gone undrafted and had to fight his way back to the NFL, that would be a sign that the kid lost something. But to basically be guaranteed an immediate shot at the NFL... this kid got off pretty easy.

This kid has nothing to start with unlike Rice and Peterson. Both of those guys were and still are multimiliionaires before they got busted. Vick went bankrupt not from his dog fighting charges but terrible financial management from spending money he didn't have before his revenue streams were cut off.

Rice's lack of second chance and media villification has more to do with his waning abilities as a football player than the actual incident. If the guy was still playing at an all pro level he'd been on a team last year and being sucked off by talking heads like any other star.

AP beat the shit out of a kid with a tree branch and he was celebrated by everyone in the media as soon he was allowed back, only because he can still ball. Some even suggested he should have gotten comeback player of the year over Berry. The fact he was even on the ballot is disgusting.

[Demonpenz]

It says in the article that he has manhandled her a couple times.

[stumppy]

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

[/URL]

You go right ahead and believe everything written in a police report as the gospel.

You're a ****ing idiot if you do.

[DenverChief]

Originally Posted by the Talking Can

it's not irrelevant, it speaks directly to who he is


and it is true, he's been abusing women for a long time...the idea that someone snaps and hits a woman just once in their life is a self-serving fiction for movies

Um it is entirely possible for it to be a one time incident and to say otherwise is a fallacy. I think the point is neither you and I know for sure one way or the other.

[RINGLEADER]

Originally Posted by keg in kc

I kind of had the same kind of thought the article sort of mentioned, that maybe their digging into him convinced them he was a high character individual who made a terrible mistake, owned up to it, and that the entire thing can be turned into - not necessarily a positive but - a learning experience or example for others.

The fact that they recognize the incident, that there's no hiding of it or shying away from it, and in fact being proactive in discussing it, is to me the right approach. In the end i don't know that everybody that does something like this deserves a second chance, but maybe this guy does. All I can say for sure is that they apparently believe he does, and with the stakes and money involved if it blows up in their faces, they must be pretty sure he's not Ray Rice or Greg Hardy.

He did plead guilty - though her testimony makes it sound even worse:

---clip---

Espinal told police in December that she and Hill had been dating since June. According to information given to Stillwater police, her age was 20 at the time of the incident and she now would be in her fifth month of pregnancy. She testified on Monday that she and Hill had sex during the evening of Dec. 11, and then “were planning on going to the movies” when he became angered by messages he saw on her phone.

Hill “threw my laptop (and) my phone into the hallway” before ordering her to leave his apartment, Espinal testified. She said she was in the hallway outside of Hill’s room, but did not leave because she wearing only a T-shirt and underwear. After she reentered the apartment, “domestic violence occurred,” she said.

In response to questions from Payne County Assistant District Attorney Lynn Hermanson, Espinal said that Hill “punched my face. ... When I tried to get up, I was put into a chokehold (for) longer than a minute.”

Espinal, who at the time of the alleged attack told police investigators that she was pregnant with Hill’s child, said Hill punched her stomach “on the left side,” and after that “grabbed my neck ... and started choking me again. ... He was pounding my head against the wall. He eventually stopped.”

---clip---

Hope the kid has learned from it. That's all you can say. Sucks that he gets a second chance after being such a despicable thug but I'm rooting for him to be hugely successful so the mom and his kid get a chance to be properly compensated for his idiocy.

[DaneMcCloud]

Originally Posted by DenverChief

If he even makes he squad. A tall task for a 5th round pick. Everyone has to make a living.

All four of the Chiefs 5th round draft choices since 2013 have all made the team: James O'Shaugnessy, DJ Alexander, Aaron Murry and Sanders Commings.

In 2010 & 2011, Ricky Stanzi and Kendrick Lewis were 5th rounders that were on the squad for several years and if we go back a little further we can add Brandon Carr, Boomer Grigsby, Scott Fujita, Jordan Black, Derrick Blalock and Dante Hall.

Considering Hill would have been drafted much higher if not for the domestic abuse conviction, it's a near certainty that he'll make the roster.

Originally Posted by DenverChief

Would it be any different if he took out a loan and bought a McDonald's franchise and made 600k year? I dont understand where how much he makes in a year factors into this.

There isn't a bank in the world that would loan a 22 year old convicted felon millions of dollars to open a MacDonald's Franchise.

And the reason why it factors in is that he hasn't finished his probation and is being rewarded for being a good football player without being a good citizen.

