Malaysia Airlines loses contact with plane carrying 239 people

[ShowtimeSBMVP]

Malaysia Airlines says it has lost contact with a plane with 239 aboard enroute from Kuala Lumpur to Beijing.

The airline said in a statement early Saturday it was attempting to locate the Boeing 777 after it lost contact with Subang Air Traffic Control at 2:40 a.m. It was scheduled to land in Beijing at 6:30 a.m.

China's state-run news agency Xinhua reported the plane was lost in airspace controlled by Vietnam, and did not make contact with Chinese air traffic controllers.

The plane is carrying 227 passengers, including two infants, and 12 crew members. The airline said it is working with authorities to locate the plane.

Boeing said on its Twitter account it is monitoring the situation, and "our thoughts are with everyone on board."



http://www.foxnews.com/world/2014/03...ing-23-people/









Malaysian jet probe sharpens focus on passengers, crew as new clues emerge


http://www.foxnews.com/world/2014/03...-indian-ocean/

[Donger]

Originally Posted by patteeu

I'm under the impression that they caught multiple pings, maybe from multiple satellites, which is why I would think they'd have a better idea of the path the plane took. If that's the only ping they received, then the confusion makes total sense.

Unfortunately, the airline apparently doesn't subscribe to the engine service which would have given much more information.

[patteeu]

Originally Posted by Donger

Unfortunately, the airline apparently doesn't subscribe to the engine service which would have given much more information.

Yeah, I get that, but the system still emits a periodic ping whether you subscribe or not.

[Donger]

Originally Posted by patteeu

Yeah, I get that, but the system still emits a periodic ping whether you subscribe or not.

Recent upgrades to the Inmarsat satellite constellation make it capable of receiving detailed position, altitude and speed data embedded in its pings to aircraft flying below.

However, the 12-year-old Boeing jetliner wasn't configured to broadcast those definitive points of data, people being briefed on the investigation say.

After not receiving new data from the 777 after its automated reporting system was switched off, the automated satellite pings—the digital equivalent of a handshake—originated at a ground stations and was transmitted up to the orbiting satellite high above the Earth's equator. The satellite relays the ping down to the aircraft below, effectively asking the jet if it is still able to send and receive data. After receiving it, Flight 370 transmitted a return ping back up to Inmarsat, which in turn relayed it to the ground station.

Because the angle and distance of the aircraft relative to the orbiting satellite changed as the jet flew over the Earth's surface, each ping to Flight 370 gave Malaysian officials, the National Transportation Safety Board, the Federal Aviation Administration and the U.K.'s Air Accidents Investigation Branch enough information to plot the 777's speed, altitude and changing path.

With the data at hand, investigators were unable to determine if the jet's pings were north or south of its last known primary radar sighting. Two points on the globe below the satellite, with mirror angles and equal distances from the satellite, left investigators to conclude the jet had sent its final satellite ping in the probable corridors to the north or south.

The satellites "can't give straight directional" guidance, "therefore the calculation is looking left and right of the satellite," said an industry official briefed on the investigation. The estimated path "suffers from the fact that...the system wasn't set up for that."

[patteeu]

Originally Posted by Donger

Recent upgrades to the Inmarsat satellite constellation make it capable of receiving detailed position, altitude and speed data embedded in its pings to aircraft flying below.

However, the 12-year-old Boeing jetliner wasn't configured to broadcast those definitive points of data, people being briefed on the investigation say.

After not receiving new data from the 777 after its automated reporting system was switched off, the automated satellite pings—the digital equivalent of a handshake—originated at a ground stations and was transmitted up to the orbiting satellite high above the Earth's equator. The satellite relays the ping down to the aircraft below, effectively asking the jet if it is still able to send and receive data. After receiving it, Flight 370 transmitted a return ping back up to Inmarsat, which in turn relayed it to the ground station.

Because the angle and distance of the aircraft relative to the orbiting satellite changed as the jet flew over the Earth's surface, each ping to Flight 370 gave Malaysian officials, the National Transportation Safety Board, the Federal Aviation Administration and the U.K.'s Air Accidents Investigation Branch enough information to plot the 777's speed, altitude and changing path.

With the data at hand, investigators were unable to determine if the jet's pings were north or south of its last known primary radar sighting. Two points on the globe below the satellite, with mirror angles and equal distances from the satellite, left investigators to conclude the jet had sent its final satellite ping in the probable corridors to the north or south.

The satellites "can't give straight directional" guidance, "therefore the calculation is looking left and right of the satellite," said an industry official briefed on the investigation. The estimated path "suffers from the fact that...the system wasn't set up for that."

That's more information, and it states the conclusion, but it doesn't really answer my question.

[Sully]

A couple of questions from an obviously uninformed aviation layman...

Is it possible, if there was some sort of fire, the pilot could have landed on the ocean like Sullenburger, which is why there is no debris? (although, I guess there'd be lifejackets in that scenario).

If the plane crashed "gently" somewhere, how long could the engines just run?

[Jimmya]

Not very long I assume.

[ToxSocks]

Originally Posted by patteeu

That's more information, and it states the conclusion, but it doesn't really answer my question.

