ChiefsPlanet

ChiefsPlanet (https://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/index.php)
-   Nzoner's Game Room (https://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/forumdisplay.php?f=1)
-   -   Science Do miracles happen? (https://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=349209)

Vladimir_Kyrilytch 06-30-2023 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BWillie (Post 17001494)
No.

Everything that will happen and has happened can be explained. Now there is an element of randomness to it but it is not a miracle.

Enlighten us Mr. Willie. Humor us. Explain how life began. What started the big bang? Why didn't the big bang happen 5 million years before it did, or 5 million after? Why at the exact moment it happened did it happen? What natural processes were involved? Which laws of physics were in play?

notorious 06-30-2023 08:39 PM

Life began April 27, 2017.

DJay23 06-30-2023 09:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by El Lobo Gordo (Post 17001962)
Don't do that. Don't blow this ****ing shit off.

Prove him wrong.

FlaChief58 07-01-2023 04:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vladimir_Kyrilytch (Post 17002089)
Enlighten us Mr. Willie. Humor us. Explain how life began. What started the big bang? Why didn't the big bang happen 5 million years before it did, or 5 million after? Why at the exact moment it happened did it happen? What natural processes were involved? Which laws of physics were in play?

I heard on chiefsplanet.com that the world is 6000 years old. I'm not sure where you get this nonsense from

El Lobo Gordo 07-01-2023 09:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJay23 (Post 17002116)
Prove him wrong.

From Bell's theorem we know that local hidden variables cannot explain all the predictions of Quantum Mechanics under all circumstances. However it doesn't rule out non local hidden variables.

We have two options.

1. There are no non local hidden variables and effects can occur that do not have any causes.

2. Non local hidden variables that we cannot observe create effects that we can observe.

Neither of these options can be falsified. Accepting 1 means you have to toss out causality and that is bridge too far for me. 2 seems a lot more plausible however accepting 2 means you have to accept that miracles, under the pretty stringent definition given in the OP, are possible.

JohnnyHammersticks 07-01-2023 11:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vladimir_Kyrilytch (Post 17002046)
My bible says Jesus performed multiple miracles. I haven't read the new, edited woke version of the bible so maybe that got taken out. But I'm pretty sure I remember some stuff about water being turned to wine, walking on water, driving demons out of the possessed, etc.

Atheists believe in an absurd miracle themselves. That life spontaneously created itself. To go from nothing, absolute nothing, to life is a miracle. There's "no local cause" for that.

So either way, miracles certainly do happen.

You’re moving up my list of favorite ChiefsPlanet posters with miraculous speed!

El Lobo Gordo 07-01-2023 11:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vladimir_Kyrilytch (Post 17002046)
My bible says Jesus performed multiple miracles. I haven't read the new, edited woke version of the bible so maybe that got taken out. But I'm pretty sure I remember some stuff about water being turned to wine, walking on water, driving demons out of the possessed, etc.

Atheists believe in an absurd miracle themselves. That life spontaneously created itself. To go from nothing, absolute nothing, to life is a miracle. There's "no local cause" for that.

So either way, miracles certainly do happen.

A lot of arm chair atheists.....people that don't really know science but think that science can explain virtually everything....are ignorant that the existence of life is a real problem that nobody has a real answer.

You see natural phenomena happen over and over again. They are quite common occurrences. For instance a dust devils appear on mars and on earth and the appear in even a larger form on Jupiter(think big red spot). If we land a probe on on exoplanet with an atmosphere....I 'm pretty sure we will see dust devils. Earthquakes appear on earth and guess what....take a look at any large body and you'll find seismic activity. If we land a probe on an exoplanet....I'd bet my house we find earthquakes after a while. I bet my house the planet has no life too.

The emergence of life is a very peculiar phenomena, the evidence suggest it only happened once on earth, we can't replicate it in the lab, and we don't see it happening anywhere else. It is not like natural phenomena because natural phenomena are common events that happen over and over again in multiple places and multiple times. The emergence of life is different in that it is a "natural" phenomena that doesn't conform to how natural phenomena actually behave. The emergence of life is a one off event and natural phenomena are not one off events. If you are looking for miracles....a good candidate is the emergence of life.

Azide22 07-02-2023 01:48 AM

No. Just things we can't explain.

Bearcat 07-02-2023 02:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vladimir_Kyrilytch (Post 17002046)
My bible says Jesus performed multiple miracles. I haven't read the new, edited woke version of the bible so maybe that got taken out. But I'm pretty sure I remember some stuff about water being turned to wine, walking on water, driving demons out of the possessed, etc.

Atheists believe in an absurd miracle themselves. That life spontaneously created itself. To go from nothing, absolute nothing, to life is a miracle. There's "no local cause" for that.

So either way, miracles certainly do happen.

I just find it dumb how people can't accept they're basically talking about the same thing.

If you don't believe in god, there's obviously a question of how it all started.

If you believe in god, there's obviously a question of how that started.

Something came from nothing at some point in both timelines... thinking religion or science wraps it up in a nice bow is ridiculous.

ChiefsFanatic 07-02-2023 03:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bearcat (Post 17002990)
... thinking religion or science wraps it up in a nice bow is ridiculous.

I once heard someone, like Neil deGrasse Tyson , or maybe even Bill Nye, or someone like them, say the difference between science and religion is that science seeks answers, and religion claims to know all the answers.

El Lobo Gordo 07-02-2023 11:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BWillie (Post 17001494)
No.

Everything that will happen and has happened can be explained. Now there is an element of randomness to it but it is not a miracle.

About randomness. Its not something that you can prove exists because it can always be claimed that what you perceive to be randomness is just a function of ignorance. For instance when I am playing poker, I perceive I was dealt random cards but if I knew the composition of the deck before hand the cards I get are not random but rather instead fixed or pre-determined. The cards I am dealt seem random to me but only because I am ignorant about the composition of the deck.

If you believe true randomness exists it is belief founded in faith. There actually isn't any good reason to believe true randomness exist.


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 01:08 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.