Clinton, MO craziness

[dlphg9]

Looks like they have a swat situation going on

https://www.kshb.com/news/crime/clin...ed-in-shooting

[oldman]

I'm still wondering how the Clinton police got sent when the call came from Windsor. Do they cover the area, it's like 20 miles away?

[Jerm]

Originally Posted by oldman

I'm still wondering how the Clinton police got sent when the call came from Windsor. Do they cover the area, it's like 20 miles away?

Henry Co. Sheriff's Dept. does....its weird, I have no idea.

The only thing I can possibly think of was that the 911 callers were trying to set up the house where the shooting happened...drug deal gone bad or that got burned or something?

I really don't know.

[Spott]

Originally Posted by Flying High D

As a nation we need to come together and stop this crystal meth and opium epidemic. Is there anybody that hasn’t been touched by this shit.? I’ve lost 2 nephews to it and have a stepson that is strung out on it. Horrible ****ing path:

My younger brother died at 27 after taking heroine a couple of years ago. Since then a couple of his buddies in Columbia have suffered the same fate. I’ll never understand what draws people to that kind of life.

[Randallflagg]

This whole thing seems weird to me.....they responded to the wrong house (wrong address, wrong city) and just "happened" to hit another house where there was illegal stuff going on!?

What are the odds? In my world about ZERO....

Something stinks here.....

[LiL stumppy]

Originally Posted by Spott

My younger brother died at 27 after taking heroine a couple of years ago. Since then a couple of his buddies in Columbia have suffered the same fate. I’ll never understand what draws people to that kind of life.

Depression, anxiety, loneliness... the reality is many people self medicate with it or they take is as a rec drug and get hooked..

Have you ever taken a pain pill? Even legally?

[Spott]

Originally Posted by LiL stumppy

Depression, anxiety, loneliness... the reality is many people self medicate with it or they take is as a rec drug and get hooked..

Have you ever taken a pain pill? Even legally?

Taken Advil for a headache, but that's it. Never taken prescription painkillers or anything else like that.

[DenverChief]

Originally Posted by oldman

I'm still wondering how the Clinton police got sent when the call came from Windsor. Do they cover the area, it's like 20 miles away?

Happens all the time. Especially when neighboring jurisdictions have similar addresses. Someone calls 911 and says 5300 Holly instead of 5300 North Holly or some combination of. Just happened that the incorrect house was awash in serious criminal activity

[dlphg9]

The police went to the house that the cell phone was registered. The caller didn't say anything so the only thing they could do is send the police to that address. They then had to go in and check the residence, especially since the dispatcher heard screaming and the call was ended without anyone talking.

[dirk digler]

Originally Posted by dlphg9

The police went to the house that the cell phone was registered. The caller didn't say anything so the only thing they could do is send the police to that address. They then had to go in and check the residence, especially since the dispatcher heard screaming and the call was ended without anyone talking.

Yep. Life is so random but in the end the only one at fault is the POS killer.

They even said yesterday that he wouldn't let police in to get the officer and that he eventually just bled out. He was in there for a few hours. It is hard to say how any one would react or do but I don't know if I could stand outside and not do anything.

[cooper barrett]

Originally Posted by DenverChief

Happens all the time. Especially when neighboring jurisdictions have similar addresses. Someone calls 911 and says 5300 Holly instead of 5300 North Holly or some combination of. Just happened that the incorrect house was awash in serious criminal activity

Since the sheriff's dept. was at the house earlier that day there is a slim chance that a human error occurred. They should have known this within a short period of time. Then again, if you ****ed up this bad, would you not blame the system for sending an officer to his death instead of one of your own???

911, has a location tracking on all cell signals, (it's a state wide program in IN. I think county in MO. If you call 911 it knows what tower it's transmitting the signal through and with a series of bids can pinpoint a house or a person with great accuracy. It's just a series of bids that are made and results are usually dead on in about 60 seconds. I know that before they ask you the address you're calling from, they usually already have both your tower, but your location within a few hundred meters. I am sure the system, even in Henry County, has that capability.

