HOF semifinalists

[Mile High Mania]

No, I'm not pimping the eligibility for anyone here. I know where you guys stand on a few.

My question is this? Kurt Warner - is he really HOF worthy? I believe he was a really good QB and I get what he did in STL and AZ, but HOF?

3 really good seasons in STL and 3 good seasons to end it in AZ.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap300...ter_news_pfhof

Here's the complete list of the 26 semifinalists:
Morten Andersen
Steve Atwater
Jerome Bettis
Tim Brown
Isaac Bruce
Don Coryell
Roger Craig
Terrell Davis
Tony Dungy
Kevin Greene
Charles Haley
Marvin Harrison
Torry Holt
Joe Jacoby
Edgerrin James
Jimmy Johnson
Mike Kenn
Ty Law
John Lynch
Kevin Mawae
Karl Mecklenburg
Orlando Pace
Junior Seau
Will Shields
Kurt Warner
Darren Woodson

[cosmo20002]

Originally Posted by KC2004

Kurt Warner

Career highlights and awards

Super Bowl champion (XXXIV)
Super Bowl MVP (XXXIV)
4× Pro Bowl (1999, 2000, 2001, 2008)
2× AP First-Team All-Pro (1999, 2001)
1999 NFL MVP (AP, PFWA, NEA, SN, MX)
2001 NFL MVP (AP, NEA)
2008 NFL MVP (NEA)
3× NFC Champion (1999, 2001, 2008)
Walter Payton Man of the Year (2008)
Bart Starr Man of the Year (2009)
At least 100 TD passes for two different teams (St. Louis Rams, Arizona Cardinals)
First QB to throw 3 TD passes in each of his first 3 games
Most yards passing in a playoff campaign (1,156 in 2008)
Holds top 3 passing records for Super Bowl games
2× First Team All-Arena (1996, 1997)
Iowa Barnstormers Hall of Fame
Arena Football Hall of Fame (2011)
Arizona Cardinals Ring of Honor (2014)
GFC Player of the Year (1993)

[Gadzooks]

Originally Posted by Dayze

Kevin Greene should've been in long long ago

He sure has the numbers but when he was in Pittsburgh he was a bit of a dick bag. He was involved in the "rap" before the AFC Championship Game in '94. What an "embarrassment".
IMO - if he played for the same team for the majority of his career, he'd be in.

[Dayze]

Agreed.

[Baby Lee]

Originally Posted by Mile High Mania

Yeah, there's a lot of good ones on the list.

I just look at Warner as a guy that had 6 really good years, with 5 years of nothing really in between. Nice guy, great story, has really elevated his legend since retirement. I guess that's the name of the game now.

1. The 'really good years' are more than really good, they might be ~6 of the best QB years ever.

2. The 'nothing in between' is NYG's fault, not his.

3. He not only led two different teams to SBs, but was the major propelling force in each instance. Say 'Rams,' say 'Cardinals,' say 'apex of franchise.' Each response is Kurt Warner.

[Discuss Thrower]

Coryell Warner Shields Would be my three

[kccrow]

I'll bold the guys I think deserve to make it, at least at some point...

Stats may not be spot on, going off best sorts available... then add my eyeball test....

Morten Andersen - All time scoring leader. All time FG leader. Not the best kicker of all time, but he played all those years because he was pretty damned good.
Steve Atwater - top 25 in tackles, 24 ints to boot. In the top 15 FS of all-time.
Jerome Bettis - 6th all time rushing yards
Tim Brown - 6th all time receiving yards
Isaac Bruce - 4th all time receiving yards
Don Coryell - Inventor of one of the most prolific NFL offenses of all time, absolutely.
Roger Craig - not enough yards in my opinion, a good solid back, not HOF material
Terrell Davis - too short a career, not enough yards, was great while here, but that isn't HOF material
Tony Dungy - A very good coach, but I'm not sure he's HOF material. He's 12th all time in W% but didn't crack the top 20 in Wins, nor 150 wins. He's bubble material as a coach.
Kevin Greene - 3rd all time sacks
Charles Haley - really torn about this one, maybe
Marvin Harrison - 7th all time receiving yards
Torry Holt - 12th all time receiving yards
Joe Jacoby - One of the better LTs of his era, but wasn't on the level of Roaf, Pace, Matthews, etc. A great story as a UDFA that became legend in Washington. I'm on the fence but I'm thinking he gets in at some point.
Edgerrin James - 11th all time rushing yards
Jimmy Johnson - Johnson was a great coach, that won at every level. He orchestrated a great turn around in Dallas, and should be lauded for it. However, he doesn't have the wins, the win%, nor the longevity that makes me want to say he should be in the HOF.
Mike Kenn - Longevity, hell of a player. Close to the level of a Willie Roaf.
Ty Law - 24th all time in Ints
John Lynch - 24th all time in tackles, 26 career Ints, one of the best SS ever.
Kevin Mawae - It takes a hell of a center for me to say he's HOF worthy, and while Mawae probably ranks in the top 15 all-time at this point, I'm reluctant. I'm saying no.
Karl Mecklenburg - 13th all time in sacks by a linebacker, reportedly over 1100 tackles based on PFR stats, which would put him top 20 all time.
Orlando Pace - Yep.
Junior Seau - 10th all time in tackles, great all around linebacker
Will Shields - One of the best guards in the history of the game. Longevity, and in the top ten all time at the position for All-Pro nods.
Kurt Warner - didn't do enough long enough. A couple nice spurts in STL and ARZ, but too little, too late. No.
Darren Woodson - Probably a step below Lynch... A very good safety, but I'm barely putting Lynch in. No.

