Chiefs Put Dorsey's Head On The Chopping Block - Page 14

Direckshun · 09-09-2014, 11:02 AM

It is very, very early in John Dorsey's tenure here, but unless the talent he's acquired magically turns it around by midpoint of the season, I believe we should be shopping for a new GM by the end of the season.

Now, this is a big deal (I would like to think), coming from me. I was among the last defenders on this site of Scott Pioli, and I still think his drafting record here was strong. I believe in the process, in giving GMs extreme leeway and time in shuffling the roster and building a team full of the kind of guys we want.

But Dorsey came in with a plum opportunity. He had the core of a team already built for him (minus the one critical position), the #1 pick in the draft, and a ridiculous amount of free agency cap room to spend, spend, spend.

With these incredible gifts given to him, gifts that any new GM would kill for (rather than the shit sandwich a new GM would get in 2015...), Dorsey took the absolute worst path.

He sacrificed the future of the franchise for a quick playoff run, completely overpaying in offseason talent, hamstringing our budget for 2014 and 2015 so that we let a full quarter of our team's starters walk, including two Pro Bowlers, with zero ability to replace any of the departing talent effectively (with the sole exception of replacing Kendrick Lewis with Husain Abdullah, but even that was a Plan B after Mr. Glass Commings is out for another year).

We were unable to retain Brandon Albert, Brandon Flowers, Ryan Succop, Tyson Jackson, Dexter McCulster, Jon Asamoah and Geoff Schwartz because we had to have Mike DeVito, Chase Daniel, Dunta Robinson, Sean Smith, Donnie Avery, and Anthony Fasano. That is a complete loss on every level, and again, it happened because Dorsey acted like a teenager after receiving his first paycheck rather than the patient, methodical personnel guru he was alleged to be.

The Alex Smith trade was defensible on its own terms, I believe. (We overpayed with the two 2nds, but we overpayed for Bowe and Colquitt, and both of those were defensible as well, as the team was seriously ****ed without the player in question.) But coupled with the Chase Daniel acquisition and this team's continued chickenshit behavior regarding the QB position in the draft, and it once again showed a complete lack of understanding of what it takes to win in a league being skewed further and further away from the Alex Smiths and Matt Cassels of the world. In a league that's continually changing, Dorsey, Reid and Alex Smith are keeping the team stagnant.

Well, less than stagnant, really. The biggest crime of the young John Dorsey era has been the drafting, which has been horrific. It's every bit as obsessed with 40 times and measurables and ignorant of on field performance as the Al Davis regime used to be. We burned the #1 overall pick on a likely bust at tackle. We burned our first this year on a passrusher that isn't helping us win. We burned our third this year on a corner that was worse than Vince Agnew this preseason. And none of our low-round picks are working out, up to and including our UDFAs, where GMs need to distinguish themselves. It's insane to think that Scott Pioli had a better record with UDFAs, which is saying something considering that Pioli only hit on one his entire time here.

I do a ton of mock drafts throughout the year, most of them terrible, but all of them viscerally enjoyable for me to postulate. It's lost a lot of its luster this year, even as we are entering a year with 11 draft picks, because projecting the projects and boom/likely-bust players that Dorsey falls in love with makes the exercise depressing. We end up with a super-young team full of talent that can't see the field, and likely rarely ever will.

I'm willing to change my tune, as I always am, if some of this plan looks to be solid for the future, and not just for the present, by the middle of the season. But it would have to be a dramatic shift for me to feel that way.

That said, we can still end up in a good position here. The Alex Smith contract, which ironically is the best contract Dorsey has signed here, makes Smith expendable if a new GM is brought in at the end of the year. If Andy Reid still wants Alex Smith after a 4-12 season, fire him too. If Andy Reid can't get along with the new GM, fire him. If Andy Reid can't call a winning gameplan in 2015, fire him.

This front office refused to utilize their patience when constructing this roster. In the process, they've lost mine.

**New World Order** · 09-09-2014, 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coochie liquor

And then when other teams draft BPA they're "so smart to stay with their board" people here constantly talk out both sides of their mouths.

Who is "they?"

And do you really believe Eric Fisher and Dee Ford were BPA?

If so, you need your head examined.

jd1020 · 09-09-2014, 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coochie liquor

Yeah cuz that's all he does.

I don't think we need Smith to teach someone how to hand the ball off to Charles.

OldSchool · 09-09-2014, 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

He has no idea what he's talking about.

The money isn't guaranteed but it is. The Chiefs would have to take a massive haircut to cut Smith next year which is why most reports are all but calling his 15m pay bump next year guaranteed.

