Chiefs Patrick Mahomes Might Force Chiefs Hand In 2017 - Page 8

**DaneMcCloud** · 08-21-2017, 12:10 PM

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/s...-hand-in-2017/

Patrick Mahomes might force Chiefs hand in 2017

The much-lamented quarterback class of 2017 is looking pretty good all of a sudden. Mitchell Trubisky is pushing the Bears decision-making process as much as John Fox can be pushed, Deshaun Watson is going to make Bill O'Brien at least think about his Week 1 status and, most interestingly, Patrick Mahomes has found himself in a perfect situation and is turning heads early.
Do you love Mahomes and consider him the most upside-riddled quarterback of this draft class? Congratulations! You are not actually a special snowflake. Everyone does. Mahomes has a cannon. It's unfair for Alex Smith, a genuinely nice human being who is an average-to-above average quarterback, that he finds himself once again squaring off against a young physical marvel on the depth chart. The good news for Smith is he looks really good this preseason. The bad news is so does Mahomes. Before we get to that, though, how much pressure can this guy actually put on Andy Reid? History tells us there is a good deal Mahomes could do to press Reid into playing him.

Reid waited a while to hand the starting job to the the first quarterback he ever drafted, Donovan McNabb, after taking the Syracuse product No. 2 overall in 1999. And when he finally did, in Week 10, the Eagles were out of the playoff race, sitting at 2-7. After letting McNab take his lumps in a relief role, it was time to see what the highly-drafted rookie had to offer as a full-time starter. McNabb got a rough welcome to the NFL when he made his NFL debut against the Bucs in Week 2, getting sacked six times by the eventual NFC Central champions (remember that this Bucs team was the basis for the eventual Super Bowl championship defense). In a fun twist of fate, the guy McNabb replaced as the starter was Doug Pederson, who is the current Eagles coach and former offensive coordinator for Alex Smith.

Andy Reid waited until Week 10 of Donovan McNabb's rookie season before naming him the starter. Two years later, Reid selected A.J. Feeley in the fifth round of the 2001 NFL Draft. That's not notable for Feeley being a guy who might have taken playing time, but he is another quarterback in a long list of Reid protégés who ended up being traded for a high draft pick. The point being, when Andy Reid latches onto a quarterback in the draft, people take notice. Reid went a long time between taking McNabb early and grabbing another quarterback. Again, notable. If Reid is spending high draft capital on a quarterback, there should be a belief he can win with said quarterback for a long time. He also probably thinks that quarterback is capable of winning and/or playing early. Patrick Mahomes was the 12th player drafted.

Kevin Kolb was the second quarterback taken by Reid with a high pick in his Eagles tenure. Kolb was taken out of Houston with a second-round pick in 2007 (the Eagles actually traded down out of the first round with the Cowboys who took Anthony Spencer). He didn't replace McNabb immediately, but Kolb is also a clear-cut historical marker in terms of Reid making sure he has quarterback insurance. McNabb was battling injuries during that stretch, coming off the Super Bowl loss to the Patriots, and would be gone after 2009.

That year featured a storm of controversy, too, with Michael Vick and Kolb nipping on McNabb's heels for playing time. Ultimately it was McNabb's team, but with Vick and Kolb on the roster, there were plenty of people chirping to see the other options. The backup quarterback is always the most popular guy in town, and that's been the case for Andy Reid's teams in the past.
Vick and Kolb ran the team in 2010 after McNabb left and then Kolb was traded. The "Dream Team" of 2011 followed, but it wouldn't be long before a draft pick caused trouble on the roster again. Nick Foles, taken in the third round of the 2012 NFL Draft, was firmly entrenched in Reid-style controversy within his first year. Foles started six games for Reid in 2012 and that led to serious concern about who should start in 2013, when Foles went 8-2 as a starter under Chip Kelly.

Ultimately what you see from Reid is a history of high draft picks playing early. McNabb was under center three quarters of the way through the season in his rookie year. Kolb was held at bay, but McNabb aged better than Reid expected and it still ended in McNabb being dealt to the Redskins. The Michael Vick thing was a different animal. Er, situation. Foles played quickly, starting multiple games his first year. Which brings us back to Mahomes, who has looked just absolutely tools-y this preseason. Mahomes, who played in Kliff Kingsbury's system at Texas Tech, is going to require some refinement. But he has everything you would want to see in a quarterback from a physical perspective. If you buy into Reid developing quarterbacks -- and why wouldn't you? -- Mahomes is a fascinating prospect. He has underrated speed and is strong enough too take hits and still make throws.