[Baby Lee]

We get it, crow. You're giving your picks for the NFL Hall of Sticking Around.

[Pepe Silvia]

Originally Posted by Dayze

Kevin Greene should've been in long long ago

He used to piss in a towel on the sidelines almost every game, .

[cdcox]

My HOF Class, in order:

Don Coryell
Kevin Greene
Junior Seau
Ty Law
Marvin Harrison
Will Shields


Ranked by position.

OL
Will Shields 12 pro bowls; 2x all pro
Orlando Pace 7 pro bowls; 3x all pro
Kevin Mawae 8 pro bowls; 3x all pro
Joe Jacoby 4 pro bowls; 2x all pro
Mike Kenn 5 pro bowls; 2x all pro

WR
Marvin Harrison 14000 yds; 6 Seasons > 80 yards per game; 8 pro bowls; 3 times all pro
Torry Holt 13000 yds; 6 Seasons > 80 yards per game; 7 pro bowls; 1 time all pro
Tim Brown 14000 yds; 4 Seasons > 80 yards per game; 8 pro bowls; never all pro
Isaac Bruce 15000 yds; 5 Seasons > 80 yards per game; 4 pro bowls; never all pro

RB None of these guys belong
Jerome Bettis
Terrell Davis
Edgerrin James
Roger Craig

QB
Kurt Warner


Pass Rushers
Kevin Greene 160 sacks; 8 seasons with 12 or more sacks; 23 forced fumbles; 5 pro bowls; 2x all pro
Charles Haley 100.5 sacks; 3 seasons with 12 or more sacks; 26 forced fumbles; 5 pro bowls; 2x all pro

Conventional LB
Junior Seau 12 pro bowls; 6 times all pro; 56 sacks; 18 interceptions; 1500 tackles
Karl Mecklenburg 6 pro bowls; 3 times all pro; 79 sacks; 16 interceptions; 1100 tackles

DB
Ty Law 5 pro bowls; 2x all pro; 53 INTs
Steve Atwater 8 pro bowls; 3x all pro; 24 INTs
John Lynch 9 pro bowls; 2x all pro; 26 INTs
Darren Woodson 5 pro bowls; 3x all pro; 23 INTs


Other Players
Morten Andersen


Non-players
Don Coryell
Jimmy Johnson
Tony Dungy

[Rain Man]

Originally Posted by Rams Fan

Warner and Pace should be in immediately, as should Bruce. But if Bruce doesn't make it due to the the logjam with WRs, I'd be fine with him making it in a few years.

I like Holt, but I don't think he is HoF caliber.

How would you differentiate between Holt and Bruce?

When they were playing, I have a vague memory of assuming that Bruce was the #1 receiver and Holt was the #2 deep threat. But at some point I flipped and decided that Holt was the #1. However, I don't think I can really differentiate between them.

[Fat Elvis]

Coryell
Warner
Pace
Seau

[kccrow]

Originally Posted by Baby Lee

We get it, crow. You're giving your picks for the NFL Hall of Sticking Around.

lol... not necessarily, but continued excellence is a criteria in my book.

My class would be:

LB Kevin Greene
... 3rd All-Time in Sacks, I mean what more is there to say? He's one of the fiercest linebackers of all-time. He was consistently outstanding (more years of 12+ sacks than LT)
CB Ty Law
... 53 Interceptions is nothing to sneeze at, and its as many as Deion Sanders had in his career. Law was a much better tacker and just as much a shut down corner.
WR Marvin Harrison
... May not be as high on the list as a couple others in yards, but his per game averages are better. Harrison was incredibly talented.
OG Will Shields
... The best offensive lineman of his era without question. The consummate pro and one of the most well-rounded guard I've watched in my lifetime. The only guards I've ever seen on a similar level are Randall McDaniel and Alan Faneca.
LB Junior Seau
... Probably the single most complete linebacker I've ever seen, could truly do it all and did it for a very long time at the highest level. Playing in a 3-4 that normally doesn't inflate LB stats in the same way as a 4-3, he still is amongst the tops ever.

[cdcox]

Identical to mine except I added Coryell.

Originally Posted by kccrow

lol... not necessarily, but continued excellence is a criteria in my book.

My class would be:

LB Kevin Greene
... 3rd All-Time in Sacks, I mean what more is there to say? He's one of the fiercest linebackers of all-time. He was consistently outstanding (more years of 12+ sacks than LT)
CB Ty Law
... 53 Interceptions is nothing to sneeze at, and its as many as Deion Sanders had in his career. Law was a much better tacker and just as much a shut down corner.
WR Marvin Harrison
... May not be as high on the list as a couple others in yards, but his per game averages are better. Harrison was incredibly talented.
OG Will Shields
... The best offensive lineman of his era without question. The consummate pro and one of the most well-rounded guard I've watched in my lifetime. The only guards I've ever seen on a similar level are Randall McDaniel and Alan Faneca.
LB Junior Seau
... Probably the single most complete linebacker I've ever seen, could truly do it all and did it for a very long time at the highest level. Playing in a 3-4 that normally doesn't inflate LB stats in the same way as a 4-3, he still is amongst the tops ever.

[Gadzooks]

Originally Posted by kccrow

LB Junior Seau
... Probably the single most complete linebacker I've ever seen, could truly do it all and did it for a very long time at the highest level. Playing in a 3-4 that normally doesn't inflate LB stats in the same way as a 4-3, he still is amongst the tops ever.

Seau played primarily in a 4-3 as an OLB in his prime. The rest is true though.

[Discuss Thrower]

*Tinfoil Hat*


The NFL will try and dissuade voters from choosing Seau to try and distance his passing from the current CTE and painkiller controversy.