Football Brady v. NFL: No Settlement; Judge Berman to Decide - Page 5

Amnorix · 08-31-2015, 01:45 PM

Can't find the old thread. Brady and Goodell were back in NYC today for settlement talks. No progress.

Judge Berman said he would likely decide "in the next day or two" and definitely before September 4th.

Interesting how the narrative among the national writers has evolved.

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/roger-g...180816187.html

NEW YORK – They arrived surrounded by lawyers, each wearing a blue suit and displeased expression. Here was Roger Goodell and here was Tom Brady back in federal court in a fight over power, ego and legacy, as much as whether the footballs were deflated in January's AFC championship game.

New York Giants owner John Mara came in an attempt to soften the face of the league's side a bit. Jay Feely, a long-time NFL kicker and friend of Brady's from back at the University of Michigan, arrived to stand by his side.

Once again, nothing worked. A private meeting in front of Judge Richard M. Berman yielded nothing. No one budged. No one backed down. No settlement was reached.
And now both sides roll the dice and sit and wait for a ruling.

"Tomorrow or the day after," Berman said of when he would likely announce whether to vacate Brady's four-game suspension. He assured it would come before Sept. 4, when both sides requested an answer so the New England Patriots can begin preparing for the season opener with or without their star quarterback.

So that's that, all or nothing, all or everything, all eyes on the court docket here.

For Brady it's either a quarter of the season lost or a measure of redemption gained. For Goodell it's either a reaffirmation of the totality of his authority or another humiliating public defeat.

There may be appeals and requests for stays and thus months still to go, what will be won, what may not be done. None of that minimized the tension and drama inside Berman's 17th-floor courtroom here on Monday, when a case that started as a curiosity on that playoff night boiled toward a milestone, if not a conclusion.

Berman clearly knows how he is going to rule and likely has much of the decision already written. He's read and heard it all over the past month. There were no new arguments on Monday. The chief attorneys, Daniel Nash of the NFL and Jeffrey Kessler of the NFL Players Association, both merely stood and praised the efforts of all sides even though, as sometimes happens, they just couldn't reach a settlement.

"This is a time Mr. Nash and I are going to agree," Kessler joked.

The inability to find common ground is not a surprise. Tom Brady was simply never going to admit he had any role in the tampering of those footballs, or even that the footballs were ever tampered with in the first place.

First off, after he said as much under oath and then introduced the transcript into federal court, doing so would risk a perjury charge. More importantly though, it would be a complete reversal, making him a liar and a cheat, crushing his image among not just fans but, most importantly according to those that know him best, his own children.

He also very well may be innocent. The NFL never produced much of a case against him, let alone that the footballs were even unnaturally deflated.

So the only way a settlement could go down was for Goodell to drop any demands for an admission of guilt. He'd have to settle for Brady merely acknowledging a failure to fully cooperate with the investigation. That, however, would be a serious concession from a commissioner who's built his career on cracking heads among misbehaving players.

So there was the irresistible force clashing with the unmovable object, each willing to lose in court as long as he could still save face.
It has been, if nothing else, a remarkable showdown of oversized personalities.

In court Monday, the two men, rich and famous and atop their chosen professions, refused to even look at each other.

When the session was adjourned, both were forced to awkwardly wait for the galley to clear out of media and observers, leaving them within a few feet of each other a couple table rows apart.

Brady stood first and wandered over to one wood-paneled wall of the ornate courtroom. He stuffed his hands in his pocket, looking as intense as any tight fourth-quarter drive. Feely stood by his side and the two eventually hugged.

Goodell, seated in front, stood slowly and also put his hands in his pocket, looking down and then turning in the opposite direction of Brady, trying to wear a face of nonchalance.

Eight months into this scandal, after swings of allegations and misrepresentations, of false media leaks and broadside-legal attacks, the distrust and disgust were clear: Two men known for their ability to smoothly glide through life, with fashion and fabulous hair, looked strangely uncomfortable.

No one ever wants to sit in this position, leaving it to another man, federal judge or not, to declare whether he or she is a cheat or a fraud or a bully or a bum.

Here these two are though, going down that awkward path together. Their lives are seemingly too charmed for this, yet they were like a couple of rivals on opposite sides of the schoolyard, unwilling to even acknowledge the other's presence in front of onlookers.

The stakes seem higher for Goodell, if only because his legal argument here is based on the 1981 Supreme Court decision MLBPA v. Garvey, which essentially prohibits judges from interfering with the decision of arbitrators even if they are horrendously flawed or based on inaccurate facts. Arguing you have the right to be a dictator isn't ideal in public relations terms.

As such, Goodell and the NFL could certainly prevail in front of Berman but do so via a ruling full of the same kind of harsh verbiage that the judge used during two prior public sessions.

