You should deduct 7 as the "should have been" pick turned TD shouldn't be a positive. It shouldn't be credited to Alex11 numbers but that's how it's done. I guess you have to credit someone for the pass:shake::shake::shake:IMHO

So by that logic you need to deduct the 7 on the Brown reception against Pitt. Then Alex did enough to win that game.

I hate that we're the only team with injuries. "Next man up" needs to be less of a gap.

We'll learn from this. Going into year 48 we'll still be the most learned team to have a 48-year SB appearance drought.

Ahemmmm

Denver certainly would.

<iframe src="https://giphy.com/embed/xT9DPhONuz1SpCONiM" width="480" height="480" frameBorder="0" class="giphy-embed" allowFullScreen></iframe><p><a href="https://giphy.com/gifs/xT9DPhONuz1SpCONiM">via GIPHY</a></p>

He needs his offense to score 7 points a quarter to win, not have point miraculously gifted to him. You think Ben should get a TD pass out of that clust**** of a play?

I still don't think the Donks are asking for our scrubs. But if they are Andy should say yes.

Fisher looked great compared to what they lined up.

He needs a health check up. Like welcome to the retirement home. You don't need to see down field here.

This should be the OFFICIAL reaction gif on the 2017 Chiefs defense:

https://media.vanityfair.com/photos/...evator_Bob.gif

Fair...

He's not adjusting to the fact we can't get pressure with 4 men, nor is he adjusting to the fact we do NOT have the secondary to play man coverage. I will always blame the players much more, but Sutton isn't helping by scheming as if he has race cars when he actually has Renault Twizys.

This works as well

http://pixel.nymag.com/imgs/daily/vu....w529.h352.gif

:clap: ROFL Exactly this!

Here's the thing. You have to realize that all defenses in this league are getting torched one way or the other. It's the reality of football in the fantasy football era. Pressure teams are also getting torched by quick hit check down qbs. I don't think pressure is as much of an issue as it is our terrible ball skills when the ball is floated up for grabs. I would hope that's actually fixable. If we had even average ball skills we'd be averaging a few picks per game, and then our defense looks a bit more like it has the past few years. At the same time, Sutton has to make some adjustments to figure out how we stop a smash mouth team like Pittsburgh. To his credit, in most years, we've had these few game struggles and weve adjusted. Hope he has another rabbit in the hat on this one.

It's truly insane that not a single one of Carr's passes got picked off. He was basically throwing it into a forest every play and somehow missing all the trees.

Can't play man, but need to blitz more. :rolleyes:

The secondary can't cover 4 WRs' for 2 or 3 seconds with seven ****ing guys, do you think they're going to cover 4 WR's with 4 or 5 guys for 2 seconds? Unlikely my friend.

I get what Sutton is trying to do. Letting a high powered offense run the ball makes sense.

Shortens the game and keeps it close.

Vs. Pitt it was a great game plan. Unfortunately the Offense shat the bed.

Vs. the Raiders it made no sense. It was a bad strat.

IMO we need to go back to rushing/blitzing the passer to reset and get centered again as a defense...

They didn't do that va the raiders though. They took the run away but the pass cratered

And.........

https://media.giphy.com/media/JYEEdjzlsb280/giphy.gif

Puzzling why you stop applying pressure to a QB with a bad back.

Btw Houston was dropped into coverage 3 out of the 4 times when the Raiders were inside the 10. **** Sutton!

I guess the moral of the story is to hold tight. Pete kept his bomb-ass wife, and ended up in-house marketing for LearJet.

Maybe our fortunes will turn as well.

Maybe come January, this will be our defense

http://www.indiewire.com/wp-content/...rtheiser-2.jpg

It's time.https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...37b7dbcf9c.jpg

7-2 against the Raiders and you want to fire him?

**** you

3rd & 15 and you rush 3 and drop the defense back 20 yards.....

W?
T?
F?
!

I was holding off on the pitchfork mob.

Until now.

Fire this mother****er. Now.

**** you, Fire Eric Murray! He's the cause of half our blunders

Everyone on the the D side of the ball should be informed their jobs are on the line. We need to clear a ton of cap room this off season.

****ing got damned pathetic. Absolutely ****ing pathetic.

I'm down with firing Sutton.

I know this bump came after that abortion inside 2 minutes from halftime, but the defense has been solid so far considering the offense they are facing.

The real crime is that Sutton takes weeks to make adjustments.

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3rd & long..Houston drops in coverage

No heart by this defense. Cowboys march right down the field. Defense gives back all of the gains the offense made.

Sutton needs to go. This defense is 2003 Greg Robinson bad right now. Cannot stop anyone.

