*** Official 2018 Royals Offseason Repository ***
 

It's the end of the world as we know it... and we feel... fine?

2018 is a season of transition for the Royals, or at least it is at this point. Dayton Moore is back. Will he swing full into THE PROCESS 2.0? Or will he try to load up again and make some reload magic happen?

Pending Free Agents:
1B | Eric Hosmer | San Diego Padres, 8 years, $144 million ($5 million signing bonus; $20 million/year in Yrs 1-5; $13 million/year in Yrs 6-8 wth player opt out)

3B | Mike Moustaskas | Kansas City Royas, 1, $6.5 million

CF | Lorenzo Cain | Milwaukee Brewers, 5 years, $80 million

RP | Mike Minor | Texas Rangers, 3, $28 million

SP | Jason Vargas | New York Mets, 2, $16 million

SS | Alcides Escobar | Kansas City Royals, 1, $2.5 million


2018 MLB Draft Picks
#18
#33 - Compensation (Eric Hosmer)
#34 - Compensation (Lorenzo Cain)
#40 (Competitive Balance Round A)

Comp picks explanation:


2018 Draft Names to Watch

RHP Kumar Rocker, N Oconnee HS, Georgia.

OF Jarred Kelenic, Waukasha West HS, WI

1B Triston Casas, American Heritage HS (FL).

RHP Carter Stewart, Eau de Gallie HS (Ga).

ANY Any, Any (Any). Any current top projected pick who slides for injury concerns. Includes current top prospect prospect SP Brady Singer, U of Florida.

Winning!

Be prepared for consecutive 100 loss seasons.

Glass blew it. He should have allowed Moore to leave, thus bringing in an entirely new front office.

:shake:

Already claiming 100 loss seasons without even know a large portion of the roster for next year?


That's pretty ****ing stupid, Billay.

I'm going to disagree with you on that one. At this point, retaining the GM who built it once already, and who convinced Glass to act like a big boy owner... is safer than the unknown. Moore isn't perfect, but there's no guarantee the concessions he has WR in out of Glass and company stay if he does not.

I also don't see 100-loss bad unless they unload Perez and Duffy and etc over this offseason.

It's not a good team or a team that doesn't need some amazing luck to be a playoff contender, but it isn't 2005, 2006, 2007 level bad, either.

Already got a dipshit in here

Good luck, fans.

Meet me at the end of the 2018 when the Royals have lost close to 100 games.

The TV contact isn’t going to be a “savior”, either.

81/81 with “ superstars”.

Fans are weird.

Says one of the biggest Chiefs dipshits.

Team is hosed. At least they got a title. That team was amazing.

Because I don't blindly follow a team that's won 2 playoff games since I've been alive? At least the Royals have won a championship recently

:rolleyes:

That's what I thought

No faith in Moore in the draft. The rule changes in draft pick bonuses erased our only way to build team. Moore hasn't drafted anybody worth a damn outside of Merrifield and some relievers in a long time.

Let me know when Moore drafts a 1st rounder worth a shit or makes a trade that doesn’t involve a Cy Young winner that he *wins*.

Good luck.

The Royals *should* have been good for a long time.

Nope.

I hope the Royals lose for 1000 years.

You're being an epic dipshit.

81/81 with SuperStars? This team has never had Superstars and even with losing most of the offensive guys, the difference between losing 81 games and 100 is significantly different. Doesn't mean the Royals will be good, but calling 100 loses already is insanely reeruned.

Let me know when all the Chiefs "awesome" draft picks, player trades (Alex Smith!!!) and player development pays off. I can't wait!

Until then, 2015 beats 1969.


Might as well go enjoy being a loser Dodgers fan, as you clearly aren't a Royals fan. I am sure they loved their season.

I saw that Kumar Rocker was from Georgia and I wondered if he was John Rocker's kid or something, and then I googled him. The irony!

This is extreme hyperbole.

Good picks:
Mike Moustakas
Eric Hosmer
Sean Manaea
Brandon Finnegan
Mike Montgomery

Average pick:
Aaron Crow

Bad Picks:
Chris Colon
Bubba Starling

Unlucky pick:
Kyle Zimmer

As for trades, Moore ended making out incredibly well in the Myers trade, cashing in a top 5 prospect who hasn't quite lived up to expectations for pieces that led to two AL pennants and a World Series title.

