Home and Auto Popcorn ceilings - Page 3

**bogey** · 01-04-2015, 11:58 AM

Howdy all,
Happy New Year! I hope 2015 is your best year ever. I have lots of new challenges ahead of me for 2015. With that, I have recently purchased a condo and I have about 900 square feet of popcorn ceiling that I want to cover. It likely has asbestos, so I am going to hire someone to cover it with drywall, yes? Can anyone tell me how much I should budget for this (materials and labor)? I'm already having the whole place painted, so the paint may not have to be included.

I'm putting in engineered wood floors (glue down). I budgeted $10.00 sq. ft. installed is that too low, too high?

I'm in escrow now and will close mid to late January. If I could have found that G-spot, I probably wouldn't be buying this condo!

Look forward to hearing from you all.

Brock · 01-04-2015, 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by splatbass

Yes there is, and it still doesn't matter with the law. Asbestos removal is dangerous and should be done by a professional - and in California where he lives he has to get a professional, and he has to have a licenses tester test for it, those Home Depot testing kits aren't legal in California.

No, there isn't any dust at all if it's wet. It peels off like butter when it's wetted down and is wrapped up in the drop paper before it dries. Done this a hundred times. I don't live in california and I don't involve the government in my repair projects in any case.

**BigRedChief** · 01-04-2015, 01:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brock

No, there isn't any dust at all if it's wet. It peels off like butter when it's wetted down and is wrapped up in the drop paper before it dries. Done this a hundred times. I don't live in california and I don't involve the government in my repair projects in any case.

Not my experience. There was no government permits involved in our home remodel either.

The guys we used come highly recommended. We were happy with the finished job. They would be working in another room. Sealed off nicely and my laptop would still have a layer of fine dust on it. We had to change out the air conditioner filters after the job was finished.

We also were buying the home. We wanted to know for sure if we had asbestos, not whether it was likely or not likely.

splatbass · 01-04-2015, 01:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brock

No, there isn't any dust at all if it's wet. It peels off like butter when it's wetted down and is wrapped up in the drop paper before it dries. Done this a hundred times. I don't live in california and I don't involve the government in my repair projects in any case.

I know you hate the government, but if you put your health at risk just to spite them because you hate regulations YOU ARE AN IDIOT. In your effort to spite them you don't hurt them you only hurt yourself. But I guess it makes you feel "free" or something.

Dumbass.

Tacoman · 01-04-2015, 01:51 PM

I am not a remediation specialist, nor licensed to test for this stuff or whatever, and I'm not a lawyer either so please don't take any of this info as legal advice. Just sharing some of my experiences as far as my interaction with it throughout my real estate career.

That being said, here is a few things to take into consideration from what I have seen and been told...

Asbestos acts like a binder of sorts... Glue like characteristics at the molecular level if you will. This is the reason it was so widely used, and in so many products. Combine the substance you want to create a product out of with with asbestos and you can shape it any way you want etc etc.

Here is an example of the extensive list of products that used asbestos for production.

Asbestos Gaskets
Asbestos Sheets
Cigarette Filters
Electrical Cloth & Electrical Panel Partition
Fire Proofing & Prevention Materials
Fume Hoods & Laboratory Hoods
Plastics
Vinyl Products
Textile Cloths & Textile Garments
Construction Products
Adhesives and Gold Bond Adhesives
Construction Mastics & Gunning Mix
Ductwork Connectors & Flexible Duct Connectors
Floor Backing & Drywall Taping Compounds
Insulation
Zonolite Insulation

The whole point being that first off this is not necessarily a product that you can see with the naked eye for the products that contain it and those that don't.

I have an addition in my house that had popcorn ceilings, and the addition was done in the 50's. When I bought it, my inspector told be that the ceiling was "obviously" containing asbestos, and to just leave it alone if at all possible, but that if I were to mess with it I should either cover it up like you are planning on or have specialists come in and remove it at a potentially very high expense. My father (40+ years of construction experience) backed up what the inspector said as well, but just told me if I left it alone it wouldn't be a big deal or something I should worry about.

Only thing is that my ceiling actually DOESN'T have asbestos in it...

A few years after becoming a Realtor I needed to remodel my back room. Having learned a lot more about the subject I had a little better plan of action to work with. I went and got it tested, and it turned out that there was NO asbestos in my 50's popcorn ceiling. Imagine that! I was really excited, as opposed to having a several thousand dollar bill to remove it all in a safe manner so my child could be safe, I just drywalled a new ceiling for $150 bucks. Spending a simple $25 bucks was a lifesaver!

