How to Fix the OL

[Chiefnj2]

Assuming KC can't reach an agreement with Hudson, how do you (realistically) propose fixing the OL? The potential loss of Hudson is HUGE. People are preoccupied with Houston and WR right now, but without a drastic improvement in the OL this team is going nowhere fast. Personally, I have no idea what to think of KC's current starters/depth of Stephenson, Allen, Fulton and Kush. What's your best plan to try to make the OL respectable?

[jd1020]

Fixing OL + dumping the only NFL caliber player on OL = Chiefs.

[kccrow]

Originally Posted by Chiefnj2

FWIW, Daniel Jeremiah has Humphries as his top rated OT. I'm not sure he won't go in the first.

I have him as my 3rd rated behind Scherff and Flowers, but Humphries could end up being the cream of the crop. The problem with Humphries is the injury history. Double MCL sprain, high ankle sprain. Nothing "Earth shattering," but certainly will be brought up when teams make their boards. This is the only thing making me think he won't go 1st round, the injuries left far less tape then normal to make a decision off of. I'm purely putting him in the 2nd to early 3rd based off of just about everyone but myself and Jeremiah.

I'd consider him at 18 if I had the information the NFL has, but as of right now I have to watch and see if he starts sliding up boards elsewhere.

[Saccopoo]

Originally Posted by Chiefnj2

People seem to have a lot of faith in Kush, Allen and Stephenson.

People are ****ing stupid.

[Saccopoo]

Originally Posted by gonefishin53

Starting OL not a full start over as 4 of 5 have at least a year in Reid's system and Sherrod is experienced in WCO. Starters have good size, length, and athleticism.
Eric Fisher 6'7" about 325 lbs gets bigger and stronger with off-season work, good athlete for his size
LDT 6'5" about 330 lbs really smart, hard worker prepared to make an impact in his second year, very good athlete for his size
Eric Kush 6'4" about 320 lbs had a good camp in 2014, except for fixable long snap issues, very good athlete for center
Derek Sherrod 6'5" about 325 lbs kicks inside after tackle didn't work out in GB, better athlete than Fulton
Don Shephenson 6'6" about 315 lbs spends some off-season time with a sports psychologist, gets head straight, very good athlete for his size

Hudson leaves for greener ($8.5mil/yr) pastures. Jeff Allen for tackle depth, Zach Fulton for guard depth, sign Mike Pollak (3 yrs @ $1.5 mil/yr) for C/G depth, draft Donovan Smith in 3rd round in case Stephenson can't figure it out.

Kush and LDT are ****ing myths. If Kush was any good, he'd have been at LG instead of McGlynn and Linkenbach - both of whom were the worst OG's in the entire NFL. And don't tell me that they were holding him back for emergency center duties. That's ****ing bullshit. They aren't going to keep putting out McGlynn and Linkenbach who were getting Smith killed on a one to one snap basis all season long if you've got a guy who can contribute at a higher level. And as I said in another thread, Kush wasn't just a center. He played LT in college as well. That's got to translate to LG. The ****ing guy sucks.

LDT will have a longer transition to the pro game than Fisher has had. You want to put that ****ing guy out there against NFL defensive tackles? Jesus H. Stop Dancing Christ. Well, the bonus is, once he gets Smith decapitated, at least he can offer up medical services.

Stephenson should go train with Halfthor Bjornsson. No strength. Hell, Halfthor is 6'10" and can lift this crazy shit:



I mean, the guy is a freak athletically (what kind of 6'6" dude that weighs 320 lb. has a 36" vertical? The guy ran a 4.93 40 at that size. sick.), but he's got no functional strength for the NFL level. Personally, I think that they should have left Stephenson at LT and Fisher at RT. Both showed quality outings at the end of the 2013 season at those positions and looked like they were jelling...eh.

The real hope for this line is that Derek Sherrod gets his head straightened out. I think he's been hearing that leg crack for the last three years. Dude has all the talent in the world and kicked ass at the college level in the SEC against some all-world pass rushers. There is no reason why he shouldn't be better than what he's showed other than the mental side.

I'm not shitting you - losing Hudson is going to cripple this line. It sucks.

[Saccopoo]

Originally Posted by kccrow

I have him as my 3rd rated behind Scherff and Flowers, but Humphries could end up being the cream of the crop. The problem with Humphries is the injury history. Double MCL sprain, high ankle sprain. Nothing "Earth shattering," but certainly will be brought up when teams make their boards. This is the only thing making me think he won't go 1st round, the injuries left far less tape then normal to make a decision off of. I'm purely putting him in the 2nd to early 3rd based off of just about everyone but myself and Jeremiah.

I'd consider him at 18 if I had the information the NFL has, but as of right now I have to watch and see if he starts sliding up boards elsewhere.

Flowers foot work is god awful. ****ing horrible. He'll never play tackle in the NFL. RG at best.

Humphries is broke. (MCL sprains, high ankle sprains.) He hasn't played a full season in college. NFL advisory board told him to go back to school.

Schreff is broke. (Two surgeries on his right leg already combined with average feet.) Pure guard.

[milkman]

Can anyone name a center, other than Kevin Mawae, who checked in at over about 6'3" tall that had a successful NFL career?

[Nightfyre]

6'4":
Alex Mack
Nick Mangold
Maurkice Pouncey
Eric Wood



Max Unger is 6'3"

[RunKC]

Originally Posted by Saccopoo

People are ****ing stupid.

I'm not high on Stephenson and Allen is meh, but I think Kush could be a solid C.

He looked good last preseason.

