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Old 02-15-2013, 01:03 AM  
listopencil listopencil is offline
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Pope Benedict Seeking Immunity?

Pope Benedict to seek immunity and protection from Italian President Giorgio Napolitano on February 23 Posted on February 14, 2013 by itccs

http://itccs.org/2013/02/14/pope-ben...n-february-23/

Pope Benedict, Joseph Ratzinger, has scheduled a meeting with Italian President Giorgio Napolitano for Saturday, February 23 to discuss securing protection and immunity from prosecution from the Italian government, according to Italian media sources.

Ratzinger's meeting follows upon the apparent receipt by the Vatican of a diplomatic note from an undisclosed European government on February 4, stating its intention to issue an arrest warrant for Ratzinger, who resigned from his pontificate less than a week later.

In response to the February 23 meeting, the International Tribunal into Crimes of Church and State (ITCCS), through its field Secretary, Rev. Kevin Annett, has written to President Napolitano, asking him to refrain from assisting Ratzinger in evading justice.
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Old 02-22-2013, 04:12 PM   #151
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Originally Posted by La literatura View Post
Why are you laying this at Pope Benedict's feet? Just take the Wisconsin case for example and explain to me what Benedict failed to do to protect the deaf adults in the movie.
He may not have failed in protecting the children, but he stepped in and made sure Father Murphy was not punished or defrocked for his heinous crimes.
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Old 02-22-2013, 04:14 PM   #152
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Originally Posted by La literatura View Post
Maybe 4 or 5.



So, you think it's fair to say that Joe Paterno is a pedophile and molested young boys?
Not what I was saying. Both Joe Paterno and the Bishops in question were enablers, however, and failed to report crimes to the police, and their actions led to more children being molested, which is a bad, horrible thing.
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Old 02-22-2013, 04:14 PM   #153
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Originally Posted by mnchiefsguy View Post
I have not seen the movie, so I will not address how the movie portrays anything.

As to defrocking, it appears Benedict was not a big fan of the practice, since he personally stepped in on behalf of a priest who molested 200 deaf children:
Watch the movie. Benedict was not a big fan of defrocking the priest, yes. He didn't personally step in, though. The Archbishop sent a letter, and then the priest himself sent a letter, saying that he was old, sick, and soon dying, the alleged incidents happened years ago, long before he retired, and that he just wanted to live out the rest of his life as a retired priest.

What would defrocking the priest have done? Would it have saved any children?
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Old 02-22-2013, 04:15 PM   #154
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Originally Posted by mnchiefsguy View Post
He may not have failed in protecting the children, but he stepped in and made sure Father Murphy was not punished or defrocked for his heinous crimes.
Do you really give a **** about defrocking a priest? Are you a Catholic? Worried about the purity of the population?

And thank you for admitting that Benedict "may not have failed in protecting . . . ".
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Old 02-22-2013, 04:16 PM   #155
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Your judgment appears to be skewed, but it's not because you have kids.
Okay, we get it. The church did nothing wrong. You have made your skewed opinion clear.
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Old 02-22-2013, 04:18 PM   #156
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Originally Posted by La literatura View Post
Do you really give a **** about defrocking a priest? Are you a Catholic? Worried about the purity of the population?
I think Father Murphy should have rotted in prison for the rest of his life...or faced the chair. But instead he got to retire quietly and faced no punishment at all...at least until he reached the afterlife.
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Old 02-22-2013, 04:18 PM   #157
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Originally Posted by mnchiefsguy View Post
Not what I was saying. Both Joe Paterno and the Bishops in question were enablers, however, and failed to report crimes to the police, and their actions led to more children being molested, which is a bad, horrible thing.
I see what you were saying. Yes. Horrible. But you agree that Joe Paterno is not as legally or morally culpable of pedophilia and sex abuse as Jerry Sandusky, right?
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Old 02-22-2013, 04:20 PM   #158
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Originally Posted by mnchiefsguy View Post
I think Father Murphy should have rotted in prison for the rest of his life...or faced the chair. But instead he got to retire quietly and faced no punishment at all...at least until he reached the afterlife.
So you think it's a failure of law enforcement and prosecutors. Or are you under the illusion that Pope Benedict ordered American authorities that Murphy not being punished?
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Old 02-22-2013, 04:23 PM   #159
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Originally Posted by La literatura View Post
I see what you were saying. Yes. Horrible. But you agree that Joe Paterno is not as legally or morally culpable of pedophilia and sex abuse as Jerry Sandusky, right?
Did Joe Paterno commit the same crime as Jerry Sandusky? No. Did Joe Paterno commit a crime? Yes. Does Joe Paterno have blood on his hands? Yes.