Mahomes is faster and stronger than just about everyone on the field. As a quarterback that is an undeniable advantage. He can shrug off blitzers but he can also deftly evade people coming at him on the rush. And if he needs to, Mahomes can whip a quick throw on short notice. All that is well and good, but the downside of Mahomes is he's not harnessed right now either. He can be, and it's easy to see Reid figuring out how. Mahomes might be a stronger, slightly slower, more twitchy version of McNabb with a better arm. Alex Smith is on notice, although he knew that coming into the preseason. The guess here, two weeks into the season, is that Smith won't lose his job as long as the Chiefs are winning.

If Kansas City falters or the offense looks flat, don't be surprised to see Mahomes. Reid's history makes it clear he is willing to run with a young talent he trusted in the draft. He believes in his quarterback development almost as much as he believes in his talent evaluation. Maybe more.

**DaneMcCloud** · 08-21-2017, 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Easy 6

I appreciate the time and effort you put into that post, cooper barrett... solid looking work from a noob

But in no way will we have to use the rebuild word anytime soon, we are the 6th youngest team in the NFL

In 2018, they'll be even younger with the subtraction of Hali, DJ, Colquitt and Smith.

They'll probably rank from 2-4.

**notorious** · 08-21-2017, 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oaklandhater

QB's drafted in the 1st round since 2006 to not assume a full-time starting gig by the start of Year 2: Paxton Lynch, Manziel, Tebow, Quinn.
— Field Yates (@FieldYates) August 21, 2017

not good company.

(I hope this fixes the thread)

penbrook · 08-21-2017, 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cooper barrett

Alex11 is being coached to open up his game and take some chances. He has been applauded for a great training camp and he has looked good in pre-season.
If he is successful making changes to his game (as he is being coached to do) it could become a two edged sword.

On one side if he starts throwing "6 point" picks he will either be forced to go back to his "safety first" game or we will see Pat Mahomes either in 2nd halves or as a starter. This is not PMll forcing himself on Reid and staff.

On the other edge...and I want to stay positive and say that Alex11's going to be successful at opening things up and taking a few more risks. If he is successful throwing the long (er) ball and threading the needle, he may (should) put an extra 6-12 points on the board each game. That, my friends, is just what we need to be a SB contender, that is if (big if) the defense and special teams do an outstanding jobs all season too.

If he sheds his reputation of being too careful to win championships reputation and, lets say we were to win a "real" playoff game, he would certainly up his street value as he may find himself being traded or released. We all know the Chef's (oops) plan on dumping him off somehow as PMll matures and Alex11's trade or release would save major bucks toward salary cap in 2018. A performance like that would certainly add value as a aging QB when the media and odds makers are starting to doubt us even getting into the playoffs..some have come right out and said we aren't getting there.

From my arm chair: I would like to think that we will see out first "real" playoff win this year either with Alex11 or Mahome leading the offense at the end of the season. Alex11 will have to execute what the coaches want to see (I hope he does) in able to keep from seeing himself being pulled out at halftime or even watching PMll get the call as a rookie starter. Injury or not once Alex11 is out as starter, he isn't coming back. If this happens Alex11 may just be released as no one will be willing to take the cap hit and the Chief's will only get the cap dollars savings as they shed Alex11.

But as I have stated before the running, blocking, and receiving teams need to be up to the challenge for our offense to be Super Bowl contenders. We have to stop the other teams running, passing, and special teams play to get there.

My money is with Alex11 to give us our first real chance at a SB appearance this year verses the disappointments we have endured for too many years to count. If not, are we going to hear the "rebuilding" word soon.

Are you a Smitty fan? I'm asking for a friend

penbrook · 08-21-2017, 05:05 PM

Just going to leave

**notorious** · 08-21-2017, 05:08 PM

Did that tweet break the internet? This tread is jacked up on my computer.

penbrook · 08-21-2017, 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by notorious

Did that tweet break the internet? This tread is jacked up on my computer.

Same

Sandy Vagina · 08-21-2017, 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by notorious

Just going to leave this here.......

Yep 2018 is happening for you. No more Smith. Hello Mahomes. Just relax.

( oh, there goes that fake fan tellin us how to be again, grrrr... )

rico · 08-21-2017, 05:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sandy Cheeks

Yep 2018 is happening for you. No more Smith. Hello Mahomes. Just relax.

( oh, there goes that fake fan tellin us how to be again, grrrr... )

What if your Alex goes to a team that has a forum that is feeling all rainbows, butterflies, Care Bears, sunshine and unicorns about him?!?! What would you do with yourself?!?!? Would you join the circle jerk or would you stay here to passive-aggressively jab at Mahomes? Something tells me the latter...otherwise you would have been at The Coalition by now.