I'll never understand consistently, not just here and there but consistently dropping your best pass rusher into coverage, particularly on 3rd & long

I get it in the NE game. It worked....but the defense since then has been the worst in the entire NFL in 3rd and long...that should tell you something as D cord.

Romo basically ripping the defense Sutton is calling

Needs to be fired immediately. **** this shit!

Andy won't fire Sutton. Hunt has to step up and be a hardass and do it for him.

You don't drop your best pass rusher almost every play. That's common football sense.

Not a single change will be made on the coaching staff, just you watch. Andy Reid is just like Gary Pinkel was at Missouri. Both refuse to fire ineffective coaches and hire unqualified coaches from their good ol' boy network when there is a vacancy.

It's probably time to move on from Sutton

Clark needs to tell Andy he is out if he doesn’t fire Sutton. Doesn’t matter what happens because this isn’t a winning formula.

Team has no toughness on either side of the ball. Weak players with no attitude.

Oh well we tried...

Be nice saying it for 3 yrs... FIRE SUTTON

Didn’t he fire a d-coordinator in Philly and put a offensive coach in his place?lol

Andy Reid fired Juan Castillo defense coordinator Eagles during the bye week 2012. Could it happen again?

yea I am pretty sure Andy fired now head coach of the Buffalo Bills Sean McDermott.

Probably one of Andy's biggest miss/mistake of his career.

Granted I have 400 posts over 12 years so take this with a grain of salt but this is the same show. 11-5 and yay a division title and then out in the first round. I can’t do this anymore - 47 years of this shit. If we don’t fire Sutton and give me any hope of things changing for our defense why should I waste my Sundays - I’m going to have a Heart attack over this stupidity.

I’ve had my fill of this bullshit.
Make a change over the bye week because we all know what the status quo is going to lead to: another early playoff game exit.

Should've been fired before he could get the Country Kitchen buffet discount.

Not sure what's going on. I don't understand why Acker is playing over Mitchell. I hope Hali can play more snaps toward the end of the season because it's painfully obvious how poor olb play is hurting us. This is a complete mess. We'll see. Weve adjusted out of messes before. Was interesting to see us come out today in a 3-4 front. Sutton needs to make adjustments... ASAP. And I don't understand why our front office is twiddling their thumbs... Dorsey saved our defense last year by finding Terrance Mitchell. He did that by bringing on scrap pile free agents. Where is that this year? Man I hope they figure something out over the bye week.

I'm not sure I can understand anybody defending Sutton at this point. It's no different than defending Greg Robinson.

Sutton is a multi season failure at making adjustments. Expecting effective adjustments is a pipe dream. Bye Sutton bye.

Sutton's defense has been solid for about 75-80% of his time in KC. Robinson's defense looked good for a few games one season. That's the difference.

I don't know that anybody at all likes what Sutton's defense looks like right now. It looks atrocious. He has to make a big adjustment. But in my book he's earned the right to at least have some time to try to fix this. It's a better option than trying to make a switch midseason.

Sutton has also had 10 times the talent to work with. Robinson made chicken shit out of chicken shit. Sutton has made chicken salad out of filet mignon.

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What are you talking about? The defense has been very good the past few years. Last year we struggled a little late which is understandable given all the injuries. This season is something entirely different. We're getting beat in ways we haven't before. But let's not take away the fact that this defense has been carrying us most of the Andy Reid era.

Sutton should be giving 95% of his paycheck to Berry.

You think our talent right now without Eric Berry is filet mignon? Seriously?

And did you really say Robinson had chicken shit to work with? He was practically given a blank check to bolster his defense.

Sorry..he has used up his rope. This is the NFL and he is not getting it done.

This defense is bad. Changes need to made. Tony Romo is a better option than Sutton right now.

Robinson was never give a blank check for defense....it was always offense first.

Robinson was also a bad coach though, so it would not have mattered how much talent you gave him.

Give Sutton five Justin Houstons and he will drop them all in coverage....

Last year Sutton refused to make effective adjustments the same as we are seeing now. I’m glad our talent has been good enough to pull through in the past. It’s not happening this year.

We still have the talent but they are not performing. That’s on the coach. Either the coach is not setting the players up for success or the coach has lost the respect/influence of the players.

The defense didn't struggle last year because of lack of adjustments. Our defense was effective last year and considering the lineup we limped into the playoffs with, we did ok against the Steelers. The defense has carried us for years. Our defense looks shitty this year. We haven't made effective adjustments yet and we maybe never will. But the problem this year is new to this year. Let's not create the BS narrative that this is something that's happened over multiple years.

The overreaction to Houston going into coverage is so ridiculous that dates back to last year when defense wasn't the issue. That's not fireable. The defensive struggles this year are something totally different. Rushing Houston 100% of the time isn't even close to the biggest of our problems nor do I know that it necessarily solves anything.