It's clear that no matter which way Berman goes, he looked upon the NFL's judicial system in general, and the league's conduct in this case specifically, as lacking any semblance of fairness or competency. He could unload in the ruling and leave Goodell laid out, even if he's technically victorious.

That's the risk Goodell was willing to take. And one Brady is willing to go with, essentially entering the verdict stage with a two-pronged chance at redemption – either total or at least in the court of public opinion. A loss and a four-game suspension would hurt, but he could at least point to an impartial federal judge down in New York agreeing that Goodell is out of line.

It's certainly reasonable that the NFL initially erred when it failed to comprehend Ideal Gas Law and thus initially thought any Patriots football that measured below 12.5 pounds per square inch of inflation was a sign of nefarious conduct. It immediately went after a speeding ticket like a homicide case.

But by the time the league should've have dialed it back, it had already leaked prejudicial stories and begun building a case against Brady and two Patriots locker room attendants. The NFL never was able to find a smoking gun or much more than suspicions, but that didn't matter.

The NFL not only never backed down, it just kept doubling down, believing the full force of the league's power – both in the CBA and in its ability to manipulate national reporters – would overwhelm Brady.

The league may be correct and on the verge of a show-of-force victory. It may be wrong and headed for a comeuppance.

It's all up to Judge Berman now. Who knows what he thinks and who knows what he'll rule. On Monday he seemed eager to make it known though as he sent the two men in fancy blue suits off into the Manhattan morning, Goodell via a black Escalade, Brady in a Chevy Suburban. Each is left awaiting his word.

The QB v. the Commissioner, it's all or everything now.

TEX · 08-31-2015, 04:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coochie liquor

I'm in Judge Bermans fantasy league, and he just drafted Brady. A sign??

MagicHef · 08-31-2015, 04:47 PM

Quote:

Teams generally fumble slightly more often at home than on the road because they get to run more plays at home than on the road.

Amnorix, can you read this sentence and tell me if it makes any sense to you?

Amnorix · 08-31-2015, 05:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tombstone RJ

Where is the link for this quote?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tombstone RJ

Where are you getting this info. from?

All the same source as the first quote, sorry.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2...mble-advantage

And yes, only two years, but the most RECENT two years. Not like they cherry-picked data and presetned it in misleading fashion, like the Patriots-are-cheaters-look-at-this-chart site did.

Counting special teams play fumbles?! WTF?

Amnorix · 08-31-2015, 05:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MagicHef

Amnorix, can you read this sentence and tell me if it makes any sense to you?

Nope, it doesn't make any sense to me.

EDIT: Maybe teams average more snaps in home games than road games? That might be true. I have no idea... I wouldn't think it would be enough snaps to be statistically significant, but who knows.

**Ming the Merciless** · 08-31-2015, 05:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TEX

So sick of Tom Brady and the Patriots...

Maybe you should create a fake 'scandal' and get them penalized so they have a harder time rapeing everyone...

Oh Wai...

Red Dawg · 08-31-2015, 05:22 PM

Tugging Brady has no case. He was treated just like every other player. Effing bullshit.

Amnorix · 08-31-2015, 05:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tuckdaddy

Tugging Brady has no case. He was treated just like every other player. Effing bullshit.

Bullshit.

No player in NFL HISTORY was ever suspended for equipment violations.

No player in NFL HISTORY was ever suspended for failure to cooperate in an investigation.

That right there is actually a huge part of my problem with this. The Commish engages in cowboy justice, doing whatever the fuq he wants to whoever the fuq he wants for whatever fuqqing reason he wants. It's absurd.

MagicHef · 08-31-2015, 05:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amnorix

Nope, it doesn't make any sense to me.

EDIT: Maybe teams average more snaps in home games than road games? That might be true. I have no idea... I wouldn't think it would be enough snaps to be statistically significant, but who knows.

They may have more snaps at home, but this guy is saying that fumbles happen at a higher rate because there are more snaps. That makes no sense.

Did you notice that the sentence that makes no sense was a quote from one of your posts? Does it concern you that the people you are quoting in your defense apparently are numbskulls who don't understand the difference between rates and occurrences, a distinction that is crucial to the topic at hand?

jspchief · 08-31-2015, 05:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amnorix

Bullshit.

No player in NFL HISTORY was ever suspended for equipment violations.

No player in NFL HISTORY was ever suspended for failure to cooperate in an investigation.

That right there is actually a huge part of my problem with this. The Commish engages in cowboy justice, doing whatever the fuq he wants to whoever the fuq he wants for whatever fuqqing reason he wants. It's absurd.

You've turned into a huge douchebag. I pray that someone changes your name again so you can stomp off in another fit.

Mr. Laz · 08-31-2015, 05:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tuckdaddy

Tugging Brady has no case. He was treated just like every other player. Effing bullshit.

judges have sided with Unions on almost every case, they don't give a single shit about the Collective Bargaining Agreement.