**notorious** · 08-21-2017, 05:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sandy Cheeks

Yep 2018 is happening for you. No more Smith. Hello Mahomes. Just relax.

( oh, there goes that fake fan tellin us how to be again, grrrr... )

Probably. Penbrook is right, though, if Alex is the reason for a Superbowl title run I would be shocked if the Chiefs moved on.

I see it more as a Dilfer/Baltimore thing, though. Alex will require the rest of the team to dominate while he mans the helm and keeps the ship safe. That kind of guy is expendable.

Sandy Vagina · 08-21-2017, 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by notorious

I see it more as a Dilfer/Baltimore thing, though. Alex will require the rest of the team to dominate while he mans the helm and keeps the ship safe. That kind of guy is expendable.

Though I feel Smith does more for KC than did Dilfer for Balt, your very common expectation seems fair enough at this point.

Quote:

Originally Posted by rico

What if your Alex goes to a team that has a forum that is feeling all rainbows, butterflies, Care Bears, sunshine and unicorns about him?!?! What would you do with yourself?!?!? Would you join the circle jerk or would you stay here to passive-aggressively jab at Mahomes? Something tells me the latter...otherwise you would have been at The Coalition by now.

More abandonment issues?

Seriously, I don't know. The way I smile at taking enjoyment from the journeys of ALL these Chiefs players? I am inclined to believe I will stay right here and become a Mahomo.

If Smith changes his mind, and stays in the League somewhere else, he's a damn fool. I will wish him well... maybe keep a secondary eye on his final efforts.. but no. I think I mainly stay a Chiefs fan, and hopefully a Mahomo.

JoeyChuckles · 08-21-2017, 05:28 PM

Is Penbrook getting credit for all these sub-posts, or are we turning into a subreddit now?

cooper barrett · 08-21-2017, 05:29 PM

I know that Mahomes GF* has an education, Smith's wife is only known as a Raider Cheerleader...

*Brittany Lynn Matthews Texas Tech

Quote:

Originally Posted by penbrook

He has a hot wife as well. He's 1 up on Mahomes in that book

**notorious** · 08-21-2017, 05:30 PM

Hey Penbrook, if you change your quote of the tweet it might line the thread back up.

This is strange to say the least.

ChiefsCountry · 08-21-2017, 05:30 PM

Hopefully Alex gets Trent Greened 1999 style this week and we can start the Mahomes era.

JoeyChuckles · 08-21-2017, 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by penbrook

I see Yates put 2006 and not 2005 so he didn't have to include Rodgers. Very smart Field!

Testing to see if quoting the quote that messed things up fixes anything.