The thing is, most people don't even really know how easy it is to test for it and check it out, all most people know is that the specialists are really expensive. If I were checking it on my own house etc etc I wouldn't rely on a lowe's test or whatever, I would go straight to the horses mouth. There are labs out there that service exactly these types of things. The one that I use in Salt Lake is called ALS Laboratories.

http://www.alsglobal.com/en/Our-Serv...ity-Laboratory.

They have labs all over the world, perhaps they have one where you live? Testing is really easy, they just need about a golf balls size worth of material to test it. They will go through and check it to the parts per million level etc etc.

Lastly I will touch on another thing I never knew but was fascinated to learn.

FWIW...

Asbestos is actually a blanket term that encapsulates 6 totally different products:

http://www.asbestos.com/asbestos/types.php

It is important to understand what you are dealing with if in fact you DO have an asbestos situation to deal with. The different types have varying risks and health impacts depending on which "animal" you are dealing with. This stuff is all important to assess if you are planning on dealing with asbestos, and all the more reason to get it tested professionally. Also, realize that cutting out the chunk you are planning on testing is an at your own risk situation, and that perhaps if you are not comfortable with that risk you should have the sample removed from the ceiling by a professional.

Whatever you do, DON'T PAINT IT. If popcorn asbestos ceilings are painted they are significantly more difficult to remove. It's the difference between being able to spray the ceiling with a squirt bottle and leaving the room while it falls to the ground on its own, versus having to scrape it all off by hand.

Tacoman · 01-04-2015, 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by splatbass

In many places it would be illegal to remove it yourself, and I'm pretty sure California is one of those places. You need professionals with proper equipment to seal the room off and draw the dust out with pumps. Just wearing a mask isn't enough because that dust goes everywhere, including outside to your neighbors.

This is a good post. If you ARE dealing with asbestos it is really serious stuff and should be dealt with the utmost care.

**mlyonsd** · 01-04-2015, 01:54 PM

You'd think for such a regulated material there would be some rule stating asbestos be present would have to be disclosed when selling the structure.

**BigRedChief** · 01-04-2015, 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mlyonsd

You'd think for such a regulated material there would be some rule stating asbestos be present would have to be disclosed when selling the structure.

If you haven't had it tested, how do you know? I guess you could force all homes being sold to do the test?

**mlyonsd** · 01-04-2015, 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

If you haven't had it tested, how do you know? I guess you could force all homes being sold to do the test?

I thought we were talking California.

**BigRedChief** · 01-04-2015, 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mlyonsd

I thought we were talking California.

Every house sold in Cali has to be tested for asbestos?

**mlyonsd** · 01-04-2015, 02:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

Every house sold in Cali has to be tested for asbestos?

It was a joke.

splatbass · 01-04-2015, 02:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mlyonsd

You'd think for such a regulated material there would be some rule stating asbestos be present would have to be disclosed when selling the structure.

I know in California if you rent out a place you are required to disclose it has asbestos to the person renting it (I was a renter and got a notice). I would think that they would require it to be disclosed during a sale too, but I don't know about that.

**SAUTO** · 01-04-2015, 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by splatbass

Yes there is, and it still doesn't matter with the law. Asbestos removal is dangerous and should be done by a professional - and in California where he lives he has to get a professional. And he has to have a licensed tester test for it, those Home Depot testing kits aren't legal in California.

You are giving him bad advice.

Actually there is a loop hole in California law that says if you own the place and are the only one there you might be able to do it yourself.

**BigRedChief** · 01-04-2015, 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mlyonsd

It was a joke.

AHHHH, in Cali, I could totally see them forcing people to test for asbestos.

Hell, we did it on our own just for our own piece of mind.

**Iowanian** · 01-04-2015, 03:03 PM

Hush. The men are talking, Betty White.

Quote:

Originally Posted by splatbass

I know you hate the government, but if you put your health at risk just to spite them because you hate regulations YOU ARE AN IDIOT. In your effort to spite them you don't hurt them you only hurt yourself. But I guess it makes you feel "free" or something.

Dumbass.

Brock · 01-04-2015, 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by splatbass

I know you hate the government, but if you put your health at risk just to spite them because you hate regulations YOU ARE AN IDIOT. In your effort to spite them you don't hurt them you only hurt yourself. But I guess it makes you feel "free" or something.

Dumbass.

Can't you make your point without name-calling?

I have supervised an asbestos abatement crew before. I am a licensed general contractor. I know what I am talking about. You do not.

