Life Something of a moral dilemma - Page 3

Wallcrawler · 11-15-2014, 10:38 PM

So, Im in position to take over the reigns of the store Im currently working in. Its a very small staff, three of us managers and four part time employees.

Things go pretty well most of the time, despite some maturity issues with my direct supervisor. He's only 26, and as far as the business goes, he knows literally everything. Theres no task or problem or issue that he cannot readily resolve within a few minutes.

However, when it comes to actually leading a team of people, this guy is ASS. For real. Schedule changes with little to no notice, making people stay longer so that he can leave early, calling people in early so that he can go home, and being a dick in general about requests for time off even if they are the required two weeks in advance.

So we have a part timer who does a decent job, not the sharpest knife in the drawer, but the effort is there. He's decided that we are going to part ways with this person, but Im going to be the one to cut the ties.

Over the phone.

To me, this is complete bullshit. The guy being fired, we'll call him "Joe" is only being fired because he's called the boss out on multiple offenses of laziness, both just hanging out in back while on a shift, as well as the multiple counts of leaving early. Joe's broken plans repeatedly, without complaint, to come in early so Boss could leave early. No emergency, just tired of being there.

The first thing I tell Boss is that its chickenshit to fire someone over the phone. If Im going to take your ability to provide for your family from you, Im going to at least have the sac to look you in the face when I do it, and tell you why.

Boss gives zero ****s what I think, or what my view is. He's the boss, Im the subordinate, and my instructions are to call Joe in the morning and tell him that his services are no longer required.

If I refuse, Ill be documented for insubordination and my position to take over the business will take a substantial hit, because the third manager "Yes Man" is a bit spineless when it comes to taking a stand on anything, and simply does what he's told without question.

Now, I have no problem with Joe. Joe could be faster, and smarter, but Joe is always on time, always covers shifts when needed, and always works 100% of the time he is present. In short, dude's not perfect but he's doing everything he can at all times. That goes a long way in my book.

I don't really know what I should do. I mean I want to tell Boss to go **** himself and if he wants to be a chickenshit and fire Joe over the phone for being called out as a lazy **** from time to time, that's his problem and not mine.

On the other hand, I could lose my position to Yes Man and potentially screw myself out of a nice pay increase, perks, and better job security when Boss transfers in June.

Going over Boss' head is out of the question, as the District Manager and Boss are aquainted outside of work and have known each other for about 5 years.

So my choice is to call up Joe in the morning and tell him that he's fired and not be able to tell him exactly why he's being fired, or to tell my Boss to **** off and put my future at risk.

Its such a shit thing to do to someone, especially so close to Christmas.

Katipan · 11-15-2014, 11:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mdchiefsfan

If it is creating a moral dilemma and he has witness information as to why the manager wants the associate fired he has a means to take things up higher without having his named involved for people to decide, which removes the moral obligation from his shoulders.

Over and over and over he reiterates the fact that his boss is a "chickenshit" and is "scared." It's not a moral dilemma, it's a (deservedly) complete disrespect for his boss.

All the other stuff is just drama.

**mdchiefsfan** · 11-15-2014, 11:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brainiac

Yup.

A couple of friends of mine worked at home for an Internet startup located in Silicon Valley. Every week they had a conference call with a dozen or so people on the line. One day the big boss got on the call and said "The purpose of this call is to tell everyone on the call that they are being let go."

Shit happens.

How big of a company was that?

**mdchiefsfan** · 11-15-2014, 11:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Katipan

Over and over and over he reiterates the fact that his boss is a "chickenshit" and is "scared." It's not a moral dilemma, it's a (deservedly) complete disrespect for his boss.

All the other stuff is just drama.

Read the title of the thread

Katipan · 11-15-2014, 11:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mdchiefsfan

Read the title of the thread

Ok, go **** yourself.

Was that helpful?

Sweet Daddy Hate · 11-15-2014, 11:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Katipan

Over and over and over he reiterates the fact that his boss is a "chickenshit" and is "scared." It's not a moral dilemma, it's a (deservedly) complete disrespect for his boss.

All the other stuff is just drama.

That little "candy crush on the clock"-mother****er SHOULD be "disrespected".

**mdchiefsfan** · 11-15-2014, 11:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Katipan

Ok, go **** yourself.

Was that helpful?

right on. All I did was give the best advice I could with the information was given. Never once did I attack you or your thoughts. Way to go on this one!

Katipan · 11-15-2014, 11:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 505 Chief

That little "candy crush on the clock"-mother****er SHOULD be "disrespected".

Maybe if I bolded the word deservedly and made it a larger font?

Just Passin' By · 11-15-2014, 11:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Katipan

Ok, go **** yourself.

Was that helpful?

It made me laugh. That was helpful.

Sweet Daddy Hate · 11-15-2014, 11:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Katipan

Maybe if I bolded the word deservedly and made it a larger font?