08-21-2017, 12:10 PM
DaneMcCloud Supporter Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Hollywood, CA Casino cash: $10053648	Patrick Mahomes Might Force Chiefs Hand In 2017 https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/s...-hand-in-2017/ Patrick Mahomes might force Chiefs hand in 2017 The much-lamented quarterback class of 2017 is looking pretty good all of a sudden. Mitchell Trubisky is pushing the Bears decision-making process as much as John Fox can be pushed, Deshaun Watson is going to make Bill O'Brien at least think about his Week 1 status and, most interestingly, Patrick Mahomes has found himself in a perfect situation and is turning heads early. Do you love Mahomes and consider him the most upside-riddled quarterback of this draft class? Congratulations! You are not actually a special snowflake. Everyone does. Mahomes has a cannon. It's unfair for Alex Smith, a genuinely nice human being who is an average-to-above average quarterback, that he finds himself once again squaring off against a young physical marvel on the depth chart. The good news for Smith is he looks really good this preseason. The bad news is so does Mahomes. Before we get to that, though, how much pressure can this guy actually put on Andy Reid? History tells us there is a good deal Mahomes could do to press Reid into playing him. Reid waited a while to hand the starting job to the the first quarterback he ever drafted, Donovan McNabb, after taking the Syracuse product No. 2 overall in 1999. And when he finally did, in Week 10, the Eagles were out of the playoff race, sitting at 2-7. After letting McNab take his lumps in a relief role, it was time to see what the highly-drafted rookie had to offer as a full-time starter. McNabb got a rough welcome to the NFL when he made his NFL debut against the Bucs in Week 2, getting sacked six times by the eventual NFC Central champions (remember that this Bucs team was the basis for the eventual Super Bowl championship defense). In a fun twist of fate, the guy McNabb replaced as the starter was Doug Pederson, who is the current Eagles coach and former offensive coordinator for Alex Smith. Andy Reid waited until Week 10 of Donovan McNabb's rookie season before naming him the starter. Two years later, Reid selected A.J. Feeley in the fifth round of the 2001 NFL Draft. That's not notable for Feeley being a guy who might have taken playing time, but he is another quarterback in a long list of Reid protégés who ended up being traded for a high draft pick. The point being, when Andy Reid latches onto a quarterback in the draft, people take notice. Reid went a long time between taking McNabb early and grabbing another quarterback. Again, notable. If Reid is spending high draft capital on a quarterback, there should be a belief he can win with said quarterback for a long time. He also probably thinks that quarterback is capable of winning and/or playing early. Patrick Mahomes was the 12th player drafted. Kevin Kolb was the second quarterback taken by Reid with a high pick in his Eagles tenure. Kolb was taken out of Houston with a second-round pick in 2007 (the Eagles actually traded down out of the first round with the Cowboys who took Anthony Spencer). He didn't replace McNabb immediately, but Kolb is also a clear-cut historical marker in terms of Reid making sure he has quarterback insurance. McNabb was battling injuries during that stretch, coming off the Super Bowl loss to the Patriots, and would be gone after 2009. That year featured a storm of controversy, too, with Michael Vick and Kolb nipping on McNabb's heels for playing time. Ultimately it was McNabb's team, but with Vick and Kolb on the roster, there were plenty of people chirping to see the other options. The backup quarterback is always the most popular guy in town, and that's been the case for Andy Reid's teams in the past. Vick and Kolb ran the team in 2010 after McNabb left and then Kolb was traded. The "Dream Team" of 2011 followed, but it wouldn't be long before a draft pick caused trouble on the roster again. Nick Foles, taken in the third round of the 2012 NFL Draft, was firmly entrenched in Reid-style controversy within his first year. Foles started six games for Reid in 2012 and that led to serious concern about who should start in 2013, when Foles went 8-2 as a starter under Chip Kelly. Ultimately what you see from Reid is a history of high draft picks playing early. McNabb was under center three quarters of the way through the season in his rookie year. Kolb was held at bay, but McNabb aged better than Reid expected and it still ended in McNabb being dealt to the Redskins. The Michael Vick thing was a different animal. Er, situation. Foles played quickly, starting multiple games his first year. Which brings us back to Mahomes, who has looked just absolutely tools-y this preseason. Mahomes, who played in Kliff Kingsbury's system at Texas Tech, is going to require some refinement. But he has everything you would want to see in a quarterback from a physical perspective. If you buy into Reid developing quarterbacks -- and why wouldn't you? -- Mahomes is a fascinating prospect. He has underrated speed and is strong enough too take hits and still make throws. Mahomes is faster and stronger than just about everyone on the field. As a quarterback that is an undeniable advantage. He can shrug off blitzers but he can also deftly evade people coming at him on the rush. And if he needs to, Mahomes can whip a quick throw on short notice. All that is well and good, but the downside of Mahomes is he's not harnessed right now either. He can be, and it's easy to see Reid figuring out how. Mahomes might be a stronger, slightly slower, more twitchy version of McNabb with a better arm. Alex Smith is on notice, although he knew that coming into the preseason. The guess here, two weeks into the season, is that Smith won't lose his job as long as the Chiefs are winning. If Kansas City falters or the offense looks flat, don't be surprised to see Mahomes. Reid's history makes it clear he is willing to run with a young talent he trusted in the draft. He believes in his quarterback development almost as much as he believes in his talent evaluation. Maybe more.
Posts: 88,960

08-21-2017, 05:05 PM	#109
penbrook LEGEND! Join Date: Feb 2013 Casino cash: $10033840	Just going to leave Last edited by SAUTO; 08-21-2017 at 06:18 PM..
Posts: 16,409

08-21-2017, 05:08 PM	#110
notorious Supporter Join Date: May 2005 Location: Who knows? Casino cash: $2935884	Did that tweet break the internet? This tread is jacked up on my computer.
Posts: 83,365

08-21-2017, 05:28 PM	#116
JoeyChuckles Bring It Home Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: North Haverbrook Casino cash: $10007012	Is Penbrook getting credit for all these sub-posts, or are we turning into a subreddit now?
Posts: 4,322

08-21-2017, 05:30 PM	#118
notorious Supporter Join Date: May 2005 Location: Who knows? Casino cash: $2935884	Hey Penbrook, if you change your quote of the tweet it might line the thread back up. This is strange to say the least.
Posts: 83,365

08-21-2017, 05:30 PM	#119
ChiefsCountry The Insider Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Lake of the Ozarks Casino cash: $2328752	Hopefully Alex gets Trent Greened 1999 style this week and we can start the Mahomes era.
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