Remember that judge forcing that kid in Texas to marry his girlfriend?

Completely against the law but Judges just do whatever they feel like

jspchief · 08-31-2015, 05:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. Laz

judges have sided with Unions on almost ever case, they don't give a single shit about the Collective Bargaining Agreement.

Remember that judge forcing that kid to marry his girlfriend. Completely against the law but Judges just do whatever they feel like

Yep. This is this guy's ultimate chance at the spotlight. Don't be surprised if he uses it as a soapbox.

Mr. Laz · 08-31-2015, 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amnorix

Bullshit.

No player in NFL HISTORY was ever suspended for equipment violations.

No player in NFL HISTORY was ever suspended for failure to cooperate in an investigation.

That right there is actually a huge part of my problem with this. The Commish engages in cowboy justice, doing whatever the fuq he wants to whoever the fuq he wants for whatever fuqqing reason he wants. It's absurd.

No more than the Douchbag Patriot Nation

do whatever they want, whenever want ... everyone can **** off

Brady gutless coward
Front office covers his ass with bullshit lies
Entire fan base bleeds all over the place making up shit whenever it's convenience

Deflator name is from losing weight, complete bullshit
Brady doesn't know equipment managers, complete bullshit
Brady doesn't know what PSI is, total bullshit
Equipment managers wouldn't touch the footballs without specific approval from their QB

all this is more than enough circumstantial evidence to know Brady cheated

Aaron Hernandez was sent to jail for life on less

the judge will reverse the entire suspension ... i just hope karma is watching and Brady blows out his knee on the 1st snap of the season

**Mr. Flopnuts** · 08-31-2015, 06:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MagicHef

I can. The NFLPA negotiated the current CBA and agreed to give the commissioner the power he has. He used that power, the NFLPA is now trying to argue against the CBA they agreed to.

IMO, he'll throw it out, maintaining Brady's suspension.

And if he doesn't, the owners should rip up the CBA and negotiate something better suited for them since the players side doesn't feel the need to follow it. Look at Kam Chancellor in Seattle as exhibit B.

Brock · 08-31-2015, 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. Laz

judges have sided with Unions on almost every case, they don't give a single shit about the Collective Bargaining Agreement.

Remember that judge forcing that kid in Texas to marry his girlfriend?

Completely against the law but Judges just do whatever they feel like

This is the third time you've brought this up. The judge told the guy he could serve his sentence for punching his girlfriend's ex boyfriend, or he could marry her and they'd forget the whole thing. Both the "kid" and his girlfriend were happy about it. Quit being stupid.

TLO · 08-31-2015, 06:14 PM

This is like an Alex Smith thread, but in drag.