$45 mil in dead money, or something around there. No FO is going to take that hit even if Smith's play magically takes a complete dumpster dive, they would keep him in place in hopes that the season was an aberration given his recent track record. He has at least 2 seasons to prove he was worth it all.

O.city · 09-09-2014, 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by New World Order

Who is "they?"

And do you really believe Eric Fisher and Dee Ford were BPA?

If so, you need your head examined.

Intelligent people that aren't you?

**dirk digler** · 09-09-2014, 08:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jd1020

Leave it.

A lot of people seem to be dumb as shit when it comes to Alex's contract. The dude thinks the Chiefs can cut Smith June 1 and all of his guaranteed money that becomes fully guaranteed some time in March goes away.

Quote:

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

He has no idea what he's talking about.

The money isn't guaranteed but it is. The Chiefs would have to take a massive haircut to cut Smith next year which is why most reports are all but calling his 15m pay bump next year guaranteed.

I think he is right in the aspect that they could cut him prior to March 2015 but they aren't going to or I would be shocked if they did. I can't imagine they would unless they had the #1 pick and a sure fire franchise QB sitting there.

Here is OvertheCap analysis of the contract

Quote:

Today I Was able to confirm the full details of Alex Smith’s new $68 million contract extension with the Kansas City Chiefs. Smith, as reported in numerous places, will receive an $18 million signing bonus and $1 million base salary in 2014 which will reduce his cap charge from $8 million to $4.6 million.

In 2015 Smith has an $11.9 million salary that is fully guaranteed for injury and in 2016 he has a $14.1 million salary that is also fully guaranteed for injury. Both salaries become fully guaranteed is he is on the Chiefs roster on the 3rd day of the 2015 League Year. I would consider that a virtual certainty.

In 2017 and 2018 he has non-guaranteed salaries of $10.8 and $14.5 million as well as roster bonuses of $2 million in each season and $500,000 in workout bonuses.

jd1020 · 09-09-2014, 08:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dirk digler

I think he is right in the aspect that they could cut him prior to March 2015 but they aren't going to or I would be shocked if they did. I can't imagine they would unless they had the #1 pick and a sure fire franchise QB sitting there.

Here is OvertheCap analysis of the contract

He said they could cut him June 1st...

They can cut him prior to the 3rd day of the league year and only eat $14.4M next year in dead money. But, I can only see 1 scenario of that happening and thats with the Chiefs having the #1 pick and taking Mariota. But even then, given that this team fears QBs as much as Berry fears the pregame show, I still don't know if they cut him.

O.city · 09-09-2014, 08:27 PM

IF they end up with the 1st overall pick, you've got to move on from him no matter what.

**New World Order** · 09-09-2014, 08:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city

Drafting for needs early, ends you up with pukes like Tyson Jackson and Jonathan Baldwin.

The philosophy behind his draft picks are solid, the players at this point, are not.

There must be a balance there. If the next best draft pick is expected to be selected 25 picks from now you obviously move to your next position of need.

We could of addressed the WR position with Marquise Lee, even though he was selected early second round. If I remember correctly, Dee Ford was also a reach, was he not?

**New World Order** · 09-09-2014, 08:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city

Intelligent people that aren't you?

I predicted this meltdown, while you and the rest of the homers believed we were moving in the right direction.

O.city · 09-09-2014, 08:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by New World Order

There must be a balance there. If the next best draft pick is expected to be taken 25 picks from now you obviously move to your next position of need.

We could of addressed the WR position with Marquise Lee, even though he was selected early second round. If I remember correctly, Dee Ford was also a reach was he not?

I don't have access to the board they have created. A reach to one club, is a great pick to another I guess.

Ford was probably a bit of a reach, but if he's your guy, take him.

O.city · 09-09-2014, 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by New World Order

I predicted this meltdown while you and the rest of the homers believed we were moving in the right direction.

I do think they're moving in the right direction now, but it's going to require a shit year.

ILChief · 09-09-2014, 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city

IF they end up with the 1st overall pick, you've got to move on from him no matter what.

This. Smith is ok but if you can get a Mariotta, you do it

**New World Order** · 09-09-2014, 08:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city

I do think they're moving in the right direction now, but it's going to require a shit year.

Honestly, what has Dorsey done that leads to you to believe he could be a capable gm?

Building for the future while signing backup players to ludicrous contracts?

Signing a 30 year old quarterback to a long-term deal while he tries to rebuild the roster?

What?

