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Old 04-23-2013, 06:08 AM  
BucEyedPea BucEyedPea is offline
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Bloomberg Says Interpretation of Constitution Will ‘Have to Change’ After Boston Bomb

Like I said, more police state is coming. The scared sheeple will obey too.

In the wake of the Boston Marathon bombings, Mayor Michael Bloomberg said Monday the country’s interpretation of the Constitution will “have to change” to allow for greater security to stave off future attacks....

The mayor pointed to the gun debate and noted the courts have allowed for increasingly stringent regulations in response to ever-more powerful weapons.
Another reason why Progressives are closet totalitarians.


http://politicker.com/2013/04/bloomb...ave-to-change/
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Old 04-24-2013, 04:10 PM   #106
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Originally Posted by La literatura View Post
Yes, I'm going to assume that you're not a professor of earth science and you don't have a law degree, or a degree in American history. You can confirm that formally, but your informal ways of doing so are fine by me.
I am not a professor of anything so you are correct there. My background is mostly in engineering, math, logic, obviously computer science. Have I studied law? yes. Am I a lawyer, no. Have I studied American History extensively? yes. Do I have a degree in the field. No. None of this invalidates my knowledge on the subjects and it's simply ad hominem bullshit but you know that.

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Originally Posted by La literatura View Post
So you're going to ban me because I'm telling you a history you find uncomfortable (though you're not even really listening to me)?
No I won't ban you. If being an idiot was bannable the DC subforum would be virtually empty.
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Old 04-24-2013, 04:13 PM   #107
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Originally Posted by La literatura View Post
Are you going to answer my previous questions, or should I just go right to "What's the result/conclusion in Presser?"
Again, the conclusion is irrelevant since it does nothing to support your ridiculous original claim that the Court ONLY saw the 2nd Amendment in the context of state militias. Notice the emphasis of "ONLY" that is the place where you went wrong from the beginning.
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Old 04-24-2013, 04:18 PM   #108
La literatura La literatura is offline
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Originally Posted by AustinChief View Post
I am not a professor of anything so you are correct there. My background is mostly in engineering, math, logic, obviously computer science. Have I studied law? yes. Am I a lawyer, no. Have I studied American History extensively? yes. Do I have a degree in the field. No. None of this invalidates my knowledge on the subjects and it's simply ad hominem bullshit but you know that.
Of course it doesn't invalidate what you're saying. I'm not using your lack of education as part of my argument. So this isn't "ad hominem" bullshit. I'm not attacking you personally. Your apparent lack of knowledge itself and your inability to stay on point in this argument, however, is doing a fine job at invalidating your argument.
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Old 04-24-2013, 04:18 PM   #109
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And I'm done debating on your terms until you address the link Raiderhader gave. Would you like me to cut/paste from it?
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Old 04-24-2013, 04:20 PM   #110
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Originally Posted by AustinChief View Post
Again, the conclusion is irrelevant since it does nothing to support your ridiculous original claim that the Court ONLY saw the 2nd Amendment in the context of state militias. Notice the emphasis of "ONLY" that is the place where you went wrong from the beginning.
I stated from the beginning that the militia purpose was intrinsically wrapped up in how the Court interpreted the 2nd Amendment. Your emphasis of "ONLY" is something you're bringing into this discussion.

Can you state in your own words what the conclusion of Presser was? Even if you find it irrelevant, we should at least get it on the table for others to judge.
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Old 04-24-2013, 04:21 PM   #111
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Originally Posted by AustinChief View Post
And I'm done debating on your terms until you address the link Raiderhader gave. Would you like me to cut/paste from it?
I did address the link Raiderhader gave. I addressed it in a post to him explaining why I browsed the link.
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Old 04-24-2013, 04:23 PM   #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by La literatura View Post
Of course it doesn't invalidate what you're saying. I'm not using your lack of education as part of my argument. So this isn't "ad hominem" bullshit. I'm not attacking you personally. Your apparent lack of knowledge itself and your inability to stay on point in this argument, however, is doing a fine job at invalidating your argument.
Just because you can't follow along doesn't mean I am not on point. Don't blame me for you inability to keep up. I honestly hope to God you aren't just parroting some bullshit you heard in class one day and this is instead the result of your convoluted understanding of basic logic. It would be tragic if there is an entire class of students being polluted with this garbage.
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Old 04-24-2013, 04:30 PM   #113
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Quote:
Originally Posted by La literatura View Post
I stated from the beginning that the militia purpose was intrinsically wrapped up in how the Court interpreted the 2nd Amendment. Your emphasis of "ONLY" is something you're bringing into this discussion.

