Late night bullshit: Drafting a passrusher in the first next year.

[Direckshun]

Let's face some serious facts that need to be faced going forward:

1. Alex Smith is The Guy, and the Chiefs will not draft QB in the 1st round.

2. The Chiefs are going to cut Tamba Hali. He costs too much against the cap in a year the Chiefs need to make room for Houston.

3. Dee Ford has not looked good, and while he can develop into a nice player eventually, he's not getting the snaps to do that right now.

Given these facts, why should we dismiss out of hand that the Chiefs wouldn't draft another passrusher in next year's 1st?

The team must remain traumatized by last year's experience of having zero depth at the position -- drafting someone like Randy Gregory and bringing Dee off the bench (and starting him if someone goes down) may not be the best use of resources of 2014's 1st rounder, but it would provide the team key depth and provide it a hellacious passrush with Houston and somebody like Gregory, with someone like Ford spelling either passrusher.

I think it's also possible the Chiefs draft a DE next year in the first, as I anticipate they will let Allen Bailey walk, and cut Mike DeVito -- but Kevin Vickerson is anybody's guess. I don't think they go offensive line -- I bet they bring Rodney Hudson, Jeff Allen, and Donald Stephenson back, although Allen and Stephenson would likely be in their last years in KC.

Playmaker is the most obvious go-to in this draft, but it's not clear where the fits are at CB or S. The best corner in this draft is 5'9" and a hair slower than Dorsey likes them. It's not clear yet if there are any potentially dominant safety talents.

WR is the most obvious place to go, and Sammie Coates is as obvious a John Dorsey pick as there is in this draft -- all measurables, all project. Amari Cooper is more steady, but he's not outstanding in any phase of the game that I've detected except perhaps route-running -- and Alabama players do horribly in the NFL. That leaves you with Stephon Diggs.

At this point, I'd project Coates as a future Chief if we land a top ten pick, but a passrusher or down lineman would not surprise me.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by milkman

If Ford turns out to be a good, or even great player, then it's a lucky pick, but it doesn't justify the pick at the time.

When the Chiefs made this selection, he was not the best player available.
He was not a pick of a critical need.

There were better players available, and some were positions of critical need.

There is no way to justify that pick when it was made.

That is a different argument. I don't disagree that maybe he wasn't bpa.

I'm arguing against the weird view Cp has started to adopt that we shouldn't draft pass rushers just because we have them. Pass rushers are great first round picks. IF they are any good.

[milkman]

Originally Posted by SNR

No, he's ****ing not.

He never made the case for drafting Rodgers over Johnson. At least not then.

This is part of his shtick. He ASKS QUESTIONS after the fact, and never ever takes a side. He doesn't ever have an opinion or say what he thinks the Chiefs should do.

He doesn't evaluate. He doesn't choose. He doesn't predict. He doesn't analyze. He just puts topics up for debate, steps back, and then acts like he was right all along.

The only time he ever throws out his opinion is when it's too late. Like just now. "I would have drafted Aaron Rodgers over Derrick Johnson."

OH NO ****ING SHIT, YOU SAY? WOULD YOU ALSO HAVE GIVEN JOVAN BELCHER SOME CHILL PILLS? THANKS FOR YOUR OPINION, ASSHOLE.

I get what he is.
I don't give a rat's ass, because that is irrelevant.

The fact is that we did make the wrong choice.

[chiefzilla1501]

Given that Dorsey has made questionable calls both in free agency and the draft ... I'll repeat... I don't think the problem is Dorseys philosophy. I think he is drafting guys he thinks are bpa. The problem is, and it's a big one, I don't think he knows how to evaluate talent.

[milkman]

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

That is a different argument. I don't disagree that maybe he wasn't bpa.

I'm arguing against the weird view Cp has started to adopt that we shouldn't draft pass rushers just because we have them. Pass rushers are great first round picks. IF they are any good.

That weird view is is influenced by the player.

If this was Clowney or Mack, or hell even Attachu(sp), they'd see the field, and the questions wouldn't be raised.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by milkman

That weird view is is influenced by the player.

If this was Clowney or Mack, or hell even Attachu(sp), they'd see the field, and the questions wouldn't be raised.

That's bs. I know that's what you're saying and I don't disagree with how you put it although I disagree they have to be on the field right away. That's not what others are saying. Cp for some reason is starting to obsess over a conservative strategy of focusing on safe talent over high positional value talent. I want more money and first rounders used on high risk, high reward guys.

There are people here who would hate the pick even if Ford pans out, because he doesn't fill an immediate need.

[RealSNR]

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

That's bs. I know that's what you're saying and I don't disagree with how you put it although I disagree they have to be on the field right away. That's not what others are saying. Cp for some reason is starting to obsess over a conservative strategy of focusing on safe talent over high positional value talent. I want more money and first rounders used on high risk, high reward guys.

There are people here who would hate the pick even if Ford pans out, because he doesn't fill an immediate need.

Ford is the only example you have of that.

And no, do NOT say Eric Fisher. He doesn't count.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by SNR

Ford is the only example you have of that.

And no, do NOT say Eric Fisher. He doesn't count.

Paying 5 million for a bunch of average guards. Putting Gaines on the list even though he is a high risk high reward guy who was slotted correctly. And it's not so much bitching about Ford, it's bitching about not taking a player who fills an immediate need.

It's a good philosophy. Draft bpa, take high risk high reward guys, devalue safe players. Anyone disagree with that? If that's what the Chiefs are doing, it isn't the philosophy that's wrong. It's execution and talent evaluation. Frankly, that's even more concerning.

