Back to back final four appearances. What great desire this team has to redeem themselves after last season's bitter end.

I never said i hated Self, i simply said Roy is a better coach and has had more success.

Every year i hear KU fans claiming that they "don't miss Roy" and they we "upgraded w/Self". Granted Self did win us a natty (Roy would have won us one too) but Roy has 5 final 4's and two national championships to Self's 1 natty ans 2 final fours.

I like Bill, he is a great coach, but he underachieves pretty consistently in the tournament.

I know 13 straight, back to back elite 8's muh crap shoot blah blah blah

I ***think*** Roy would've won here but we can't know that. We do know Bill bagged it and for that I'm grateful (plus I was there). Still tho....this weekend sucked

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Wins at Madison Square Garden in March...<br><br>South Carolina: 2<br><br>Knicks: 1</p>&mdash; Scott Shapiro (@scottshapiro33) <a href="https://twitter.com/scottshapiro33/status/846151992883867648">March 27, 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Wow.



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Alright, I'll quit being a prick about it, but look guys, here are the stats.

Roy
Time: 15 years
Record: 418-101 (.805)
Conference Titles: 9
Final Fours: 4
Titles: 0

Bill
Time: 14 years
Record: 416-87 (.827)
Conference Titles: 13
Final Fours: 2
Titles: 1

BCJ: Your assertion that UNC was a promotion, suggests that the universities aren't the same, so looking at their time in Kansas, I fail to see how you can say Roy is the better coach. You must be looking at the tournament, because he doesn't have as good of overall record (and that dude schedules some CUPCAKES), or conference titles. But if all that matters is March, how can you put Roy over Bill when Bill won the whole thing. You're saying Roy is better, I don't see it. Yeah, 2 more Final Fours, but no rings, and there were several years, where he fielded not-so-good teams. Self is looked at as an underachiever, because his teams are so consistently ****ing awesome that in the years that he doesn't win the title, he can do nothing but underachieve. He's never in a position to overachieve and not underachieving means winning a title, which is hard to do.

I get that Roy has had more success at UNC, but I don't think you can use those statistics as a comparison, when his tenure at KU is far more comparable, and it leans toward Bill.

PB: you're bagging on Bill pretty hard in the KU thread, but if Roy DIDN'T win in 15 years, what makes you think he could have? I'm sure if Self was here 15 years and hadn't won it, you'd be crowing about how if a guy can't do it in 14 years he never will. Looking at their extremely comparable side-by-sides, I'll have Self.

But yeah, this weekend sucked, but I posted yesterday a bunch of teams that this loss probably sucked less than.

UNC was a promotion though

Could have been. Don't give a flying ****. Self is 3-0 head to head with Williams if I'm remembering correctly.

Aaaaaaand we can stop here.

Crapshoot! Sample size!

Eh, grass is always greener, and some of it depends on where you're at with CBB, I guess.... meaning, I'm personally done with the watered down NFL regular season and really only care about mid-late January when shit gets real. My alternative to watching the shit was to, well, stop watching it.

OTOH, I start watching CBB in November, but can understand why others don't for various reasons... the officiating, non-con games against UMKC, conference games against TCU and Texas Tech, the officiating. The officiating.

Unlike the NFL though, where a few teams are responsible for the vast majority of AFC Championship Game appearances over the past few years, Final Fours aren't exactly a consistent thing.

I personally wouldn't trade one more National Championship for an unwatchable NIT season... I guess if people are all about the tournament, they could trade KU tournaments for UNC or Duke tournaments, but of course that would be trading KU's 2nd weekend losses for Lehigh, Mercer, or not making the tourney at all, but a couple more Final Fours. Yay? :shrug:

I thought only titles mattered?? Guess that was the Big Watered Down variety.

As a neutral observer, I would say they are equal. I think Roy's biggest faults were not taking the 97 & 98 KU teams past the sweet 16.

That's a big part of it.

Roy was the better coach, but Self is the better recruiter.