[Jakemall]

Originally Posted by Nightfyre

6'4":
Alex Mack
Nick Mangold
Maurkice Pouncey
Eric Wood



Max Unger is 6'3"

It's early to say he's been successful, but Daniel Kilgore with the 9ers looks to be solid. Good guard and shifted over to Center. Was out last year on IR. 6'3"

[Hoover]

Perhaps knowing the Hudson was going to be a FA, the FO wisely choose to keep Kush working at the center position. We all bitch about how Fisher has had to adapt, and I know than an interior lineman isn't the same as a left tackle, but it wouldn't surprise me at all if Dorsey has always had his eye on Kush in case the market for Hudson was too high.

[kccrow]

Originally Posted by Saccopoo

Flowers foot work is god awful. ****ing horrible. He'll never play tackle in the NFL. RG at best.

Humphries is broke. (MCL sprains, high ankle sprains.) He hasn't played a full season in college. NFL advisory board told him to go back to school.

Schreff is broke. (Two surgeries on his right leg already combined with average feet.) Pure guard.

Don't bullshit yourself Sac.

Flowers will absolutely play RT at a minimum in the NFL. I'm not sure he's quick enough to be a left tackle, but he's got the goods to play right tackle.

Humphries never had an injury that makes you really worry out loud, that is no tears, no surgeries. He's legitimately talented. NFL advisory board is consistently wrong. If Humphries is healthy, he's hands down the best left tackle prospect in this draft.

Let's not be stupid crazy on Scherff here Sac.

First off, he does not have bad feet. And if you want to scream about feet, then you certainly should not be talking about his footwork in the run game.

He has one bad habit that is coach-able in pass protection. Scherff has a terribly bad habit of not taking a deep enough drop coupled with opening up too early while also not keeping a flat back. Now, you're going to say that's more than one thing. Sure, if you break them each out, but altogether it is part of a a consistent motion and bad habit by Scherff that he needs work on. He takes a power step, which is often too short, but then opens his hips too early allowing the rusher to gain outside leverage. At the same time, he has a slight lean to him, so he doesn't have his feet flat to redirect what is going on. As a whole it makes his kick slide, set up, and block against speed on the edge less favorable than it should or could be. He's not incapable, he's just going to need to work on staying square longer and flatening out. Now, one concern I have is whether or not he is quick enough in his drop to stay on the left side. Also, I have concerns about his arm length to man the outside although it could be adequate.

Aside from his feet, Scherff has an unquestionably deep understanding of his hand technique. He is flawless in one-hand technique and riding defenders around the arc with his power hand. I love to see that he can lengthen his reach with this technique. He has a quick punch and sets well. He's also the best player in this draft at picking up blocks on the move and getting quality blocks at the second level. He doesn't just block, he takes your lunch pail, he rams it up your ass, then he pile drives your face into the dirt.

That said though, he's the one player in this draft I wouldn't even hesitate to pick at #18 if he fell there. And when I did pick him there, I'd tell him you're my left guard, and your job is to be that big mean nasty son of bitch that I saw on tape destroying people and I want you to do that every damn play for the next 15 years. And why would I do that? Because this kid's skill set would allow him to be an All-Pro left guard. He's an A+ run blocker that can move, set with leverage, and drive. He's the best pass blocker in this class when he can initiate contact in a short area rather than step and wait.

I think he'd be an average tackle in the league because I just don't think he's quite quick enough to be a left tackle. He might be better as a right tackle because his functional blocking strength is incredibly good. It has nothing to do with foot coordination, it has to do with his quickness and opening the door to the QB too early. I wouldn't confuse that with "bad feet," because that simply isn't true. It's bad technique that really has nothing to do with his feet.

[Hoover]

Schreff is also one tough sob

[Saccopoo]

Flowers will not play tackle. His kick step is atrocious. He cannot transition against speed rushers to the outside. He is going to get destroyed. Personally, I don't think he ever sees the tackle position. (I am trying to find his combine film on the field drills. It was embarrassingly bad.)

Anyway, here's him highlighted in a game this season. Worst feet I've ever seen from a theoretical high level tackle prospect. I repeat, he will never see the edge at the next level.

[Saccopoo]

And I don't think Scherff has bad feet. He's average. As you stated, he's got good hands, but the rest of his package is average. He doesn't have the length, he doesn't have the quickness, he doesn't have the lateral agility. He's nasty and tenacious and gets after guys, but his skill set is average. His feet/footwork is short and choppy because he tries to set up his upper body strength against a defender versus riding them out. He has a hard time redirecting on speed outside rushers. I've seen a lot of Zach Martin comparisons, but he lacks the athleticism of Martin and the ability to change direction that Martin had.

He also has a tendency to stand up in his blocking. You watch his games and he's on his heels a lot trying to use his arms to engage versus driving up-field with his legs. He plays in a short radius. He doesn't play long.

He's a downhill, phone booth guard. With two leg surgeries. (Broken leg, dislocated ankle, torn meniscus and he popped his hammy at the combine. Sure, that sounds like a Dorsey pick to me, but he'll be playing LG exclusively.)

I'd rather have John Miller to be honest. However, the Dorsey Decision Lens matrix mandates a 6'5" guard, so I really wouldn't be surprised to see Scherff as the pick if he's available (and he might be as I don't think he's got the positional versatility of La'el Collins - who I really would like to see as a Chief versus any of the first round prospects that might be available at that time).

[kccrow]

Collins is just as much a guard only prospect as Scherff, if not moreso. I'm not interested in him as a tackle. I like him alot as a guard.

In fact, I only see 2 potential left tackles in this whole class and both are a bit of project: T.J. Clemmings and D.J. Humphries. I think teams looking for a LT are going to be grasping at straws trying to play guard and right tackle prospects out of position.

Even the right tackle types are few. I think that Flowers, Collins, Havenstein, Smith, Pete, Fisher, Ogbuehi, those are guys that have a legitimate shot at the right side.