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Old 01-29-2019, 08:28 PM  
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Democrats pushing state by state for third trimester abortions


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Old 01-30-2019, 10:14 AM   #31
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Good I hope this gets sent to the SC with Ruth MIA.....

Shit should be illegal, period
Wait, under these laws, can't we abort RBG and get a no-call out of it? She's no longer wanted, needed, and is just a big 'ol problem child...
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Old 01-30-2019, 10:16 AM   #32
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I’m going to be sick.
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Old 01-30-2019, 10:18 AM   #33
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Old 01-30-2019, 10:32 AM   #34
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Jesus - look at the bill summary for this thing. It's even worse than the testimony. I figured there'd be a few safeguards put in place for the mental health thing but not only does it actively REMOVE those, it goes on to essentially de-regulate abortion providers who are providing first trimester abortions and allows for in-home abortions through the second term. Women's health, indeed...

http://lis.virginia.gov/cgi-bin/legp...191+sum+HB2491

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Abortion; eliminate certain requirements. Eliminates the requirement that an abortion in the second trimester of pregnancy and prior to the third trimester be performed in a hospital. The bill eliminates all the procedures and processes, including the performance of an ultrasound, required to effect a woman's informed written consent to the performance of an abortion; however, the bill does not change the requirement that a woman's informed written consent be first obtained. The bill eliminates the requirement that two other physicians certify that a third trimester abortion is necessary to prevent the woman's death or impairment of her mental or physical health, as well as the need to find that any such impairment to the woman's health would be substantial and irremediable. The bill also removes language classifying facilities that perform five or more first-trimester abortions per month as hospitals for the purpose of complying with regulations establishing minimum standards for hospitals.
Eliminates need for 3 physicians to state that there will be emotional/physical damage. Eliminates the need for that damage to even be substantial. Eliminates the need for abortions before the third trimester to be in a hospital and effectively subjects abortion providers to no genuine healthcare oversight. For all the hemming and hawing about back-alley abortions being the norm if Republicans had their way, this law LITERALLY paves the way to legalizing them so long as they're in the first trimester.

This thing really does allow for murder and in so doing creates an express lane for it. There will absolutely be a cottage industry of 'go to physicians' who will say that the stress of having to raise a child will create a mental health problem for the woman and thus the child can be aborted. Again, without that 'substantial' element in place, it can really be as little as strain over having to pay for childcare. You want to see the shifting baseline that the staunch right to life folks talk about? This would be it, clear as day.

I've always taken the same stance on abortion - it's a state issue to me. I have no theological dog in this fight and from a pragmatic standpoint I see the economic benefits (and frankly, the political ones - liberals will just be killing their own). But this goddamn bill is ghoulish, man. I mean this law would truly allow for 100% viable children who are more fully formed and viable than my twins were when they were delivered (and who were strong enough to go home the next day, mind you) to be flat out killed.

That's horrifying. And the matter of fact way that it was presented was even moreso.
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Old 01-30-2019, 10:37 AM   #35
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Originally Posted by BleedingRed View Post
Good I hope this gets sent to the SC with Ruth MIA.....

Shit should be illegal, period
I don't know that the SCOTUS would block it. I don't think they should. This should be decided by the people at the state level, just like murder laws are.
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Old 01-30-2019, 10:42 AM   #36
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Oh, and before this is passed off as just "some wingnut in the VA legislature..." that thing has 21 co-sponsors in a 48 member House Democratic caucus.

Folks - that effectively represents the Virginia Democratic Party's abortion platform. If you gave the House Democrats the keys in VA, that would be the law. And if you look at VA's electoral map, that's virtually entirely beltway region delegates with a handful in Norfolk and Richmond. Their House currently has 51 Rs. That's a eyelash away from being actual settled law in Virginia - y'know, the area immediately adjacent to our Federal Government.

I really am taken aback by this one. I always kinda figured the worst case aspersions cast at most abortion rights activists were largely overblown (as is generally the case in the political arena) but **** man, there's absolutely nothing you can say about this law that isn't completely in lock-step with the most dire 'abortion on demand' predictions preached by the right to life crowd.