No it hasn't. The defense has consistently been good at stopping one thing. The pass or the run, but never both. None of this defense's success comes off of scheme. It comes from star players bailing out mediocre schemes with individual moments of brilliance.

And yes, Sutton has had incredible talent to work with. How many pro bowlers a few years ago? Six? This defense has never been good schematically or in attitude.


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Being last in 3rd and long, close to last in rush defense and giving up 28 points a game is completely fireable.

This defense is bad. Hell, they gave up 19 points to Trevor ****ing Semen and the Broncos.

This defense is Greg Robinson 2003 Chiefs bad right now. Dallas punted once in the second half, and it was after the game was decided.

Sutton's defenses have always been mediocre to bad against good QB's. Now the defense is just bad against everyone.

You're trying to use our 2013 roster which caught lining in a bottle early in the season to prove your point?

You're seriously overestimating the talent we've had. Look at the depth charts since 2014. And consider that Berry has missed more than half of the games since 2013 and that Houston has been an injured nonfactor in most of our playoff pushes. In each year, half of our defensive starters were below average. And we have that problem this year.

Scheme covered up personnel in the past years. It's not doing the job this year. It is a problem unique to this year. That's horse shit that scheme was a problem in years past and even bigger horse shit that we've had some kind of talent boom on defense, especially when you consider that most of our star players can't stay on the field.

How you can defend Bob Sutton after the complete meltdown of this defense in the last month is incredible. This defense does not have a ton of talent, but the talent is better than the results it is producing---they should not be the worst defense in the NFL...yet here they are.

I'm not at all defending the defensive play this year. If it continues like this and Sutton has no answers, yes, we need to seriously consider getting rid of him. This is nothing even close to GRob. GRob was fired for multiple years of incompetence. Sutton has been incompetent for a few months. And he has adjusted us out of big defensive messes in the past. I highly doubt a midseason replacement is going to completely turn this defense around. Sutton is still our best option for the big turnaround that we need. And trust me, I don't for a second think what we're doing right now is at all acceptable.

When have I defended our defensive meltdown? I'm defending the BS revisionist nonsense that this defense was bad before 2017 or that we were overflowing with talent. We've had an effective defense even with marginal talent under Sutton. This year is totally different. We have very, very big problems and scheme is a huge part of that. But that is a problem unique to this year.

Well, the numbers says otherwise in terms of comparing Sutton's 2017 to Robinson's 2003 defenses. And the 2017 defense is more talented than 2003, in my opinion.

Coaches don't change, they just get recycled

"New York Jets and Bob Sutton: Awful Match
SMUSH HIGGINS
DECEMBER 9, 2008


He shouldn't be smiling; he should be crying. Sutton is awful.

In the last two games, Jets defensive coordinator Bob Sutton has been sending three or four-man rushes every play, and seven or eight coverage defenders. Nothing is ever going to be accomplished if you don't send five to seven blitzers. If they don't, the opponent's rushing game will be gaining four to five yards a carry—so will the passing game.

Teams are more conservative with their passing game, using screen and dump passes. For example, Broncos FB/RB Peyton Hillis was killing the Jets on the ground two weeks ago, and still Sutton sent the four-man rush. San Francisco QB Shaun Hill had a great passing day last week and had five seconds of time to throw and guess what...NO PASS RUSH!

Cannot stop the run, cannot stop third and long. The Chiefs have sucked at these two things for a long time.

???
Robinson's 2009 early defense was one of the top in the NFL. Are you really trying to use those 9 games as some kind of representation of Robinson's defense? Those games were a total fluke. Just like Sutton's 2013 first 9 games.

17,465 days since we last attended a SB and he's had weeks, enough is enough. And allowing corners and safeties to play that far off, dropping rushers in to coverage, and rushing three isn't a sign that he's going to do any fixing. He's ****ing blind or stupid. Outside of Peters there's no part of our D that's good, that's ****ing terrible.

Quit kissing his ass. Unfounded loyalty is why we're at 17,465 days man!

I didn't know Robinson coached a NFL team in 2009...... :hmmm:

Look, the pudding is in the pie. This defense is as bad as 2003 is, and arguably worse in some areas.

Sutton shouldn't be getting a paycheck!

2003. Typo. Think you know what I meant.

This defense is as very bad. Never said otherwise. I just didn't understand using Robinson's early 2003 defense to prove some point, given that that defense was arguably a top 10 defense at the time. That was a complete fluke. If you want to compare this defense right now to any Robinson defense beside that time frame, yeah, you definitely have a point.

Houston drops into coverage more snaps than he rushes the passer.......think about that

WTF History repeating itself.