Can you state in your own words what the conclusion of Presser was? Even if you find it irrelevant, we should at least get it on the table for others to judge.
You do know what the word intrinsic means right?
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Old 04-24-2013, 04:32 PM   #114
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Originally Posted by La literatura View Post
I did address the link Raiderhader gave. I addressed it in a post to him explaining why I browsed the link.
yes, you "browsed" the link and saw nothing new. Ok, I "browsed" Presser and saw nothing relevant. Address the link in detail (specifically St. George Tucker's commentaries) and I will address Presser in detail (silly futile exercise but what the hell, I'll do it)
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Old 04-24-2013, 05:00 PM   #115
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Originally Posted by BucEyedPea View Post

Another reason why Progressives are closet totalitarians.
They're only closet totalitarians if your head is in the sand. They're actually pretty overt about it.

Never waste a good crisis.
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Old 04-24-2013, 05:46 PM   #116
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Originally Posted by AustinChief View Post
Just because you can't follow along doesn't mean I am not on point. Don't blame me for you inability to keep up. I honestly hope to God you aren't just parroting some bullshit you heard in class one day and this is instead the result of your convoluted understanding of basic logic. It would be tragic if there is an entire class of students being polluted with this garbage.
No, it's just in Supreme Court cases and Con Law textbooks.
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Old 04-24-2013, 05:48 PM   #117
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Originally Posted by AustinChief View Post
You do know what the word intrinsic means right?
Yes.
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Old 04-24-2013, 06:06 PM   #118
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Originally Posted by La literatura View Post
Your view, that the Founder's idea of the Second Amendment was to prohibit both federal and state action against gun regulation, has no basis in their framing of our gov't (federalism) or their understanding of what the Bill of Rights did.

I only browsed your link because it simply restates things I've already read before. You really don't think "guncite.com" is the first source to lay out that information, do you? I've read the majority opinions of Heller and McDonald.

It is the documented view of many Founders that the people themselves were the militia. Colonial militia men were expected as much as possible to provide their own arms and powder.

So, in playing along with your militia centered theory, I find it nigh impossible to accept the premise of your theoretical SC case. A state law passed denying the right to own a double barreled musket would not pass muster as that weapon was viewed not just as a personal weapon but, also a weapon of/for the defense of the country.
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Old 04-24-2013, 06:09 PM   #119
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Originally Posted by AustinChief View Post
No, it's not controversial... it's a complete joke of a lie. You are basing your lie upon the few cases in history where the Court addressed anything even remotely related to the 2nd Amendment. You then extrapolate those cases to be the entirety of the Court's thinking on the subject.

So basically if the Court didn't rule that the sky was blue, we can assume that for the last 230+ years they didn't think it was! Truly stunning logic!

As I showed with Dred Scott, the Court accepted the right to bear arms outside JUST the context of a militia. There weren't previous rulings because there didn't need to be. That doesn't mean the Court's recent rulings are some break from tradition.

Sad about how ridiculous you are and your over inflated opinion of yourself.... BUT I'm encouraged to know that idiots like you are the future of the left.

I am discouraged to know that they are the future of anything.
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Old 04-24-2013, 07:22 PM   #120
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Originally Posted by AustinChief View Post
yes, you "browsed" the link and saw nothing new. Ok, I "browsed" Presser and saw nothing relevant. Address the link in detail (specifically St. George Tucker's commentaries) and I will address Presser in detail (silly futile exercise but what the hell, I'll do it)
At this point, you have to realize you're a beaten dog. Let's have a quick overview of how this conversation played out (so far).

1) I say that the Court's interpretation [not yours, not mine, not even James Madison's] of the Second Amendment for most of American history viewed the militia component as intrinsic to the right to bare arms.
2) You throw tantrum.
3) I cite U.S. v. Miller which you agree demonstrates what I've said in (1).
4) You say we should disregard Miller as a statement of the Court's interpretation because you don't agree with it.
5) I cite Presser v. Illinois.
6) You say its irrelevant, and won't discuss it unless I "address" Raiderhader's link.
7) A quick browse of Raiderhader's link clearly shows no mention of Presser or Miller, or even any Supreme Court case dealing with the 2nd Amendment.

So how am I to demonstrate the Court's historical interpretation of the Second Amendment if you refuse to allow me to even bring up any Court cases dealing with the Second Amendment? Instead, you want me to focus on something other than documents that would demonstrate the Court's historical interpretation.

At this point, you have to realize how unreasonable you are being. And that's a generous, a very generous, characterization of how you've acted in this thread.
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