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Old 04-12-2013, 11:25 AM  
Bowser Bowser is offline
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Five Hard Changes Conservatives Need to Make

Don't shoot me, I'm just the messenger.

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It's high time that we conservatives accepted and embraced difficult realities

The British SAS has a motto: Who Dares Wins.

This is a motto American conservatives need to internalize. And here's how they can put it into action.



1. TAX POLICY

As part of a major debt deal centered on reforming entitlements, we should support the elimination of state and local tax deductions.

If we're to achieve a grand bargain, more revenue will have to be on the table. This isn't a statement of conservative treason; it's an uncomfortable but unassailable demand of political reality. The Democrats control the White House and the Senate. And compromising on tax revenue doesn't have to be a bad thing.

Florida has no state income tax. Conversely, in New York, there's a pretty hefty state income tax. But because a Floridian has far less state taxes with which to offset his federal tax bill, he is at a disadvantage to the New Yorker. In effect, the Floridian is subsidizing the New Yorker's tax bill. This is deeply unfair. Just as state residency does not define national identity, neither should it shape the responsibilities of citizenship. By removing these deductions, conservatives would achieve two key objectives. First, in producing around $580 billion over 10 years, conservatives would increase pressure on the president to make major entitlement reforms. Second, we'd draw a clearer contrast between high and low tax states.


2. NATIONAL SECURITY POLICY

We should accept Obama's 10-year defense spending proposals.

America greatest threat is our national debt. Accepting this reality, the president's proposal of $450 billion in 10-year cuts is difficult but doable. We could, for example, reform the military health care system and refocus our support towards veterans. We could downsize our footprint in Europe. We could reduce our civilian defense workforce. These proposals would strengthen our hand at the broader debt negotiating table. But they'd also give us the credibility to draw a line against the sequester defense cuts and any future defense cuts. And having previously shown our willingness to examine the defense books, we'd be able to make a much stronger case to the American people.

3. SOCIAL POLICY

America's incarceration system is a mess. By regularly imprisoning low-level offenders like drug users, we encourage lives of recidivism. This approach costs us dearly, both in our pockets and in our communities. We should refocus prison terms towards serial/violent offenders. Doing so would reduce the negative costs of our current system and would illustrate that compassionate conservatism is responsive and real.

4. POLITICAL RELATIONSHIPS

Both Republicans and Democrats love dipping into the cookie pot of patronage — and we must end the influence of these special interests. Consider the conservative relationship with the pharmaceutical lobby. True, this industry needs a profit incentive to develop the drugs from which we all benefit. But why should Americans subsidize the research and development that produces drugs that benefit the world? Take federal purchase agreements like that of Medicare Part D, a pernicious blend of protectionism and cronyism. If we're to be the purveyors of free markets, then we must avoid picking winners and losers. We should trust the market to do that.

5. IDENTITY POLITICS

Conservatives need to look in the mirror. We need to challenge orthodoxy, but without letting the conflict divide us. As Matt Lewis has pointed out, two top conservative media outlets aren't exactly best buddies at the moment. Karl Rove and Newt Gingrich don't seem too happy with each other. And the list goes on. Gay Marriage? Immigration? Ours is a movement divided.

We must resist the temptation to retreat into pockets of subjective ideological purity. By listening and debating, we can find the strains of consistency that bind us. And from this foundation, we'll be in a far better place to forge new consensus in our areas of division.
http://news.yahoo.com/5-hard-changes...102000206.html
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Old 04-12-2013, 11:37 AM   #2
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There's more changes Progs need to make—like actually being for progress.
Stop relabeling their policies with cover-up labels that deceive...and come honest and straight.
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Old 04-12-2013, 11:38 AM   #3
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Don't shoot me, I'm just the messenger.


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Old 04-12-2013, 11:39 AM   #4
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How is the conservative movement "divided" on immigration? Explain that to me. Conservatives are heavily against it. Where is the divide - do you mean, the 5% of the GOP base who are business owners/execs/lobbyists are dividing themselves from the entire rest of the base on immigration?


Is that what the author means?
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Old 04-12-2013, 12:14 PM   #5
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I was underwhelmed with the list. I expected some big ideas but instead it was pretty weak stuff.

1. I have no problem with the tax policy change. It makes sense to me that we shouldn't subsidize high state taxes.

2. National security policy should be driven by the threats we face, not by a deficit created by domestic largess. I'm willing to look at ways to trim the defense budget, but we shouldn't simply accept major cuts up front in the hopes of getting more meaningful entitlement reform and domestic deficit measures in the future.

3. On the surface, I agree with this, but I worry about how it would be implemented. Our war on drugs should be largely abandoned in favor of a war on violent and organized crime. If that's what he means, I'm on board.

4. Sure. Everyone agrees with this except the people who win elections.

5. I definitely agree, but only if I get to decide what policy to embrace.
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Old 04-12-2013, 12:18 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prison Bitch View Post
How is the conservative movement "divided" on immigration? Explain that to me. Conservatives are heavily against it. Where is the divide - do you mean, the 5% of the GOP base who are business owners/execs/lobbyists are dividing themselves from the entire rest of the base on immigration?