[RealSNR]

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

Paying 5 million for a bunch of average guards. Putting Gaines on the list even though he is a high risk high reward guy who was slotted correctly. And it's not so much bitching about Ford, it's bitching about not taking a player who fills an immediate need.

It's a good philosophy. Draft bpa, take high risk high reward guys, devalue safe players. Anyone disagree with that? If that's what the Chiefs are doing, it isn't the philosophy that's wrong. It's execution and talent evaluation. Frankly, that's even more concerning.

Schwartz didn't cost 5 million. The whole point of getting average guards is you can win with average guards. If your line is made up of stellar all-pro ****ing amazing guards, the difference it makes to your team matters far less than any other position. If you can acquire average guards for that price, it leaves room to draft real NFL players.

The bitching that people have about Dorsey and this draft (and the Gaines pick) is that he ignored ALL of the rich WR talent and brought in a player like Gaines, who was kind of iffy on his draft position where we took him. DAT is nice to have, sure, but he's not a ****ing WR. The Chiefs don't seem to plan on using him as one, and in any case, they weren't going to use him as one this year when we need the most help.

BPA is great if you either have nothing and are starting your NFL team as a full-on tear-down rebuild or your team is already so ****ing amazing and deep that you can get away with any potential mulligan at the pick. The Chiefs are middle of the road, trying to get better, and they took a bunch of players who don't help out in the short term. And they're not building for the future, either, because they have salary cap problems and old(ish) guys like DJ and Hali.

This goes back to the Chiefs trying to "win now" last year. It's ****ing idiocy to try to win now and then not build on your success. Instead, all we did is build our team up for one year and slowly let it collapse like a flan in a ****ing cupboard.

[milkman]

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

That's bs. I know that's what you're saying and I don't disagree with how you put it although I disagree they have to be on the field right away. That's not what others are saying. Cp for some reason is starting to obsess over a conservative strategy of focusing on safe talent over high positional value talent. I want more money and first rounders used on high risk, high reward guys.

There are people here who would hate the pick even if Ford pans out, because he doesn't fill an immediate need.

No it isn't.

I don't give a shit about philosophy as it relates to this debate.

A first round pick doesn't have to start right away.

But he damn well better be able to see the field and contribute from the very first game, barring injury.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by SNR

Schwartz didn't cost 5 million. The whole point of getting average guards is you can win with average guards. If your line is made up of stellar all-pro ****ing amazing guards, the difference it makes to your team matters far less than any other position. If you can acquire average guards for that price, it leaves room to draft real NFL players.

The bitching that people have about Dorsey and this draft (and the Gaines pick) is that he ignored ALL of the rich WR talent and brought in a player like Gaines, who was kind of iffy on his draft position where we took him. DAT is nice to have, sure, but he's not a ****ing WR. The Chiefs don't seem to plan on using him as one, and in any case, they weren't going to use him as one this year when we need the most help.

BPA is great if you either have nothing and are starting your NFL team as a full-on tear-down rebuild or your team is already so ****ing amazing and deep that you can get away with any potential mulligan at the pick. The Chiefs are middle of the road, trying to get better, and they took a bunch of players who don't help out in the short term. And they're not building for the future, either, because they have salary cap problems and old(ish) guys like DJ and Hali.

This goes back to the Chiefs trying to "win now" last year. It's ****ing idiocy to try to win now and then not build on your success. Instead, all we did is build our team up for one year and slowly let it collapse like a flan in a ****ing cupboard.

If Dorsey is a good gm, you can field a good enough oline using the late rounds of the draft and value picks. That's how Schneider did it. Dorsey has struggled to bring in one guy let alone several. Talent evaluation.

I get that it's a wide receiver rich draft. But there are people here who would take a 700 yard receiver today over a guy who can get 10+ sacks but not right away. I don't think Ford is a 10+ sack guy. I do think a lot of receivers we are bitching about are going to be career 2 receivers.

And bpa always matters. That's silly to ignore bpa just because your team can win now. We have drafted and signed players based on need for umpteen years. Do we not acknowledge that the Chiefs biggest problem isn't that we haven't been safe the last 20 years, it's that we continually pass on elite playmakers? If Ford ends up being a good OLb, it's a great pick. Period. Bitch about the talent evaluation. Right now, I'm worried too. But the philosophy of taking a pass rusher if he is truly bpa is a good one.

[Direckshun]

Originally Posted by SNR

OH NO ****ING SHIT, YOU SAY? WOULD YOU ALSO HAVE GIVEN JOVAN BELCHER SOME CHILL PILLS? THANKS FOR YOUR OPINION, ASSHOLE.

Oh god. It never gets old.

[RealSNR]

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

But the philosophy of taking a pass rusher if he is truly bpa is a good one.

That's not the argument. The argument you're trying to make is that the risky prospects with the potential to be great are better than the safe guys. The risky players aren't always BPA.

Like everything else in life, moderation is the answer.

[Hoover]

The only way that I would support the drafting of another pass rusher is if its a DE, and only if we are switching from a 3-4 to a 4-3 defense.

I don't know why some of you are so pessimistic about re-signing Houston, even if we do have franchise him. It's all business, and I have no doubts that the Chiefs will want to keep him for years to come. Hell, I think they would consider letting Berry walk before they let Houston walk.

[Mr. Laz]

Receiver
Free Safety
Cornerback

Damn, that sounds familiar.

[RealSNR]

Originally Posted by milkman

I get what he is.
I don't give a rat's ass, because that is irrelevant.

The fact is that we did make the wrong choice.

And the fact is that somebody should have given Jovan Belcher some chill pills.

Anything else you want to share with us?