He won the Sanchez/Guthrie trade rather handily.

He raped the Reds for Cueto.

They may 90 games or more, but sinking to 100-loss levels is hard to do unless you're purposely tanking or just have no talent at all on your squad. Neither will be the case for KC.




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:rolleyes:

You have to be kidding.

Moose, Hosmer and Cain will sign huge contracts, contracts that the Royals can’t afford.

Vargas will sign a nice deal, as will Minor. Escobar is gone as well.

Enjoy your fantasy babseball.

6 years between “good” 1st round picks is “hyperbole”?

What?

How can you defend this assclown?

lewdog laying the smack down in here already. :spank:

He’s wrong, as usual.

Tell me about 81/81, Lew

I guess you forget how hard it is to stay a top the pinnacle in any given sport? Most teams don't last long there. Moore drafted home grown talent that won a World Series. In the past two years he's made some bad signings and players have regressed. This is sports. Can you name a Chiefs GM who has done more?

It's hard knowing about the pinnacle of sports as a Chiefs fan though, so I'll give you that. What do you remember about the 1969 season?

You've literally been laughed at for your shit Royals takes over the years here.

"I wouldn't have traded for Cueto even though the outcome was a World Series."

I mean, that's butt ****ing moron level shit that Billay doesn't even say.....and by God he's ****ing dumb.

He's just a dumb Chiefs homer. Poor Lil fella

I really want to back Duncan on the draft picks, but when he ignore the Indiana HS pitchers it exaggerates the slight over valuations on guys.

Who pissed in Dane's Cheerios?

Alex Smith, makes him extra mad

You guys are ****ing idiots.

Dayton Moore has drafted for shit in the past 8 years.

His free agent signings have been garbage.

A talented team went 81-81, even though he made trades.

There’s no difference between losing 90 and 100 games when your front office sucks.

Nice try, butt****

The last 7 high draft picks are:
Russell
Watson
Finnegan
Dozier
Zimmer
Bubba
Colon

You know, I was going to ignore this thread but because of you, I won’t.

Astro-like

Championship on the horizon

You have become a scourge in every thread you post in. Polarizing opinions that scream, “I need attention.” Unlikely behavior from a self described Hollywood elitist.

I defend him from your take because your take is incomplete and wrong.

And, for the record, it wasn't "six years between good first round picks."

2007 - Moustakas. Great pick. Also got Duffy in the 3rd for over-slot dollars, Greg Holland and David Lough in 10/11th.

2008 - Hosmer. Great pick. Also landed Montgomery in the comp round, which eventually turned into great trade leverage, as well as John Lamb in the 6th,
I'll stop and mention for a second that Moore was exactly right about these two picks and built his entire career in Kansas City around it.

2009 - Aaron Crow. Average pick, as he did make the major leagues, provide some value, and get spun out for a useful piece with lots of control. It's a pick that you would say is a bad one if you don't understand the failure rate on MLB first rounders and expect it to hit like football, where GMs get the luxury of watching guys develop in a free minor league until they are 21/22.

Also worth noting that KC saved a little cash on Crow, and then spent on Wil Myers like he was a first-round pick, huge success, and also got the useful Louis Coleman in the 4th round.

2010 - Moore's worst draft by far. Chris Colon was a colossal bust pick, especially since they were lined up to take Sale until about 15 minutes before the pick. Scott Alexander in the 6th and Whit Merrifield in the 10th are now nice picks. This draft would have been saved had they been able to leverage the Colon savings into actually signing a power arm out of Texas in Jon Gray. They got close but couldn't quite close it. Had they, would look very different.

2011 - Bubba Starling is a painful pick. This is what sucks about the baseball draft. He had all the tools to be successful. As a HS prospect, he was really quite similar in tools, HS competition, and etc. to Mike Trout. The line between those two players is a narrow but important one. The pick hasn't worked. A lot of great players went after Starling. KC picked him in part because of fear of him turning into the next Matt Kemp if they didn't. KC did nab Jakob Junis at the end of the draft, which looks useful now, and Terrance Gore. But this draft hurts.

