The Patriots make a mockery of the Herm Way of Football

[FloridaMan88]

The Patriots showed once again today that the belief that you have to run the ball and have a balanced offense in order to win is an ancient myth... a myth that Herm still holds onto dearly.

This is why Herm will never be a championship caliber head coach in today's NFL.. he will never accept the fact that the great teams today are built around explosive, aggressive passing games and rely on these passing games as their primary source of offense.

The Patriots had NINE freaking rushing attempts all game and just 22 yards rushing for the game. Instead they relied on an aggressive passing game, often times spreading the field with 5 wide and attacking early and often downfield (yes actually passing the ball on FIRST down... a novel concept to Herm) with big passing plays.

Remember Herm often has said you can't just go back and pass every play and win in the NFL... well tell that to the Patriots. Tell that to Green Bay, Dallas and Indy... all teams that rely heavily on the pass.

As long as Herm Edwards is the coach of the Chiefs, this team will continue to be stale, out of date and never a serious contender in today's NFL.

[Mr. Laz]

Originally Posted by FringeNC

Dick Vermeil?

Dam you, Dick!!!!!!!!!

[Chief Faithful]

Originally Posted by Chiefs_5627

Oline as bad as KC's?!? I disagree with that. Kitna isnt a slouch and is a vet, we've been playing with a backup and a young'n. Plus the lions are at .500, so its not likt theyre tearing the league up like the Pats or Colts Os are.

Their Oline is ranked in the same range as the Chiefs statiscally. Kitna is the definition of average and has failed everywhere he went until Martz got hold of him. The Lions are not a complete team and not ready to tear up the league, but Martz is showing what can be done with the same offense with talent no better than the Chiefs. Right now the Chiefs would be doing well to be playing .500.

People keep wanting to look at the Pats, Colts, and GB as examples, which is ridiculous because of the talent gap. No so with Detroit. Comparable talent and same scheme.

[Mr. Laz]

hell .... the colts offensive line isn't much better than the chiefs.

[RedThat]

Originally Posted by Laz

hell .... the colts offensive line isn't much better than the chiefs.

Than why are they good, and the Chiefs look like the worst in the league? coaching?

[Zouk]

Originally Posted by Laz

hell .... the colts offensive line isn't much better than the chiefs.

That's crazy. The Colts are so much better at every position except LG, where it's probably a tie. Just because the players weren't drafted high doesn't mean they're not really really good.

[Chief Faithful]

Originally Posted by Amnorix

I'm not saying "pass first" isn't a valid philosophy. In teh current NFL, it definitely is. But you've got to scheme to fit your players, and I dont' think the Chiefs have the right talent. Heck, I'm not sure they have the right talent right now for any competent offensive attack scheme, and that's part of the problem. One pro bowl TE, OLineman and RB ain't enough if the component parts aren't really average NFL players at this point in their careers.

Are you trying to say the Chiefs are fitting their offensive scheme to the talent available? I doubt Martz would be running the same offense with this same talent.

As for offensive components Kitna is a vet, but not nearly as talented with the pass as Croyle. Kennison and Bowe are more than enough talent to do what Martz is doing with Williams and Johnson. The Chiefs have the edge at RB and TE while I believe the Lions have only a slight edge on OLine.

I was watching them run pass plays on first down yesterday from the exact same formation that Solari only runs from and having great success. The Chiefs have the talent to run those same plays, but they don't.

The Chiefs need talent, which is not debatable. That does not mean they are using the talent they have that is the sad part.

[FringeNC]

Originally Posted by Zouk

That's crazy. The Colts are so much better at every position except LG, where it's probably a tie. Just because the players weren't drafted high doesn't mean they're not really really good.

And how much of being good on the O-line is team production synergy created by good coaching? SF in the day could stick anyone in there, and have a better-than-average O-line.

[Mr. Laz]

Originally Posted by Zouk

That's crazy. The Colts are so much better at every position except LG, where it's probably a tie. Just because the players weren't drafted high doesn't mean they're not really really good.

and i think your judgment is highly suspect .... so lets just move on.

[Zouk]

Originally Posted by Laz

and i think your judgment is highly suspect .... so lets just move on.