On that note, I am bowing out of this thread. No need to keep repeating the same things over and over. I believe child molesters to be among the lowest form of life on the planet, regardless of their occupation, religious belief, etc. I believe they should be punished to the full extent of the law. If I was in a situation and knew of such acts going on, I would not enable the molester to continue his activities by transferring him to another location, I would report him to the police....seems to me to be common sense, but it is a common sense that the RCC failed to follow for over half a century.
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Old 02-22-2013, 04:28 PM   #160
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Originally Posted by mnchiefsguy View Post
Did Joe Paterno commit the same crime as Jerry Sandusky? No. Did Joe Paterno commit a crime? Yes. Does Joe Paterno have blood on his hands? Yes.

On that note, I am bowing out of this thread. No need to keep repeating the same things over and over. I believe child molesters to be among the lowest form of life on the planet, regardless of their occupation, religious belief, etc. I believe they should be punished to the full extent of the law. If I was in a situation and knew of such acts going on, I would not enable the molester to continue his activities by transferring him to another location, I would report him to the police....seems to me to be common sense, but it is a common sense that the RCC failed to follow for over half a century.
The law about duty to report has evolved. It's common sense now (and fortunately so). The problem is you are trying to impute your common sense now as common sense then for a huge organization that has its own internal and universal system of laws.
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Old 02-22-2013, 04:32 PM   #161
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Originally Posted by mnchiefsguy View Post
Okay, we get it. The church did nothing wrong. You have made your skewed opinion clear.
I think Literature is presenting a pretty reasonable and measured pov. Neither your view nor the false one you want to pin on me is measured.
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Old 02-22-2013, 04:40 PM   #162
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Originally Posted by mnchiefsguy View Post
Did Joe Paterno commit the same crime as Jerry Sandusky? No. Did Joe Paterno commit a crime? Yes. Does Joe Paterno have blood on his hands? Yes.

On that note, I am bowing out of this thread. No need to keep repeating the same things over and over. I believe child molesters to be among the lowest form of life on the planet, regardless of their occupation, religious belief, etc. I believe they should be punished to the full extent of the law. If I was in a situation and knew of such acts going on, I would not enable the molester to continue his activities by transferring him to another location, I would report him to the police....seems to me to be common sense, but it is a common sense that the RCC failed to follow for over half a century.
You apparently also believe a lot of other people who are only tangentially related to child molesters and who you believe, without a shred of evidence afaict, had enough knowledge to prevent the molestation or get the molesters locked up are the lowest form of life on the planet. You have a cartoonish understanding of this issue and you're just lashing out because you're more focused on empathizing with the victims than on understanding the details of specific actions/inactions.

Have you ever watched someone get in a car and drive away after drinking alcohol? Did you report them to the authorities or did you risk all of our lives by assuming everything would be alright. Assuming you've been aware of such a driver in the past and failed to inform the authorities, are you as bad as Leonard Little?

Edit: BTW, I don't have any problem with your harsh condemnations when they're directed toward specific priests that are guilty of molesting children. It's reprehensible. My problem with your posts in this thread is the way you generalize your accusations and apply them to "the church" or "catholics". And I don't agree with your understanding of the role of Bishops in these cases. Some bishops were more wrong than others depending on the facts in each case, but in a general sense, too many people act like all bishops who did anything short of hauling their own priests down to the local cop shop on the flimsiest of accusations are guilty of enabling molesters. That's simply nonsensical.
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Old 02-22-2013, 05:41 PM   #163
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not allowing clergy to marry helped propigate the homosexuality that has come ...
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Exactly.
Does "exactly" apply to the line I took out which was a part of that whole post you responded to?

How can denying marriage to a priest be the cause of pedophilia, when they committed it on boys?
I think this claim is illogical. They could have had affairs with women or grown men, if gay. It's happened before. Why children? Why not the opposite sex? Why do some married men who are fathers commit pedophilia including on their own children?

Pedophilia is a disorder, it has nothing to do with celibacy or marriage. Pedophiles go where there are children combined with being in a position of trust with children. The priesthood, as well as other jobs with children is where they can be found.

You're a logical guy Garcia but it doesn't wash. It's speculation.
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Old 02-22-2013, 05:50 PM   #164
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Any organization that conducts itself in such a manner would get an equal amount of criticism and scorn from me. And the people in those organizations should get prosecuted and sent to jail, in my opinion. The Catholic Church has earned its "bashing" by its own conduct. Any organization that engages in similar conduct is equally deserving of bashing.
Yeah, well somehow the bashing is lax for others. Except that school teachers that do it are now being exposed—just nothing said about the policy on "passing the trash."
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Old 02-22-2013, 05:54 PM   #165
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That is the presses problem, not mine. The amount of coverage given to the RCC does not change the evil and vile acts that occurred.
No, it's not just a problem for the press. It's a problem that others are let off the hook for a tendency to bury such events while only bashing one institution. I suspect it has more to do with anti-Catholicism—America's favorite pastime. I mean this type of thing between Prostestant's regular bashing of the RCC has never really died out from my observation. Everything from criticizing priests not marrying to what not. JMO
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