08-31-2015, 01:45 PM
Amnorix In BB I trust Join Date: May 2003 Location: Boston, Mass. Casino cash: $10029808	Brady v. NFL: No Settlement; Judge Berman to Decide Can't find the old thread. Brady and Goodell were back in NYC today for settlement talks. No progress. Judge Berman said he would likely decide "in the next day or two" and definitely before September 4th. Interesting how the narrative among the national writers has evolved. http://sports.yahoo.com/news/roger-g...180816187.html NEW YORK – They arrived surrounded by lawyers, each wearing a blue suit and displeased expression. Here was Roger Goodell and here was Tom Brady back in federal court in a fight over power, ego and legacy, as much as whether the footballs were deflated in January's AFC championship game. New York Giants owner John Mara came in an attempt to soften the face of the league's side a bit. Jay Feely, a long-time NFL kicker and friend of Brady's from back at the University of Michigan, arrived to stand by his side. Once again, nothing worked. A private meeting in front of Judge Richard M. Berman yielded nothing. No one budged. No one backed down. No settlement was reached. And now both sides roll the dice and sit and wait for a ruling. "Tomorrow or the day after," Berman said of when he would likely announce whether to vacate Brady's four-game suspension. He assured it would come before Sept. 4, when both sides requested an answer so the New England Patriots can begin preparing for the season opener with or without their star quarterback. So that's that, all or nothing, all or everything, all eyes on the court docket here. For Brady it's either a quarter of the season lost or a measure of redemption gained. For Goodell it's either a reaffirmation of the totality of his authority or another humiliating public defeat. There may be appeals and requests for stays and thus months still to go, what will be won, what may not be done. None of that minimized the tension and drama inside Berman's 17th-floor courtroom here on Monday, when a case that started as a curiosity on that playoff night boiled toward a milestone, if not a conclusion. Berman clearly knows how he is going to rule and likely has much of the decision already written. He's read and heard it all over the past month. There were no new arguments on Monday. The chief attorneys, Daniel Nash of the NFL and Jeffrey Kessler of the NFL Players Association, both merely stood and praised the efforts of all sides even though, as sometimes happens, they just couldn't reach a settlement. "This is a time Mr. Nash and I are going to agree," Kessler joked. The inability to find common ground is not a surprise. Tom Brady was simply never going to admit he had any role in the tampering of those footballs, or even that the footballs were ever tampered with in the first place. First off, after he said as much under oath and then introduced the transcript into federal court, doing so would risk a perjury charge. More importantly though, it would be a complete reversal, making him a liar and a cheat, crushing his image among not just fans but, most importantly according to those that know him best, his own children. He also very well may be innocent. The NFL never produced much of a case against him, let alone that the footballs were even unnaturally deflated. So the only way a settlement could go down was for Goodell to drop any demands for an admission of guilt. He'd have to settle for Brady merely acknowledging a failure to fully cooperate with the investigation. That, however, would be a serious concession from a commissioner who's built his career on cracking heads among misbehaving players. So there was the irresistible force clashing with the unmovable object, each willing to lose in court as long as he could still save face. It has been, if nothing else, a remarkable showdown of oversized personalities. In court Monday, the two men, rich and famous and atop their chosen professions, refused to even look at each other. When the session was adjourned, both were forced to awkwardly wait for the galley to clear out of media and observers, leaving them within a few feet of each other a couple table rows apart. Brady stood first and wandered over to one wood-paneled wall of the ornate courtroom. He stuffed his hands in his pocket, looking as intense as any tight fourth-quarter drive. Feely stood by his side and the two eventually hugged. Goodell, seated in front, stood slowly and also put his hands in his pocket, looking down and then turning in the opposite direction of Brady, trying to wear a face of nonchalance. Eight months into this scandal, after swings of allegations and misrepresentations, of false media leaks and broadside-legal attacks, the distrust and disgust were clear: Two men known for their ability to smoothly glide through life, with fashion and fabulous hair, looked strangely uncomfortable. No one ever wants to sit in this position, leaving it to another man, federal judge or not, to declare whether he or she is a cheat or a fraud or a bully or a bum. Here these two are though, going down that awkward path together. Their lives are seemingly too charmed for this, yet they were like a couple of rivals on opposite sides of the schoolyard, unwilling to even acknowledge the other's presence in front of onlookers. The stakes seem higher for Goodell, if only because his legal argument here is based on the 1981 Supreme Court decision MLBPA v. Garvey, which essentially prohibits judges from interfering with the decision of arbitrators even if they are horrendously flawed or based on inaccurate facts. Arguing you have the right to be a dictator isn't ideal in public relations terms. As such, Goodell and the NFL could certainly prevail in front of Berman but do so via a ruling full of the same kind of harsh verbiage that the judge used during two prior public sessions. It's clear that no matter which way Berman goes, he looked upon the NFL's judicial system in general, and the league's conduct in this case specifically, as lacking any semblance of fairness or competency. He could unload in the ruling and leave Goodell laid out, even if he's technically victorious. That's the risk Goodell was willing to take. And one Brady is willing to go with, essentially entering the verdict stage with a two-pronged chance at redemption – either total or at least in the court of public opinion. A loss and a four-game suspension would hurt, but he could at least point to an impartial federal judge down in New York agreeing that Goodell is out of line. It's certainly reasonable that the NFL initially erred when it failed to comprehend Ideal Gas Law and thus initially thought any Patriots football that measured below 12.5 pounds per square inch of inflation was a sign of nefarious conduct. It immediately went after a speeding ticket like a homicide case. But by the time the league should've have dialed it back, it had already leaked prejudicial stories and begun building a case against Brady and two Patriots locker room attendants. The NFL never was able to find a smoking gun or much more than suspicions, but that didn't matter. The NFL not only never backed down, it just kept doubling down, believing the full force of the league's power – both in the CBA and in its ability to manipulate national reporters – would overwhelm Brady. The league may be correct and on the verge of a show-of-force victory. It may be wrong and headed for a comeuppance. It's all up to Judge Berman now. Who knows what he thinks and who knows what he'll rule. On Monday he seemed eager to make it known though as he sent the two men in fancy blue suits off into the Manhattan morning, Goodell via a black Escalade, Brady in a Chevy Suburban. Each is left awaiting his word. The QB v. the Commissioner, it's all or everything now.
Posts: 43,125

08-31-2015, 05:22 PM	#66
Red Dawg Going home eventually Join Date: Dec 2002 Casino cash: $4432858	Tugging Brady has no case. He was treated just like every other player. Effing bullshit. __________________ If you're not first you're last!
Posts: 30,489

08-31-2015, 06:14 PM	#75
TLO Life is changing.. Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: NW Missouri Casino cash: $1354900	This is like an Alex Smith thread, but in drag.
Posts: 39,294