2012 - Kyle Zimmer was not a bad pick. It hasn't worked. But it was absolutely not a scouting or development issue. There were no logical warning signs to suggest he would have the injury problems he has had. A year or two into this pick, it looked like KC had landed a legitimate ace with this pick.

2013 - Hunter Dozier and Sean Manaea. Great picks. Dozier was a signability choice to clear up dollars for Manaea in the comp balance round, and it was a home run. Even if Dozier never produces at the major league level (and he still has a decent possibility of doing so, IMO), Manaea was a trade chip that brought a WS title to KC. Great pick. (And for the record, that's only four drafts between great first round selections, and in one of those, money saved on Crow helped sign Myers at a first-round price).

Also worth noting KC landed Cody Reed in the second round of this draft, which ended up being a great and very valuable pick.

2014 - Brandon Finnegan. Great pick. Not only did he help KC make the WS in 2014 (I don't think they win that WC without him, and he was a great, fresh relief arm down the stretch in September when desperately needed), he was a key piece of the deal in which KC raped Cincinnati for Johnny Cueto.

This draft also featured a lot of guys that may still be valuable for KC. Foster Griffin was a sandwich first-round pick and looks to be on track to be a solid back-end starter and potential mid-rotation type, based on his breakthrough 2017. Scott Blewett showed some promising signs in 2017 and bears watching, still. Erik Skoglund, Chase Vallot, Ryan O'Hearn, and Corey Toups aren't on star tracks, but each could be a solid big-league piece.

2015 - Ashe Russell, Nolan Watson. This draft is actually the worst, I think, the Royals have had under Moore. Russell and Watson have both been disasters, though Russell was not a reach at all (and some thought was a plus value) who fell apart mentally. There are a few guys - Emmanuel Rivera, Gabe Cancel, and Anderson Miller - who might be able to change that perception.

2016 - No first rounder. Got a decent return on AJ Puckett, their top pick. Khalil Lee and Nicky Lopez have proven to be really nice values in rounds 3 and 5. Got Lovelady in round 10.

2017 - Nick Pratto is too early to say anything about, really. He's a HS bat with a long ways to go in development. Same is true of just about everyone, though guys like Dan Tillo, Michael Gigliotti, Tyler Zuber, Brewer Hicklen, and Marlin Willis had encouraging turns.

I thnk this ^ has the potential to play out as their top draft since 2009.

THE ROYALS SUCKED LAST YEAR GUYS.

AND AFTER THE CUBS WON IT ALL LAST YEAR I HAVE A HARD TIME REMEMBERING ANYTHING THEY DID BEFORE 2016.

Good to have you back overseeing the repo, Duncan. It's your rightful place.

Trusting Dayton Moore to rebuild the Royals is like trusting Jim Schaaf to rebuild the
Chiefs.

Good luck.

Boo hoo.

:deevee:

Thin skinned twat

Actually, they are:

Pratto (17)
N/A (16)
Russell (15)
Watson (15)
Finnegan (14)
Griffin (14)
Chase Vallot (14)
Dozier (13)
Manaea (13)

That's actually 8 players. Two of them are awful, awful picks. Two of them were home run picks that helped secure a WS title and another AL pennant (Finnegan and Manaea). Several are still TBD (Dozier, Griffin, Pratto, Vallot).

I've said in the past I don't think the Royals adjusted well to the changes in the draft post 2011, with the hard slotting.

The 13, 14, 16, and 17 drafts are actually solid to really good when you look at them in context and complete. While it's easy to say "Look at the first round picks!" and get impatient with the results, that's not the way baseball works.

Looking back at the more recent draft, it actually gives me confidence they'll do well with the picks that are coming.

Oh, so this is the Anti-Chiefs thread on a Chiefs football forum?

:rolleyes:

It seems to me that the overwhelming majority of you people don’t understand what it takes to win in either sport.

NFL teams don’t win championships without a Hall of Fame QB.

Yet Kershaw couldn’t win one for the Dodgers.

Different sports.

Do you even understand what you're trying to say?

This is like saying “Carl will *finally* get the Chiefs over the top this year!”.