What exactly is your question? I thought that post answered everything.

[patteeu]

Originally Posted by Detoxing

What exactly is your question? I thought that post answered everything.

My question is why can't they do a better job of figuring out whether the aircraft went north or south?

If there is only one ping after loss of radar tracking, I get it. The article suggests otherwise though.

If the only satellite receiving pings is in geosynchronous orbit and the plane coincidentally happens to be traveling along an equidistant arc, I get it. This isn't made clear by the article.

What I'd like to know is how many pings were received, how frequently were they received, and how many of them were received while military radar was tracking the aircraft so they can get an idea of the direction, speed, and altitude at those data points and use that as a basis for analyzing the subsequent pings.

[planetdoc]

Cops find five Indian Ocean practice runways in MH370 pilot’s simulator

Investigators have discovered the runways of five airports near the Indian Ocean loaded into Captain Zaharie Ahmad Shah’s home-made flight simulator, a Malay daily reported today.

An unnamed source told Berita Harian that while it was too early to make any conclusions on the new finding, it was still considered an important element in the probe on the whereabouts of the plane and its 239 people.

“The simulation programmes are based on runways at the Male International Airport in Maldives, an airport owned by the United States (Diego Garcia), and three other runways in India and Sri Lanka, all have runway lengths of 1,000 metres.

[alnorth]

So, yesterday I was thinking the pilot's life was too good to snap and I was suspecting the young co-pilot...

I changed my mind, I think the pilot did it, there were a couple things going on with him. First, he's a very fervent supporter of the opposition party in Malaysia, which is not suspicious in itself, except the thoroughly corrupt Malaysian government brought some silly trumped-up charges of Sodomy (which is illegal there) against the opposition leader, and had him jailed hours before the flight. The pilot was such a gung-ho supporter that he attended rallies, may have attended the trial, and recently wore a T-shirt saying "democracy is dead".

Second, his wife and kids moved out the day before the flight.

So, both of these things happened at once, he doesn't seem to have any interest in those northern countries and if he was going to attack the Malaysian government he would have done it by now. As obsessed as he was with politics, seeing his political hero get jailed, having his family leave, he may have basically said "so long, cruel world", and wanted to kill himself but didn't want anyone to think he was a bad guy so he sneaks out to the Indian Ocean.

[mikeyis4dcats.]

Originally Posted by planetdoc

Cops find five Indian Ocean practice runways in MH370 pilot’s simulator

it would be likely he'd practive on airports he might encounter in his duties as a pilot, so this is really non-news.

[alnorth]

Originally Posted by planetdoc

Cops find five Indian Ocean practice runways in MH370 pilot’s simulator

That means absolutely nothing to me. If you are going to play with a flight simulator for just innocent recreational purposes, you presumably want to load in the smaller airports near your real-world location. Like, I'd probably want to load in the Ankeny Airport and probably some runway near Ames and Iowa City in addition to Des Moines International if I was playing with one.

[planetdoc]

Originally Posted by mikeyis4dcats.

it would be likely he'd practive on airports he might encounter in his duties as a pilot, so this is really non-news.

agree. Same with programming the "left turn" into the computer system during the flight. That could have been done if he didnt have visibility to fly himself such as smoke.

[patteeu]

Originally Posted by alnorth

So, yesterday I was thinking the pilot's life was too good to snap and I was suspecting the young co-pilot...

I changed my mind, I think the pilot did it, there were a couple things going on with him. First, he's a very fervent supporter of the opposition party in Malaysia, which is not suspicious in itself, except the thoroughly corrupt Malaysian government brought some silly trumped-up charges of Sodomy (which is illegal there) against the opposition leader, and had him jailed hours before the flight. The pilot was such a gung-ho supporter that he attended rallies, may have attended the trial, and recently wore a T-shirt saying "democracy is dead".

Second, his wife and kids moved out the day before the flight.

So, both of these things happened at once, he doesn't seem to have any interest in those northern countries and if he was going to attack the Malaysian government he would have done it by now. As obsessed as he was with politics, seeing his political hero get jailed, having his family leave, he may have basically said "so long, cruel world", and wanted to kill himself but didn't want anyone to think he was a bad guy so he sneaks out to the Indian Ocean.

Did the family leave as in "we're getting divorced and I'm taking the kids", did they flee the country, or did they just go to visit grandma while dad is on a trip?

[Rain Man]

Originally Posted by patteeu

My question is why can't they do a better job of figuring out whether the aircraft went north or south?

If there is only one ping after loss of radar tracking, I get it. The article suggests otherwise though.

If the only satellite receiving pings is in geosynchronous orbit and the plane coincidentally happens to be traveling along an equidistant arc, I get it. This isn't made clear by the article.

What I'd like to know is how many pings were received, how frequently were they received, and how many of them were received while military radar was tracking the aircraft so they can get an idea of the direction, speed, and altitude at those data points and use that as a basis for analyzing the subsequent pings.

Yeah, that's what I'm not getting. If there are multiple pings, it seems like you could at least draw a distance vector. It might be complicated if both the satellite and the plane are moving, but it seems like you could do something. The curve that we see on the news almost indicates that there was one ping and they could calculate distance on it.