Is that what the author means?
Some conservatives want unrealistic mass deportations, some want guest workers and some want a path to citizenship. Of those that aren't just hardline deportation nuts, some want comprehensive reform with upfront amnesty of one sort or another and some want border security before making other reform decisions. Some are motivated by cheap labor, some by assimilation problems, some by establishing bad precedents, and some by the hispanic voting block.
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Old 04-12-2013, 12:24 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by patteeu View Post
Some conservatives want unrealistic mass deportations, some want guest workers and some want a path to citizenship. Of those that aren't just hardline deportation nuts, some want comprehensive reform with upfront amnesty of one sort or another and some want border security before making other reform decisions. Some are motivated by cheap labor, some by assimilation problems, some by establishing bad precedents, and some by the hispanic voting block.
There are different reasons to support or oppose anything. Hell, there are 20 different reasons why someone would be a Chiefs fan. But in general, most of us here on this forum are Chiefs fans of some stripe. There is nothing "dividing" us, not GMs or the owner or the location of the stadium or our tradition or our team colors or whatever.


Same with immigration: the GOP base generally is in agreement that (1) they're being swarmed by people hostile to their way of life, culture, language, and values and (2) they feel unsafe with open borders in the post-9/11 era. Only a DC lobbyist totally detached from average GOP voters (i.e. Grover Norquist) thinks there's really any debate on this topic.
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Old 04-12-2013, 12:34 PM   #8
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stopped reading after #1...getting rid of certain deductions is meaningless when the entire system is ****ed.

it would be like a stage 4 cancer patient getting cosmetic surgery

scrap the income based system...dont punish people for saving, investing, or having successful businesses....

switch to a consumption based system


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Old 04-12-2013, 01:44 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prison Bitch View Post
There are different reasons to support or oppose anything. Hell, there are 20 different reasons why someone would be a Chiefs fan. But in general, most of us here on this forum are Chiefs fans of some stripe. There is nothing "dividing" us, not GMs or the owner or the location of the stadium or our tradition or our team colors or whatever.


Same with immigration: the GOP base generally is in agreement that (1) they're being swarmed by people hostile to their way of life, culture, language, and values and (2) they feel unsafe with open borders in the post-9/11 era. Only a DC lobbyist totally detached from average GOP voters (i.e. Grover Norquist) thinks there's really any debate on this topic.
Yeah, bad example. You don't think Chiefs fans are divided about Geno Smith?
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Old 04-12-2013, 01:51 PM   #10
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Yeah, bad example. You don't think Chiefs fans are divided about Geno Smith?
Sure. But it doesn't make them Raider fans or make them want to bolt the Chiefs fanbase. Immigration and abortion and gun control would absolutely do that to the GOP if a serious fracture were to occur. Which hasn't, which proves my point that it doesn't really exist. At least to the extent this author alludes.
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Old 04-12-2013, 09:55 PM   #11
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If they would about Gays and Abortion it would be a step in the right direction.
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Old 04-12-2013, 10:14 PM   #12
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The dirty secret about Defense that no one who participates in the national dialogue ever mentions is that it is a state-mandated subsidy of high tech industry.
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Old 04-12-2013, 10:54 PM   #13
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If they would about Gays and Abortion it would be a step in the right direction.
Yeah. Democrats would start voting for them. Great plan.
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Old 04-13-2013, 05:38 AM   #14
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The dirty secret about Defense that no one who participates in the national dialogue ever mentions is that it is a state-mandated subsidy of high tech industry.
Even though Eisenhower warned us of the para-military-industrial complex when he left office, I've heard on MSNBC and CNN that it's actually all Bush's fault...

Go figure.

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Old 04-13-2013, 07:01 AM   #15
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This is a terrible list. As a moderate-leaning conservative, here's mine:

1. Stop blasting people, start focusing on the politics - The GOP wonders why they have a hispanic and female problem. Changing immigration and birth control/abortion policy isn't going to achieve that. It's the comments about implying or saying directly in public that hispanics are freeloaders and women are whores. And then the GOP leadership passive aggressively rejects those comments, so it sounds like they're letting it slide. Let's be real here... african-americans, hispanics, women, and gays are voting unanimously against conservatives. Stop criticizing teachers, firefighters, cops, etc... and focus instead on educational and public sector policy.

2. Choose your battles - Politics is about negotiation. It's not about jamming everything you want down somebody's throat. To get entitlement reform, you have to act like you're compromising something in exchange. But the new Republicans won't do that. Instead, they rubber stamp everything Obama puts forward and look like they're being unreasonable. And so, you have a President who should be wildly unpopular, but his popularity is only dropping slightly because the Republicans are just as unpopular.

3. Scale back the rhetoric - Last election cycle, the Republicans had a huge opportunity in that much of the general public believed government was getting out of control. But rather than take advantage, the Republicans instead chose to push an extreme platform that appeals to a microscopic part of the population. The problem is that many people want cuts in government spending, waste, and regulation. They don't want a chainsaw or machete. But that's exactly the reputation the GOP has built and so people don't embrace these ideas, they cower at them.

4. Try to change the image. Let's face it, the party's reputation is that they are old elitist white men who aren't open to people who aren't white, male, or rich. Many of the most vocal in leadership or strategists are out of touch dinosaurs. Tucker Carlson wears a bowtie. Republican leaders and strategists, often young or old, have either been so rich for so long or they grew up in money, so they're completely disconnected from the middle class. That reputation has to change.

5. Most obvious. Stop letting the religious right dictate GOP policy. They are an important vote to win, but they piss off way too many people outside of the base.
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