01-04-2015, 11:58 AM
bogey Supporter Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: California Casino cash: $10005290	Popcorn ceilings Howdy all, Happy New Year! I hope 2015 is your best year ever. I have lots of new challenges ahead of me for 2015. With that, I have recently purchased a condo and I have about 900 square feet of popcorn ceiling that I want to cover. It likely has asbestos, so I am going to hire someone to cover it with drywall, yes? Can anyone tell me how much I should budget for this (materials and labor)? I'm already having the whole place painted, so the paint may not have to be included. I'm putting in engineered wood floors (glue down). I budgeted $10.00 sq. ft. installed is that too low, too high? I'm in escrow now and will close mid to late January. If I could have found that G-spot, I probably wouldn't be buying this condo! Look forward to hearing from you all.
Posts: 2,264

01-04-2015, 01:51 PM	#34
Tacoman Starter Join Date: Nov 2013 Location: Utah Casino cash: $10011744	I am not a remediation specialist, nor licensed to test for this stuff or whatever, and I'm not a lawyer either so please don't take any of this info as legal advice. Just sharing some of my experiences as far as my interaction with it throughout my real estate career. That being said, here is a few things to take into consideration from what I have seen and been told... Asbestos acts like a binder of sorts... Glue like characteristics at the molecular level if you will. This is the reason it was so widely used, and in so many products. Combine the substance you want to create a product out of with with asbestos and you can shape it any way you want etc etc. Here is an example of the extensive list of products that used asbestos for production. Asbestos Gaskets Asbestos Sheets Cigarette Filters Electrical Cloth & Electrical Panel Partition Fire Proofing & Prevention Materials Fume Hoods & Laboratory Hoods Plastics Vinyl Products Textile Cloths & Textile Garments Construction Products Adhesives and Gold Bond Adhesives Construction Mastics & Gunning Mix Ductwork Connectors & Flexible Duct Connectors Floor Backing & Drywall Taping Compounds Insulation Zonolite Insulation The whole point being that first off this is not necessarily a product that you can see with the naked eye for the products that contain it and those that don't. I have an addition in my house that had popcorn ceilings, and the addition was done in the 50's. When I bought it, my inspector told be that the ceiling was "obviously" containing asbestos, and to just leave it alone if at all possible, but that if I were to mess with it I should either cover it up like you are planning on or have specialists come in and remove it at a potentially very high expense. My father (40+ years of construction experience) backed up what the inspector said as well, but just told me if I left it alone it wouldn't be a big deal or something I should worry about. Only thing is that my ceiling actually DOESN'T have asbestos in it... A few years after becoming a Realtor I needed to remodel my back room. Having learned a lot more about the subject I had a little better plan of action to work with. I went and got it tested, and it turned out that there was NO asbestos in my 50's popcorn ceiling. Imagine that! I was really excited, as opposed to having a several thousand dollar bill to remove it all in a safe manner so my child could be safe, I just drywalled a new ceiling for $150 bucks. Spending a simple $25 bucks was a lifesaver! The thing is, most people don't even really know how easy it is to test for it and check it out, all most people know is that the specialists are really expensive. If I were checking it on my own house etc etc I wouldn't rely on a lowe's test or whatever, I would go straight to the horses mouth. There are labs out there that service exactly these types of things. The one that I use in Salt Lake is called ALS Laboratories. http://www.alsglobal.com/en/Our-Serv...ity-Laboratory. They have labs all over the world, perhaps they have one where you live? Testing is really easy, they just need about a golf balls size worth of material to test it. They will go through and check it to the parts per million level etc etc. Lastly I will touch on another thing I never knew but was fascinated to learn. FWIW... Asbestos is actually a blanket term that encapsulates 6 totally different products: http://www.asbestos.com/asbestos/types.php It is important to understand what you are dealing with if in fact you DO have an asbestos situation to deal with. The different types have varying risks and health impacts depending on which "animal" you are dealing with. This stuff is all important to assess if you are planning on dealing with asbestos, and all the more reason to get it tested professionally. Also, realize that cutting out the chunk you are planning on testing is an at your own risk situation, and that perhaps if you are not comfortable with that risk you should have the sample removed from the ceiling by a professional. Whatever you do, DON'T PAINT IT. If popcorn asbestos ceilings are painted they are significantly more difficult to remove. It's the difference between being able to spray the ceiling with a squirt bottle and leaving the room while it falls to the ground on its own, versus having to scrape it all off by hand. Last edited by Tacoman; 01-04-2015 at 01:59 PM..
Posts: 418

01-04-2015, 01:54 PM	#36
mlyonsd Supporter Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Spink, SD Casino cash: $1663762	You'd think for such a regulated material there would be some rule stating asbestos be present would have to be disclosed when selling the structure.
Posts: 38,866