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Old 09-25-2013, 04:54 AM  
|Zach| |Zach| is offline
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The Double Absurdity of Ted Cruz's 'Filibuster'

Why the senator's last stand against Obamacare just doesn't make sense.

http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/...buster/279959/

Who says Republicans and Democrats can't agree on anything? These days, they are largely united in their loathing for Ted Cruz, the pugnacious Republican freshman senator from Texas. On Tuesday afternoon, Cruz took the floor of the Senate and vowed to speak as long as he could stand. (His colleague Mike Lee has already taken a turn at the podium.)

For procedural reasons, Cruz's remarks, however long, do not constitute a true filibuster; the vote to move forward with government-funding legislation is scheduled to begin after noon on Wednesday and will go forward regardless. Twitter quickly dubbed his stand a "fauxlibuster" or -- perfect for its invocation of vacuous, feel-good nonsense-speech -- a "Ted Talk." Invoking the Nazis, the Soviet Union, and the Little Engine That Could, Cruz styled himself the lone crusader for right against a formidably equipped enemy.

Nearly to a one, Republicans want to get rid of Obamacare. But most also worry Cruz's defund crusade will lead to a government shutdown that hurts the GOP politically. Leaving aside the policy or even the political advisability of Cruz's undertaking, though, there are a couple of basic logical problems with what he's trying to do, as the conservative writer David Freddoso pointed out on the Conservative Intelligence Briefing website on Sunday.

1. He's trying to block the same bill he says he wants to pass. Cruz and his fellow defunders pushed the Republican-controlled House of Representatives to pass a bill funding the federal government but stopping funding for health-care-reform implementation. The House obeyed and passed the bill on Friday. But now that the Senate is considering the bill, Cruz wants to prevent it from being voted on. "If you’re really interested in putting pressure on Democrats to heed their constituents and vote to defund Obamacare, then you make them take the very vote that Cruz is trying to prevent from happening," Freddoso writes.

2. Shutting down the government wouldn't stop Obamacare. On Fox News on Friday, Cruz proposed passing piecemeal funding bills for "different pieces of the government," such as the military, implying Congress could fund other government functions while omitting Obamacare. But that's wrong -- the money for Obamacare isn't at stake in the continuing resolution currently under consideration. It's "mandatory" spending, akin to Medicare and Social Security, and would require action by Congress to revoke. "I’m convinced that most conservatives who have bought into [Cruz's] strategy have been misled to believe we can hold off Obamacare for a while with a government shutdown," Freddoso writes. "Obamacare is already funded, and that won’t change if this bill gets stalled by a filibuster. During the shutdown, the Marines don’t get paid, but Obamacare gets funded."

Conservatives can cheer Cruz for grabbing the nation's attention and giving an impassioned, high-profile speech. But, Freddoso argues, they shouldn't pretend this is a practical step toward stalling legislation they hate. As he wrote in another post: "This plan is right out of Alice in Wonderland. You need to prevent a vote on defunding Obamacare in order to defund Obamacare." Good luck with that, Senator.
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Old 09-25-2013, 07:04 AM   #2
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Seriously Zach. Don't be stupid. I'd like to think you aren't but posts like this are ardent attempts at proving me wrong. Please don't prove me wrong. Don't become a blowfish, who posts worthless shit and runs away.
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Old 09-25-2013, 07:10 AM   #3
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A politician is finally standing for something lets all hate him!
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Old 09-25-2013, 07:14 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AustinChief View Post
Seriously Zach. Don't be stupid. I'd like to think you aren't but posts like this are ardent attempts at proving me wrong. Please don't prove me wrong. Don't become a blowfish, who posts worthless shit and runs away.
You seem to be laboring under the idea that I am hung up on what you think about me and have ever done anything ever with you in mind.
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Old 09-25-2013, 07:16 AM   #5
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Austin IS a Cruz cult follower but that article seriously blows
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Old 09-25-2013, 07:28 AM   #6
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Jumped on CSPAN a few hours ago to check out the sideshow. He was talking about chocolate pudding at a salad bar.

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Old 09-25-2013, 07:43 AM   #7
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The Republicans want to shut down the government.

It is the only way to even make getting rid of ObamaCare a reality.

Their entire game-plan rests on the government getting shut down, Obama getting annoyed, giving into to their demands and saying he will get rid of ObamaCare.

Defunded doesn't get rid of ObamaCare.