The Royals farm is shit, Dayton passed on the opportunity to trade his stars for high level prospects but suddenly, for the first time in a decade, he’s “Going to get it right!”.

Sounds more like rainbows and unicorns than reality to me.

Yes. The Royals drafts have sucked for the better part of the decade, one player isn’t going to turn them around and the farm sucks.

Danny Duffy isn’t the difference between a WS and 90 losses.

Jeff Luhnow picks:

2012 | Carlos Correa (2nd overall. He inherited Springer).
2013 | Mark Appel (taken instead of Kris Bryant. Ouch)
2014 | Brady Aiken (didn't even sign with team, passing over Trea Turner, Aaron Nola, Michael Conforto, Bradley Zimmer, Matt Chapman, Luke Weaver, top MiLB pitching prospect Michael Kopech).
2015 | Alex Bregman (good pick! His second!); Kyle Tucker (also looks good)
2016 | Forest Whitley (looks good, too, though TINSTAAPP)

My point: Baseball drafts are hard. Being a baseball GM is hard. Even really good ones like Jeff Luhnow and Dayton Moore are not going to hit on every first round-pick. If you can hit at 50 percent or better, you're doing a really good job.

Oh, come on. That’s a terrible argument.

Being an NBA GM is hard. Look at Sam Hinke. Phil Jackson. Even Hall of Famer Jerry West.

Being an NFL GM is hard. Look at John Dorsey, who so many loved. Look at Combo Guys like Parcells in NY or Shanahan in Washington or guys like Mike Holmgem that served double duty or Jimmy Johnson.

Belichick is the greatest of all time and he’s made several mistakes.

The bottom line is that these other men have been held accountable. How many times has Dombrowski moved on? Theo?

Moore isn’t in the same category. His recent moves should be questioned.

Today.

Dane. I like you.

But when you post about baseball, "I'm a football fan" comes screaming out of your keyboard. It's clear in the way you talk about first-round picks.

The Royals farm system is not in good shape. It does have several promising young guys from the past two drafts. It suffered an abortion of a draft from three drafts ago. And it emptied out its high-end talent from the two drafts before that to make a championship push. It also is harder to keep a farm system stocked in this era, with the hard-slotting, when you're winning (and when you roll craps in things like the competitive balance draft three years in a row like the Royals did, a rule MLB has now adjusted so you rotate between Rounds A and B every other year).

Saying Dayton Moore hasn't gotten a draft pick right in the past decade is obtuse, and frankly, really uninformed. I've provided a lot of context for you in this thread. I've provided that context for you in the past. I'll probably provide it again in the future, because I'll keep trying to help you see reason on it.

Moore's opportunity to get "high-level prospects" for his stars was immediately following the WS win, when they all had two years of control. Or after last season, when the return would have been lesser/lower.

Royals fans have bitched for years about the Royals being cheap and passing up opportunities to spend money and compete. What kind of GM in his right mind would break up a defending WS champ because "We have to think about the future now!" It's lunacy.

And at the trade deadline - when the Royals, BTW, were holding the top WC spot and within spitting distance of the division - they weren't getting high level prospects at that point. They would have gotten guys with more questions or less upside than the players in the Royals farm system you hate so much.

Being an NFL GM is child's play compared to being an MLB GM. Hard salary cap. Revenue sharing. Straightforward draft system. Free minor league development that allows GMs to pick 21 and 22 year olds who are 90 percent developed for their league rather than having to project 17 and 18 year old US kids and 15-16 year old Latin America kids, and scrounge college ranks for lower-upside guys. The ability to cut players because salaries aren't guaranteed (goodbye, mistake!).

Dayton Moore isn't perfect. He has certainly made mistakes, and the dropped balls in the 15, 11, and 10 drafts particularly have hurt the Royals. But every other one? You look at those whole drafts, and you find good things in all of them. Heck, even in the 10 and 11 drafts, you find some good things around them.

Duncan, that’s really irrelevant but I like you, too. Your insight is a joy, not only for me but for everyone that reads your baseball posts.

That said, there’s a disconnect. Royals fans, at least from my perception, perceive Moore as Theo or Cash or Domnrowski.

He’s not.