The infomation doesn't tell us the source of the call that really did come from Windsor. If it was a land line then data systems sent the police to an address they weren't called to. If it was a VOIP call the VOIP account holder in Windsor may have lived in that house in Clinton and never changed the registration. I was guilty of that once. That would mean that every time a call was made from the house in Windsor, it appeared to come from Clinton.

I had a VOIP business system and using the VOIP service I could call you from the golf course in Palm Springs and it would appear that I called you from the office, if you called the office, it would ring in Palm Springs. The problem raised it's ugly head, in my case, when I called 911 when a friend broke a leg in Liberty, MO.The dispatcher kept telling me I was calling from Raymore, MO 30 miles away. This caused problems as they had to connect me outside of the 911 system to the dispatcher delaying medical attention for my friend. by several minutes. In this case it was a compound fracture but bleeding was controlled by pressure applied to the wound. It could have been far worse.

A failure to update the physical location of the VOIP service with a service can cause just what we had happen in Clinton. Using a PBX VOIP service can do the same thing. Drug dealers can hide their locations by calling using the internet on their smartphones and not even have a phone carrier. They can also falsify the address of the VOIP service where as a burner phone can tell your location once the account is revealed. Calls made on public WiFi are practically untraceable.

I think this is going to come forward and possibly show the two sisters who were having a fight and called 911 may have cost a good man his life. They may also, along with the service provider, find themselves liable for this officers death by not updating the location information when the VOIP was programmed to provide location data to 911 systems.

There seems to be a lot of certainty that the call came from 20 miles away but IMHO the cell phone 911 system was not the fault, I think it will comeback to a VOIP connection being improperly registered.

Per the MOPD:
"At no time did the person that was speaking at Windsor indicate that the address they were presently at was in Clinton," but they have confirmed the call did come from a Windsor location, how, I don'y know and nobodies talking.

I have not been following closely but has HCSD answered anything on the wrong address issue or is it silent with the MOHP and Henry County 911 taking charge of the investigation?

[cooper barrett]

Originally Posted by dlphg9

The police went to the house that the cell phone was registered. The caller didn't say anything so the only thing they could do is send the police to that address. They then had to go in and check the residence, especially since the dispatcher heard screaming and the call was ended without anyone talking.

Where did you get that info? Pay as you go phones don't know where you live and cell carriers that have that info don't give it out without a judges signature.

[Isaman]

Originally Posted by Flying High D

As a nation we need to come together and stop this crystal meth and opium epidemic. Is there anybody that hasn’t been touched by this shit.? I’ve lost 2 nephews to it and have a stepson that is strung out on it. Horrible ****ing path:

Sorry to hear that, brother. It's gut wrenching. They should start randomly sending the army to clear up towns from that kind of scum tbh.

[Abba-Dabba]

Originally Posted by Isaman

Sorry to hear that, brother. It's gut wrenching. They should start randomly sending the army to clear up towns from that kind of scum tbh.

You want the U.S. Army to perform combat operations in a U.S. city?

Just how does this go down in your mind as a possible, and reasonable idea?

[DenverChief]

Originally Posted by cooper barrett

Since the sheriff's dept. was at the house earlier that day there is a slim chance that a human error occurred. They should have known this within a short period of time. Then again, if you ****ed up this bad, would you not blame the system for sending an officer to his death instead of one of your own???

911, has a location tracking on all cell signals, (it's a state wide program in IN. I think county in MO. If you call 911 it knows what tower it's transmitting the signal through and with a series of bids can pinpoint a house or a person with great accuracy. It's just a series of bids that are made and results are usually dead on in about 60 seconds. I know that before they ask you the address you're calling from, they usually already have both your tower, but your location within a few hundred meters. I am sure the system, even in Henry County, has that capability.