O.city · 09-09-2014, 08:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ILChief

This. Smith is ok but if you can get a Mariotta, you do it

In all of his time as a coach, I can't see any way Reid and Dorsey think Smith is anything more than he is.

I've been wrong before though. So probably.

jd1020 · 09-09-2014, 08:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city

I do think they're moving in the right direction now, but it's going to require a shit year.

You have a scary definition of "right direction."

09-09-2014, 11:02 AM
Direckshun __ Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Springpatch Casino cash: $4093447	Put Dorsey's Head On The Chopping Block It is very, very early in John Dorsey's tenure here, but unless the talent he's acquired magically turns it around by midpoint of the season, I believe we should be shopping for a new GM by the end of the season. Now, this is a big deal (I would like to think), coming from me. I was among the last defenders on this site of Scott Pioli, and I still think his drafting record here was strong. I believe in the process, in giving GMs extreme leeway and time in shuffling the roster and building a team full of the kind of guys we want. But Dorsey came in with a plum opportunity. He had the core of a team already built for him (minus the one critical position), the #1 pick in the draft, and a ridiculous amount of free agency cap room to spend, spend, spend. With these incredible gifts given to him, gifts that any new GM would kill for (rather than the shit sandwich a new GM would get in 2015...), Dorsey took the absolute worst path. He sacrificed the future of the franchise for a quick playoff run, completely overpaying in offseason talent, hamstringing our budget for 2014 and 2015 so that we let a full quarter of our team's starters walk, including two Pro Bowlers, with zero ability to replace any of the departing talent effectively (with the sole exception of replacing Kendrick Lewis with Husain Abdullah, but even that was a Plan B after Mr. Glass Commings is out for another year). We were unable to retain Brandon Albert, Brandon Flowers, Ryan Succop, Tyson Jackson, Dexter McCulster, Jon Asamoah and Geoff Schwartz because we had to have Mike DeVito, Chase Daniel, Dunta Robinson, Sean Smith, Donnie Avery, and Anthony Fasano. That is a complete loss on every level, and again, it happened because Dorsey acted like a teenager after receiving his first paycheck rather than the patient, methodical personnel guru he was alleged to be. The Alex Smith trade was defensible on its own terms, I believe. (We overpayed with the two 2nds, but we overpayed for Bowe and Colquitt, and both of those were defensible as well, as the team was seriously ****ed without the player in question.) But coupled with the Chase Daniel acquisition and this team's continued chickenshit behavior regarding the QB position in the draft, and it once again showed a complete lack of understanding of what it takes to win in a league being skewed further and further away from the Alex Smiths and Matt Cassels of the world. In a league that's continually changing, Dorsey, Reid and Alex Smith are keeping the team stagnant. Well, less than stagnant, really. The biggest crime of the young John Dorsey era has been the drafting, which has been horrific. It's every bit as obsessed with 40 times and measurables and ignorant of on field performance as the Al Davis regime used to be. We burned the #1 overall pick on a likely bust at tackle. We burned our first this year on a passrusher that isn't helping us win. We burned our third this year on a corner that was worse than Vince Agnew this preseason. And none of our low-round picks are working out, up to and including our UDFAs, where GMs need to distinguish themselves. It's insane to think that Scott Pioli had a better record with UDFAs, which is saying something considering that Pioli only hit on one his entire time here. I do a ton of mock drafts throughout the year, most of them terrible, but all of them viscerally enjoyable for me to postulate. It's lost a lot of its luster this year, even as we are entering a year with 11 draft picks, because projecting the projects and boom/likely-bust players that Dorsey falls in love with makes the exercise depressing. We end up with a super-young team full of talent that can't see the field, and likely rarely ever will. I'm willing to change my tune, as I always am, if some of this plan looks to be solid for the future, and not just for the present, by the middle of the season. But it would have to be a dramatic shift for me to feel that way. That said, we can still end up in a good position here. The Alex Smith contract, which ironically is the best contract Dorsey has signed here, makes Smith expendable if a new GM is brought in at the end of the year. If Andy Reid still wants Alex Smith after a 4-12 season, fire him too. If Andy Reid can't get along with the new GM, fire him. If Andy Reid can't call a winning gameplan in 2015, fire him. This front office refused to utilize their patience when constructing this roster. In the process, they've lost mine.
Posts: 59,327

09-09-2014, 08:27 PM	#202
O.city In Search of a Life Join Date: Jul 2009 Casino cash: $2294064	IF they end up with the 1st overall pick, you've got to move on from him no matter what.
Posts: 81,579