He was extremely lucky to have a Cy Young player on his roster when he assumed the GM role and turned him into a bonanza of picks that changed the franchise.

Before that, he stuck with Buddy Bell, hired Trey Hillman and stayed within his wheelhouse to hire Ned Yost.

All that said, I see Dayton Moore as more lucky than good. Now, there’s nothing wrong with that but expecting him to do it twice is where the line is drawn between skepticism and reality for me.

I can’t see it.

I think Epstein and Luhnow are for sure better than Moore. Hands down. Friedman, too. Neal Huntington in Pittsburgh is really good but less accomplished. Rizzo is good in Washington. Cashman has had an awful lot of advantages but has done well with them. Dombrowski is probably a Hall of Fame GM (but still wasted a decade of Golden Opportunity in Detroit).

What Moore is, is a very good GM. One of the better ones in baseball and certainly in the top half of baseball.

What I think you miss is how much work was done to build up the international scouting under Moore. Guys like Perez and Herrera and Ventura wouldn't have been possible to develop without that.

I think talking about Zack Greinke like Moore inherited a Porsche and he just cashed in it is a narrow view of that. Remember that Greinke talked about quitting baseball and starting a lawn mowing company within the first year after Moore took the job. His staff worked Zack through that, got him to unlock his talent... and then successfully traded him, which is easier said than done.

Even when you have an ace to trade, nailing the return takes skill and good scouting.

Getting Cain and Escobar and Odorizzi from the Brewers was more of a finishing touch than the thing it was all built around. The franchise changed with Hosmer and Moustakas and Perez and with Holland and Herrera and Davis and Shielfs and Ventura, too.

The Myers trade and the Cueto trade and the Zobrist trade were great and timely deals. He deserves credit for those.

He stuck with Buddy Bell because the team was awful, and it didn't matter.

He hired Hillman because he had a successful background, solid credentials, and some upside. It didn't work, but he moved on from it and made it work.

I understand skepticism. Acting like he's awful I don't understand.

Okay, i get that. And you’re totally right, I’m dialed into the football world far more than baseball but I have my guys in place.

But look at the comps: Carl traded a drunken, 2 strike player, who’s now a Hall of Famer candidate in Jared Allen and received an oft injured left tackle and a great but not difference maker in Jamaal Charles.

In the 7 years that followed, the Chiefs won a single playoff game, without the service of either player.

Meanwhile, the Royals traded a somewhat kooky Cy Young winner for a bevy of players (many of whom, the manager knew from his days in Milwaukee).

One GM was fortunate, one was not. If the outcomes had reversed, the KC metro area would have the largest stock of Bryl Cream in the USA.

It’s better to be lucky than good.

What was anti-Chiefs about my statement, dood?

I've been as supportive as I've been since the Pioli regime from the start of the 2017 season, my fears about Veach aside.

Dane, serious question.

Why did you feel the need to shit all over this thread minutes after it was posted? It seems like you've had some kind of vendetta against Moore and the Royals ever since they traded for Cueto and Zobrist and went on to win the WS.

This thread sucks. Total shit show.

Dane has a personal vendetta against those calling Dayton Moore God.

However, I haven't seen anyone call Dayton Moore God after the past two off seasons. He's definitely got chinks in his armor. But putting together those 14/15 World Series teams was a thing of beauty. Back-to-back appearances without a true SuperStar was something I thought I'd never see from a Royals team.

It was very special to many of us and more special than anything the Chiefs could ever do, as my love of baseball is far greater than my like of football.

For those who feel that love for football, can you imagine the God-like status you'd give a Chiefs GM for back-to-back Super Bowl appearances, including a championship? I'm not sure many would care what happened in the following 5-10 seasons if the Chiefs could win a Super Bowl.

And realistically, we all knew this day was coming. When you build a championship smaller market team, players leave. Sadly in the past two years, between injuries and player regression, this similar roster could not repeat it's success. That's not uncommon in baseball and not sure how that falls on Moore?

It's a similar Heaven/Hell or Purgatory question for all of us. I'll take the Heaven/Hell of the Royals any ****ing day. It was a great lifetime moment.