That's fine, but it's not my judgment that really matters. Let's see how much the market of NFL general managers is willing to pay Jake Scott and Ryan Lilja this offseason vs. how much they're willing to pay Casey Wiegmann, John Welbourn, and Chris Terry. They'll all be on the open market.

Now I'll move on too.

[Chief Faithful]

Originally Posted by Amnorix

Well, let's see. Lions are in the NFC which is mostly weaker, though the NFC North has some good defenses. Kitna is a vet, whereas Chiefs have the QB of the week going on lately, including Croyle, who doesn't have much experience.

I take it you did not watch the Dallas vs Detroit game. They did the same against the Vikings, Bears and Green Bay. I watched the game yesterday and just kept asking why don't the Chiefs try those plays on the same downs and mix it up like that. Nothing predictable, fancy, or risky. They just used what they had unlike the Chiefs who keep trying to make the same plays work without success every week. Denver never had such an easy week of preparation.

[Mr. Laz]

Originally Posted by RedBull

Than why are they good, and the Chiefs look like the worst in the league? coaching?

because of several reasons....


1. general coaching - the olineman are coached a prepared to know the scheme and execute the scheme in indy.

2. attitude - the players believe in the scheme and fellow players. offense is the red-headed stepchild with Herm and the players know it.

3. scheme - these days in the NFL the athletic ability of the players is so close that coaching and scheme is huge. A scheme that gives the players any kind of edge can make all the difference.


listen ... unpredictability is an offensive lineman's best friend. when the Oline knows what's gonna happen and the defense doesn't it gives every Offensive lineman a step head start in getting to their blocks. The more unpredictable the bigger the head start. That can make every offensive lineman look quicker and look studly.

when a defense is just attacking without fear or regard ... the offensive lineman have to start "reaching" for blocks. They look slow and off-balance.


Brian Waters went to Hawaii in our last scheme but looks like a lazy bum in this one. Yes, having Roaf next to him helps but he is still getting abused several times a game when it's one-on-one.


do we have the best offensive line talent ...... no.

but our scheme and coaching are making them worse than they really are.


we trade offensive line with the colts and we would still stink and people would be screaming for lilja's head.

[Baby Lee]

Originally Posted by Mecca

It was in the middle of the game, it was just a general game situation I remember thinking I've never seen a coach be that pissed to score. Herm really thinks big plays that score quickly are bad.

If that even happened, your extrapolation of the rationale is a stretch.
Maybe the play called from the sidelines was fundamentally sound and Vinnie came a whisker away from an INT.
Maybe the play called by Vinnie was a 'secret weapon' they were saving for a more pressing situation, and now the whole league was let in on it.
Your fevered recollection certainly doesn't tell us 'all we need to know' about Herm.

[Baby Lee]

Originally Posted by KCChiefsfan88

What do the 2006 Chargers, Patriots and Bears all have in common? They all didn't win the Super Bowl and two of those teams... the Patriots and the Bears lost to a Colts team that won because of their passing game.

The Bears SUPER EFFING BOWL loss was not a loss by paradigm. The Bears had great receivers an an idiot savant QB who happened to puke on his shoes in the big game. Switch QBs, leave everything else the same, and the Manning led Bears kills the Colts 45-7.

[Baby Lee]

Originally Posted by KCChiefsfan88

Sure an improved defense and a productive running game had a complimentary role in their Super Bowl run... but the heart and the basis of the Colts Super Bowl run was Manning and the passing game.

The Patriots offseason was based on what happened to them in the AFC Championship game vs the Colts and realizing that they had to develop an equally strong passing game in order to beat the Colts.

And relying solely on Manning and the passing game was what had Manning spending half a decade as the Schottenheimer of QBs.

[Kerberos]

Originally Posted by Zouk

That's crazy. The Colts are so much better at every position except LG, where it's probably a tie. Just because the players weren't drafted high doesn't mean they're not really really good.

And to think ONE of those gaurds for INDY was in our house before we tried to hide him on the practice squad. What WORTHLESS (backup) POS's did we decide to keep on the active roster insead of Ryan Lilja?


6-2, 290
Kansas State
4 years in the NFL
W-04 (KC)
DOB: 10/15/1981