That would be helpful.

Katipan · 11-15-2014, 11:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 505 Chief

That would be helpful.

Oh you.

rep.

Lex Luthor · 11-15-2014, 11:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mdchiefsfan

How big of a company was that?

Maybe 50 employees at their peak. No corporate HR department to appeal to.

**LoneWolf** · 11-15-2014, 11:25 PM

It's not normally a very smart move to call your boss lazy to his face, especially when being asked to get something done. At many companies this would be considered insubordination and a friable offense.

**mdchiefsfan** · 11-15-2014, 11:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brainiac

Maybe 50 employees at their peak. No corporate HR department to appeal to.

As I said on my first post in this thread, I have no clue what company he is involved with, but MOST companies have a means to prevent this type of bullying. To point your toes downstream and go with the flow is poor management in my eyes. I wouldn't hesitate to stand up for what was right for my employees. Maybe I don't have enough to lose yet, who knows.

**mdchiefsfan** · 11-15-2014, 11:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LoneWolf

It's not normally a very smart move to call your boss lazy to his face, especially when being asked to get something done. At many companies this would be considered insubordination and a friable offense.

I can agree with this, but sometimes a spade is a spade. This guy has gotten as far as he has by promoting fear and intimidation in the work place. That is how he is getting his numbers, guaranteed. All it takes is one person to start the stand; the rest will follow.

Saccopoo · 11-15-2014, 11:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PHOG

3 Managers and 4 part time employees? You should know the problem.

Bingo.

And the 26 year old kid is a tool.

Somebody else wants YOU to fire a good employee because that punk kid is too pussy to do it for no other reason than the guy had the balls to point out that the 26 year old "manager" is a lazy piece of shit.

Life is too short to be a pussy.

I'd try to arrange a meeting with the owner of said company and explain the situation objectively.

You'll remember being a gutless turd who fired a good employee for no other reason than a bad employee told you to for the rest of your life. You don't want to be that guy forever.

11-15-2014, 10:38 PM
Wallcrawler How tall is this thing? Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Ground 0 for enema of US. Casino cash: $4242912	Something of a moral dilemma So, Im in position to take over the reigns of the store Im currently working in. Its a very small staff, three of us managers and four part time employees. Things go pretty well most of the time, despite some maturity issues with my direct supervisor. He's only 26, and as far as the business goes, he knows literally everything. Theres no task or problem or issue that he cannot readily resolve within a few minutes. However, when it comes to actually leading a team of people, this guy is ASS. For real. Schedule changes with little to no notice, making people stay longer so that he can leave early, calling people in early so that he can go home, and being a dick in general about requests for time off even if they are the required two weeks in advance. So we have a part timer who does a decent job, not the sharpest knife in the drawer, but the effort is there. He's decided that we are going to part ways with this person, but Im going to be the one to cut the ties. Over the phone. To me, this is complete bullshit. The guy being fired, we'll call him "Joe" is only being fired because he's called the boss out on multiple offenses of laziness, both just hanging out in back while on a shift, as well as the multiple counts of leaving early. Joe's broken plans repeatedly, without complaint, to come in early so Boss could leave early. No emergency, just tired of being there. The first thing I tell Boss is that its chickenshit to fire someone over the phone. If Im going to take your ability to provide for your family from you, Im going to at least have the sac to look you in the face when I do it, and tell you why. Boss gives zero **s what I think, or what my view is. He's the boss, Im the subordinate, and my instructions are to call Joe in the morning and tell him that his services are no longer required. If I refuse, Ill be documented for insubordination and my position to take over the business will take a substantial hit, because the third manager "Yes Man" is a bit spineless when it comes to taking a stand on anything, and simply does what he's told without question. Now, I have no problem with Joe. Joe could be faster, and smarter, but Joe is always on time, always covers shifts when needed, and always works 100% of the time he is present. In short, dude's not perfect but he's doing everything he can at all times. That goes a long way in my book. I don't really know what I should do. I mean I want to tell Boss to go himself and if he wants to be a chickenshit and fire Joe over the phone for being called out as a lazy from time to time, that's his problem and not mine. On the other hand, I could lose my position to Yes Man and potentially screw myself out of a nice pay increase, perks, and better job security when Boss transfers in June. Going over Boss' head is out of the question, as the District Manager and Boss are aquainted outside of work and have known each other for about 5 years. So my choice is to call up Joe in the morning and tell him that he's fired and not be able to tell him exactly why he's being fired, or to tell my Boss to ** off and put my future at risk. Its such a shit thing to do to someone, especially so close to Christmas.
Posts: 6,932

11-15-2014, 11:25 PM	#42
LoneWolf Constable of Untruths Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Wichita Casino cash: $1741084	It's not normally a very smart move to call your boss lazy to his face, especially when being asked to get something done. At many companies this would be considered insubordination and a friable offense.
Posts: 14,997