Trading Grienke for Cain, Escobar, Odorizzi = Lucky GM

Kyle Zimmer's injury history = Shitty GM

Yordano Ventura's untimely death = Shitty GM

its ridiculous.

Brady Aiken turned into Kyle Tucker, right? Good job, Luhnow! Correa was also 1st overall and Luhnow should get extra points because he passed on Buxton-- which allowed him to sign McCullers. Lots of people thought the Astros were crazy to pass on Buxton

Appel over Bryant has always stung, but less so now. If only he would have signed with the Pirates a year earlier

It would be nice if the thread could be about the royals offseason moves and information.

This is such and underrated element of a GMs job. It's where John Mozeliak has failed miserably over the last 5 years.

Anyone can just say 'okay boss', hope the scouting director does his job and make sure the payroll checks get written on time. Sitting ass and letting prospects develop isn't good enough.

Sometimes a good GM has to stick his neck out, make an argument to his boss and say 'we NEED to do this'. He has to be able to persuade his boss. My GM doesn't try; we sit on over a billion dollars in franchise equity and approach 9 figure operating profits each year while they refuse to take risks. Moe keeps the checks cashed and never upsets the apple cart so he'll never get fired.

Moore, OTOH, absolutely put his job on the line a couple of times. And the Royals have two pennants and a title directly because of those risks. The 'greatest farm system in baseball history' wouldn't have been enough on its own. Moore risked his owners money and his own job security to make that happen and deserves a hell of a lot of credit for not just that, but also for persuading Glass to run with the big dogs at all.

Personally, I don't believe he's a particularly astute baseball man, but he's done a good job in KC on balance and deserves the standard '5 year grace period' that comes with a title.

I reluctantly trust GMDM and glASS.

He had the wrong ammunition at this year's trade deadline. The no question #1 player in FA is going to be JD Martinez and he got traded for precisely dick.

Bats just didn't get a market this year. The Royals had pending FA position players in a year where contenders were looking for pitching.

He wasn't going to get 'high level prospects' at the deadline. He had nobody approaching Martinez's value and Martinez got 3 afterthought prospects.

Thanks for bringing this up. Dane apparently wasn't paying attention to the trade deadline deals that were made. We were always better off hanging on to these guys and taking the comp picks when they left.

Unless he was saying that we should have traded them prior to last season, which is equally stupid, IMO.

The Royals have been to 4 championship series and won 2 World titles since the last time that shit stain Chiefs Franchise went to and won a SB. Dane has his head clearly and willfully up his ass.

The Chiefs Franchise is one of the biggest playoff underachievers of all time. The Royals, with all their disadvantages, have overachieved. Anyone that ignores that is being willfully ignorant

Yes. Nicky Lopez is a better player/prospect than anyone the Tigers got back for JD Martinez... and it's not like he's an Uber-prospect either.

Speaking of Lopez, he's had a nice showing in the Arizona Fall League. Was convinced by the hitting coach to switch to a bigger/heavier bat and has made much more high quality contact with it. Small sample, but will be interesting to see if he can continue to show the massive LD% improvements he has in the Fall League over a full season at Northwest Arkansas.

With his speed, base running ability, OBP, and position, if he can be a guy who pops 30 2Bs a year and gets to a .400 SLG, he can be a pretty useful, above average piece.


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Dane is a dumb **** when it comes to baseball, nothing new to see.

In it to win it 2.0

Above average pieces is apparently the best we can hope for anymore. Moore has still never drafted a true superstar. I give him credit for the championship and pennants that were made possible because of a perfect storm of things going our way, but I have no faith in him rebuilding this team again.

There is a handy thumbs up/down feature that will promptly bold/hide posts in the thread if they reach a certain number.

Just sayin', there's a way.

If we are going to suck balls for the next 5 years, we really might consider trading Perez, Duffy, and Whit. Literally everyone of any value. Get as much return for prospects as you can to replenish our worst minor league system.

Trust the process.

Well, Dane is Dane. Hell, I heard he is still awaiting Tiny Archibald to get the KC Kings to a NBA Final.

Won't happen unfortunately.

Show us on the doll where Dayton touched you.

I don’t want to argue with you about the Royals because nobody can win an argument with you in this setting. You are definitely the resident expert.