The infomation doesn't tell us the source of the call that really did come from Windsor. If it was a land line then data systems sent the police to an address they weren't called to. If it was a VOIP call the VOIP account holder in Windsor may have lived in that house in Clinton and never changed the registration. I was guilty of that once. That would mean that every time a call was made from the house in Windsor, it appeared to come from Clinton.

I had a VOIP business system and using the VOIP service I could call you from the golf course in Palm Springs and it would appear that I called you from the office, if you called the office, it would ring in Palm Springs. The problem raised it's ugly head, in my case, when I called 911 when a friend broke a leg in Liberty, MO.The dispatcher kept telling me I was calling from Raymore, MO 30 miles away. This caused problems as they had to connect me outside of the 911 system to the dispatcher delaying medical attention for my friend. by several minutes. In this case it was a compound fracture but bleeding was controlled by pressure applied to the wound. It could have been far worse.

A failure to update the physical location of the VOIP service with a service can cause just what we had happen in Clinton. Using a PBX VOIP service can do the same thing. Drug dealers can hide their locations by calling using the internet on their smartphones and not even have a phone carrier. They can also falsify the address of the VOIP service where as a burner phone can tell your location once the account is revealed. Calls made on public WiFi are practically untraceable.

I think this is going to come forward and possibly show the two sisters who were having a fight and called 911 may have cost a good man his life. They may also, along with the service provider, find themselves liable for this officers death by not updating the location information when the VOIP was programmed to provide location data to 911 systems.

There seems to be a lot of certainty that the call came from 20 miles away but IMHO the cell phone 911 system was not the fault, I think it will comeback to a VOIP connection being improperly registered.

Per the MOPD:
"At no time did the person that was speaking at Windsor indicate that the address they were presently at was in Clinton," but they have confirmed the call did come from a Windsor location, how, I don'y know and nobodies talking.

I have not been following closely but has HCSD answered anything on the wrong address issue or is it silent with the MOHP and Henry County 911 taking charge of the investigation?

What you are referring to is phase 1 and phase 2 911. Not all PSAP's are phase 2 compliant yet. Phase 1 puts you with about 1/4th of a mile of a cell tower, phase 2 gives a more precise coordinate within a few hundred feet but it doesn't account for elevation. Cell phones without service must be capable of phase 1 911. Cell phones connected to wifi are not phase 1/2 compatible and must rely on the user to enter the correct address. In addition if you are connected to a wifi that is not your home wifi it will still report your address as you home address even though you may be at Starbucks. The 911 systems are still very fallible .

Good video on the topic

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=A-XlyB_QQYs

[cooper barrett]

Originally Posted by DenverChief

What you are referring to is phase 1 and phase 2 911. Not all PSAP's are phase 2 compliant yet. Phase 1 puts you with about 1/4th of a mile of a cell tower, phase 2 gives a more precise coordinate within a few hundred feet but it doesn't account for elevation. Cell phones without service must be capable of phase 1 911. Cell phones connected to wifi are not phase 1/2 compatible and must rely on the user to enter the correct address. In addition if you are connected to a wifi that is not your home wifi it will still report your address as you home address even though you may be at Starbucks. The 911 systems are still very fallible .

Good video on the topic, I always get my facts from Oliver's TV show.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=A-XlyB_QQYs

I know what Phase 1 and 2 are, It has nothing to do with what happened in Clinton. If they called on a VOIP phone There is no tower bid data and the address for VOIP is, as I said, not restricted to the address of record, the equipment can be moved and the service has no way of knowing. It is the users responsibility to update it. If these girls ordered a pizza, they may have delivered it to Clinton, not Windsor unless they used the manual address.
New systems are not addressing this that I know of.

There was no manual address given so VOIP gave the address on record to the dispatch center.

I did know that 911 in MO was a county by county program, thats why I asked why Henry County was investigating it's self in this matter...

"I have not been following closely but has HCSD answered anything on the wrong address issue or is it silent with the MOHP and Henry County 911 taking charge of the investigation?"