[the Talking Can]

Originally Posted by DenverChief

Um it is entirely possible for it to be a one time incident and to say otherwise is a fallacy. I think the point is neither you and I know for sure one way or the other.

yes, we do know...he's a piece of shit, and was before he finally got caught abusing someone

and it's weird people are obsessed with arguing otherwise

[RINGLEADER]

Probably also discussed elsewhere, but interesting that when the police went to arrest him he made a statement that it was because he was black and she was white? Huh?

[DenverChief]

Originally Posted by RINGLEADER

He did plead guilty - though her testimony makes it sound even worse:

---clip---

Espinal told police in December that she and Hill had been dating since June. According to information given to Stillwater police, her age was 20 at the time of the incident and she now would be in her fifth month of pregnancy. She testified on Monday that she and Hill had sex during the evening of Dec. 11, and then “were planning on going to the movies” when he became angered by messages he saw on her phone.

Hill “threw my laptop (and) my phone into the hallway” before ordering her to leave his apartment, Espinal testified. She said she was in the hallway outside of Hill’s room, but did not leave because she wearing only a T-shirt and underwear. After she reentered the apartment, “domestic violence occurred,” she said.

In response to questions from Payne County Assistant District Attorney Lynn Hermanson, Espinal said that Hill “punched my face. ... When I tried to get up, I was put into a chokehold (for) longer than a minute.”

Espinal, who at the time of the alleged attack told police investigators that she was pregnant with Hill’s child, said Hill punched her stomach “on the left side,” and after that “grabbed my neck ... and started choking me again. ... He was pounding my head against the wall. He eventually stopped.”

---clip---

Hope the kid has learned from it. That's all you can say. Sucks that he gets a second chance after being such a despicable thug but I'm rooting for him to be hugely successful so the mom and his kid get a chance to be properly compensated for his idiocy.

This

[DenverChief]

Originally Posted by the Talking Can

yes, we do know...he's a piece of shit, and was before he finally got caught abusing someone

and it's weird people are obsessed with arguing otherwise

I think it's weird that people will go to great lengths to weave their own story of history when they have absolutely no idea.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by CapsLockKey

This kid has nothing to start with unlike Rice and Peterson. Both of those guys were and still are multimiliionaires before they got busted. Vick went bankrupt not from his dog fighting charges but terrible financial management from spending money he didn't have before his revenue streams were cut off.

Rice's lack of second chance and media villification has more to do with his waning abilities as a football player than the actual incident. If the guy was still playing at an all pro level he'd been on a team last year and being sucked off by talking heads like any other star.

AP beat the shit out of a kid with a tree branch and he was celebrated by everyone in the media as soon he was allowed back, only because he can still ball. Some even suggested he should have gotten comeback player of the year over Berry. The fact he was even on the ballot is disgusting.

But they all lost something. If we believe in second chances, I'm much more okay with that if you suffered for it.

Yeah, he got kicked out of school but so did Cam Newton for stealing laptops. When he does this and yet is still drafted and virtually guaranteed a roster spot, it's a slap on the wrist.

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

LJ was a ****ing saint compared to this turd. Spitting on a woman who offends you is absolutely comical compared to this.

Did I mention she was PREGNANT?

[vailpass]

Originally Posted by DenverChief

Um it is entirely possible for it to be a one time incident and to say otherwise is a fallacy. I think the point is neither you and I know for sure one way or the other.

I'm surprised how out of touch with reality you are in this thread.

[DenverChief]

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

All four of the Chiefs 5th round draft choices since 2013 have all made the team: James O'Shaugnessy, DJ Alexander, Aaron Murry and Sanders Commings.

In 2010 & 2011, Ricky Stanzi and Kendrick Lewis were 5th rounders that were on the squad for several years and if we go back a little further we can add Brandon Carr, Boomer Grigsby, Scott Fujita, Jordan Black, Derrick Blalock and Dante Hall.

Considering Hill would have been drafted much higher if not for the domestic abuse conviction, it's a near certainty that he'll make the roster.




There isn't a bank in the world that would loan a 22 year old convicted felon millions of dollars to open a MacDonald's Franchise.

And the reason why it factors in is that he hasn't finished his probation and is being rewarded for being a good football player without being a good citizen.

He isn't a felon. So there is that. But let's play the game for a moment. Let's say instead of football this guys is an IT genius he writes some amazing code and after this incident with his GF he pleads guilty gets put on probation and graduates. After graduation he gets a job offer from some Silicon Valley tech company to write code for $200k/year. Is that acceptable? Or should the company not be allowed to hire him and he be forced into a minimum wage job where he will most likely have to ask for govt assistance to make ends meet?