Your correction doesn’t make me more confident in our ability to reach the highest levels again. But it does show how good GMDM is at making trades. I’ll always remember and love GMDM for ‘15; I do wish he was much better in the drafts but as you point out he has made some great trades.

Now if we could forget Ian and some of the recent disaster signings we’d all be happy.

I do feel like you're engaging in some grade inflation here. If guys like Finnegan, Montgomery and Manea are considered 'good' picks in order to bolster your resume, then your definition of 'good' is building towards a .500 squad.

Those are first round picks with serious bonus outlays required who will, at their best, be exceedingly mediocre players. If those guys are in the top 1/3 of your roster, you'll struggle to win 85 games unless there's serious star power ahead of them. Which gets back to where I think Dane is coming from - Moore's relatively iffy eye for star power.

So if you are building around guys like that, you need a whole hell of a lot more of them than what Moore's accomplished. And if you call them what I would call them - average picks - you end up with an average to slightly below average drafting record for Moore.

Like I said, I don't think he's a particularly astute baseball man. The health over the overall system speaks for itself; the Royals may have the worst 5 year projection in baseball right now. The Orioles is probably slightly worse, but it's a close call. Their system is barren and their best talent at the big league level is extremely 'meh'. Even if Cuthbert takes a step forward, Merrifield maintains, Solar becomes a 25-30 HR player and Mondesi breaks out, they still lack pitching something awful and with all that development have, at best, broken even on the losses of Cain/Moustakas/Hosmer.

Would you be surprised to see them average 85-90 losses over the next 5 seasons? I wouldn't - and that's due in MASSIVE part to the fact that the farm simply hasn't developed the organizational depth needed to handle this kind of exodus. His first round picks have been fair to middling but his picks afterwards have provided well below that.

As a risk-taker and horse-trader, he's done a nice job. And as a salesman it's impossible to overstate the impact he's had on the franchise. But asking if he's the right man for a bottom-up rebuild is a fair question. Personally, I think he'll fail, but I do think he's earned the right to try.

I see KCChiefsUS got banned...

For those that are only casual baseball fans, the importance of drafting or developing a super-star is over-rated for baseball. There's no such position or player that comes close to the QB position in importance and effect on a game. It's simply a sport that works off of different metrics.

So while I could care less if we have a super-star, I do want the right roster that goes deep into the post-season. Super-star rosters rarely have that juice.
Harper, Stanton and Trout have yet to see a championship.

Despite our weak farm system and pending free agent departures, the roster does not look that bad going into next year.

Barring injuries, the rotation is likely set - Duffy, Kennedy, Junis, Hammel, and the return of Karnes. We need to take a flyer on a couple of bounce-back guys and hope that Gaviglio and at least one of our prospects can make a Junis-like push (Blewett, Griffin or Staumont).

Bullpen COULD be exciting if they throw caution to the wind and allow guys like Lovelady, Lenik and even Zimmer (won't count on this) a legit chance to make the bullpen out of ST. Heck...even some of our starter-prospects should be considered for the bullpen if they win a spot.

With a weak MILB system, the Royals still managed to promote two players (Whit and Boni) that were better than most of the guys on last year's top 100 prospects (same could be said of Junis). IFFFFF we can somehow sign Hosmer, the infield actually looks good. Cuthbert or Dozier will be a drop-off from Moose, but I'm willing to bet Mondi will be significant upgrade at SS.

CLE is still the favorite, but they just took a gut punch in the playoffs. Baseball playoff hangovers are real and they happen to really good teams. I don't buy whatever the Twins did last year - it is just as likely they were more the 2003 Royals than a perennial playoff contender.

DJ pretty much took my post. The market for bats is terrible. Teams like the Dodgers, Cubs and Yankees with huge payrolls don't need position players. They've all spent this decade basically acting like a small market team, acquiring prospects and mostly hanging on to their young talent... not trading them for veterans like they used to do. They don't even have room for all the young offensive talent they already have.

Dayton absolutely made the right call, try to win and if you don't, you get a good draft pick if they walk away. I'd done that 100 times out of 100 over trading these guys for B level prospects just to give the illusion of "rebuilding."

Potential kff


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