It really is just horrific.
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Old 01-30-2019, 10:44 AM   #37
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I don't know that the SCOTUS would block it. I don't think they should. This should be decided by the people at the state level, just like murder laws are.
The SCOTUS can't. There are no valid Constitutional grounds to do so, certainly not without a Personhood Amendment. And the odds of that getting through are only slightly less long than the odds of getting the 2nd Amendment repealed.

Virginia absolutely CAN do this. And it's a horrifying testament to the state of the abortion sect that they may actually want to.
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Old 01-30-2019, 10:45 AM   #38
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Originally Posted by DJ's left nut View Post
Oh, and before this is passed off as just "some wingnut in the VA legislature..." that thing has 21 co-sponsors in a 48 member House Democratic caucus.

Folks - that effectively represents the Virginia Democratic Party's abortion platform. If you gave the House Democrats the keys in VA, that would be the law. And if you look at VA's electoral map, that's virtually entirely beltway region delegates with a handful in Norfolk and Richmond. Their House currently has 51 Rs. That's a eyelash away from being actual settled law in Virginia - y'know, the area immediately adjacent to our Federal Government.

I really am taken aback by this one. I always kinda figured the worst case aspersions cast at most abortion rights activists were largely overblown (as is generally the case in the political arena) but **** man, there's absolutely nothing you can say about this law that isn't completely in lock-step with the most dire 'abortion on demand' predictions preached by the right to life crowd.

It really is just horrific.
This Tram person is reping Fairfax and is NOVA trash. She's not even from America, has 4 kids, and had to delete her twitter account over it.
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Old 01-30-2019, 10:48 AM   #39
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Originally Posted by DJ's left nut View Post
The SCOTUS can't. There are no valid Constitutional grounds to do so, certainly not without a Personhood Amendment. And the odds of that getting through are only slightly less long than the odds of getting the 2nd Amendment repealed.

Virginia absolutely CAN do this. And it's a horrifying testament to the state of the abortion sect that they may actually want to.
It wouldn't be the first time the SCOTUS stepped outside the bounds of the constitution, but I agree that it would be a betrayal of conservatives who are looking for a non-activist, constitution-respecting court.
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Old 01-30-2019, 10:48 AM   #40
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How long before the first doctor is fired for refusing to abort a ****ing baby a minute before it's about to be born?

Jesus Christ....you're at the point of birth. Give birth and then give it up for adoption. Your body is already ****ed.....but nope....let's kill a baby who could have a life because of your "mental or physical health".
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Old 01-30-2019, 11:01 AM   #41
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Originally Posted by patteeu View Post
I don't know that the SCOTUS would block it. I don't think they should. This should be decided by the people at the state level, just like murder laws are.
Do you think the majority of the state approve, or legislators took it upon themselves?

You know, like Congress giving themselves raises, when they work for the people.
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Old 01-30-2019, 11:05 AM   #42
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How long before the first doctor is fired for refusing to abort a ****ing baby a minute before it's about to be born?

Jesus Christ....you're at the point of birth. Give birth and then give it up for adoption. Your body is already ****ed.....but nope....let's kill a baby who could have a life because of your "mental or physical health".
"I will be mentally torn over the fact that I gave up the child for adoption..."

Based on the restrictions removed in this law there would literally be no way to prevent an abortion at any time prior to the child actually crowning. The reason the crowning would be a termination point is that partial birth abortions are still federally prohibited so once they crown, game over.

But prior to that, even if the grounds are clearly pretextual, there will absolutely be go-to physicians that will be all to willing to determine them sufficient.

It's truly awful.
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Old 01-30-2019, 11:07 AM   #43
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This Tram person is reping Fairfax and is NOVA trash. She's not even from America, has 4 kids, and had to delete her twitter account over it.
And the 20 other co-sponsors on that bill?

Tram may be the person taking the heat for this piece of shit, but 20 other Virginia Dems put their name on it.

Tram is the fresh meat that the Democratic caucus sent up there to get ripped on their trial balloon but they most assuredly threw this out there hoping it would get traction.
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Old 01-30-2019, 11:12 AM   #44
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Well lets hope some states outlaw abortion outright.
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Old 01-30-2019, 11:13 AM   #45
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"Women's reproductive rights".

**** Democrats.
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