Hence, the Republicans want to shut down the government.

The GOP will continue waste taxpayer money as they negotiate in bad faith on legislation that will never become law.
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Old 09-25-2013, 07:44 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bo's Pelini View Post
A politician is finally standing for something lets all hate him!
Yea! Supporting a bill that he is now not going to allow a vote on.

Yea!
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Old 09-25-2013, 07:51 AM   #9
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Cruz Likens Obamacare Defunding Skeptics To Nazi Appeasers (VIDEO)

Quote:
During a floor speech Tuesday aimed at reviving the already-dim prospects for his effort to defund Obamacare, Sen. Ted Cruz (R-TX) likened his doubters to Nazi appeasers.

"If you go to the 1940s, Nazi Germany," Cruz said. "Look, we saw in Britain, Neville Chamberlain, who told the British people, 'Accept the Nazis. Yes, they'll dominate the continent of Europe but that's not our problem. Let's appease them. Why? Because it can't be done. We can't possibly stand against them.'"

"And in America there were voices that listened to that," he continued. "I suspect those same pundits who say it can't be done, if it had been in the 1940s we would have been listening to them. Then they would have made television. They would have gotten beyond carrier pigeons and beyond letters and they would have been on tv and they would have been saying, 'You cannot defeat the Germans.'"

Cruz said at the outset that he intends to speak until he is "no longer able to stand" in an effort to force Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-NV) to agree to a 60-vote threshold for any motion that removes the defunding language from the House-passed continuing resolution.

But because Senate procedure limits how long he may speak before the initial vote to invoke cloture on Wednesday, Cruz is actually not staging a filibuster.
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewir...ppeasers-video
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Old 09-25-2013, 08:45 AM   #10
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I can't understand why the GOP is fighting this so much. Just let it be implemented, keep your mouths shut, and let it collapse under it's own weight. If it's really a horrible plan (and it likely will be), it'll collapse. Let the Democrats OWN their stupidity, let them hang themselves.
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Old 09-25-2013, 08:52 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prison Bitch View Post
I can't understand why the GOP is fighting this so much. Just let it be implemented, keep your mouths shut, and let it collapse under it's own weight. If it's really a horrible plan (and it likely will be), it'll collapse. Let the Democrats OWN their stupidity, let them hang themselves.
They really should let it go on through, especially considering it was what the GOP themselves were pushing for in the 90s.
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Old 09-25-2013, 08:53 AM   #12
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I agree with you PB, but all know as soon as it collapses it will be blamed on conservatives and the low-information democratic voter base will believe every word of it.
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Old 09-25-2013, 09:04 AM   #13
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It's funny the way Cruz's critics look down their noses at him while completely misunderstanding what he's trying to do. According to Cruz, the only way to succeed at repealing Obamacare, or even at limiting it's funding, is to spark a popular revolt that will move some democrat votes in the Senate to the anti-Obamacare side. He's not filibustering* the House bill to stop the House bill. He's doing it to get publicity in the hope that the public will generate pressure on the Senate so that when the vote comes there's a chance of sending the House version to the President for his signature.

* And speaking of bizarre, nonsensical criticisms, this stuff about Cruz's maneuver not technically being a filibuster is ridiculous. As long as he holds the floor, nothing can be done. That's a filibuster in fact even if it's technically not a filibuster taking place during the debate over the bill he's blocking.
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Old 09-25-2013, 09:07 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prison Bitch View Post
I can't understand why the GOP is fighting this so much. Just let it be implemented, keep your mouths shut, and let it collapse under it's own weight. If it's really a horrible plan (and it likely will be), it'll collapse. Let the Democrats OWN their stupidity, let them hang themselves.
We have a lot of horrible government programs that have built in constituencies and complexities that make their repeal very difficult. When the problems are significant enough to bubble up into the nation's consciousness, the fix is usually another layer of government and an effort to kick the problem down the road. I don't share your confidence that Obamcare will collapse under it's own weight if implemented even if it's as bad as critics think it is.
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Old 09-25-2013, 09:30 AM   #15
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I agree with you PB, but all know as soon as it collapses it will be blamed on conservatives and the low-information democratic voter base will believe every word of it.
That's probably true. Bill Clinton even got involved recently by flapping his gums about how the GOP needs to help Obamacare succeed. They'll just blame the GOP when it (inevitably) fails.
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