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Old 02-01-2013, 11:00 AM  
Fat Elvis Fat Elvis is offline
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Hypothetical: Chip Kelly LOVES Geno Smith

Let's say that Chip Kelly really loves Geno Smith and feels that he is the one QB in this draft who could run his offense. The Chiefs aren't as sold on Geno as some of the members of this board--in fact, they have Geno and Tyler Wilson graded fairly close together.

If the Eagles are willing to trade their #4 pick, their second this year and their first next year for our #1 pick, do you pull the trigger and pick up Wilson with the #4?

Granted, Wilson being there at 4 is not a guarantee, but it is highly likely. Maybe that is why they bring in Alex Smith, insurance.

Personally, I would do it.

I think with some proper coaching from the QB Whisperer, Wilson could be a top notch QB (note: I am a Geno fan).

We have so many holes that could be filled with those two other picks (a high 2nd rounder, and lets face it; the Eagles will suck next year too so that pick should be a high first).

If Wilson can be coached to be a franchise QB, would you trade Geno for him and two other probable starters?
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Old 02-01-2013, 01:16 PM   #76
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Okay, fine.

I think you're being myopic, but I'm not going to fault anyone who comes out off the draft with the QB they think is the best guy.

You could have most likely gotten him as well as some other picks, but it's not the end of the world.

Me? I'd take the trade confident that one of those guys is falling.
You'd be confident? I sure as **** wouldn't. By making that trade we're pretty much telegraphing to the entire draft, "HEY GUYS! WE LIKE TYLER WILSON AND WE'RE GONNA PLAY FAST AND LOOSE WITH HIM! I SURE HOPE NOBODY JUMPS AHEAD OF US AND TAKES HIM, FOILING OUR ENTIRE PLAN!"

All it takes is one team who really likes Tyler Wilson and sees what we're trying to do with the Eagles.

And remember who's picking in front of us if we trade back to #4. Oakland. They desperately need more draft picks since this draft is very deep in the middle rounds. With that #3 pick, they're dealing with a team (perhaps Buffalo or someone like that) who REALLY wants Wilson, and who knows what KC is doing. If they don't move, Wilson will be gone. That makes the Raiders pick pretty valuable. They could get a lot for moving down just a few spots. And also consider that they KNOW they'd be ****ing over KC by making that trade. The cherry on top of their perfect draft day maneuver.

Why is it true fans (not labeling you as one) say QBs are too risky, but when it comes to franchise deals like this, nothing is risky enough? Sure, show our hand! What the hell are other teams going to do? We're fiiiine. And if we miss out on Wilson, what's the worst that could happen? We just end up like St. Louis last year, who got in for waaay more than they bargained for, but that's not a big deal, is it?
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Old 02-01-2013, 01:16 PM   #77
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It would be ironic though, considering the last time (if only time?) that QB went 1-2-3 was when Andy Reid took the second guy off the board in Donovan McNabb.
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Old 02-01-2013, 01:18 PM   #78
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Originally Posted by SNR View Post
You'd be confident? I sure as **** wouldn't. By making that trade we're pretty much telegraphing to the entire draft, "HEY GUYS! WE LIKE TYLER WILSON AND WE'RE GONNA PLAY FAST AND LOOSE WITH HIM! I SURE HOPE NOBODY JUMPS AHEAD OF US AND TAKES HIM, FOILING OUR ENTIRE PLAN!"

All it takes is one team who really likes Tyler Wilson and sees what we're trying to do with the Eagles.

And remember who's picking in front of us if we trade back to #4. Oakland. They desperately need more draft picks since this draft is very deep in the middle rounds. With that #3 pick, they're dealing with a team (perhaps Buffalo or someone like that) who REALLY wants Wilson, and who knows what KC is doing. If they don't move, Wilson will be gone. That makes the Raiders pick pretty valuable. They could get a lot for moving down just a few spots. And also consider that they KNOW they'd be ****ing over KC by making that trade. The cherry on top of their perfect draft day maneuver.

Why is it true fans (not labeling you as one) say QBs are too risky, but when it comes to franchise deals like this, nothing is risky enough? Sure, show our hand! What the hell are other teams going to do? We're fiiiine. And if we miss out on Wilson, what's the worst that could happen? We just end up like St. Louis last year, who got in for waaay more than they bargained for, but that's not a big deal, is it?
We aren't telegraphing anything; in the OP Alex Smith has already been brought in for insurance.
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Old 02-01-2013, 01:19 PM   #79
saphojunkie saphojunkie is offline
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Originally Posted by SNR View Post
You'd be confident? I sure as **** wouldn't. By making that trade we're pretty much telegraphing to the entire draft, "HEY GUYS! WE LIKE TYLER WILSON AND WE'RE GONNA PLAY FAST AND LOOSE WITH HIM! I SURE HOPE NOBODY JUMPS AHEAD OF US AND TAKES HIM, FOILING OUR ENTIRE PLAN!"

All it takes is one team who really likes Tyler Wilson and sees what we're trying to do with the Eagles.

And remember who's picking in front of us if we trade back to #4. Oakland. They desperately need more draft picks since this draft is very deep in the middle rounds. With that #3 pick, they're dealing with a team (perhaps Buffalo or someone like that) who REALLY wants Wilson, and who knows what KC is doing. If they don't move, Wilson will be gone. That makes the Raiders pick pretty valuable. They could get a lot for moving down just a few spots. And also consider that they KNOW they'd be ****ing over KC by making that trade. The cherry on top of their perfect draft day maneuver.

Why is it true fans (not labeling you as one) say QBs are too risky, but when it comes to franchise deals like this, nothing is risky enough? Sure, show our hand! What the hell are other teams going to do? We're fiiiine. And if we miss out on Wilson, what's the worst that could happen? We just end up like St. Louis last year, who got in for waaay more than they bargained for, but that's not a big deal, is it?
Nah, you're right.

If we took this trade, it would have to be because we don't like any of those guys and we signed Alex Smith and are positioning ourselves for drafting a QB down the road.

Not at all what I want, but I think you're right. If you're planning to draft a QB this year, you have to take him #1 and not look back.

You win.
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Old 02-01-2013, 01:20 PM   #80
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We aren't telegraphing anything; in the OP Alex Smith has already been brought in for insurance.
Alex Smith isn't insurance.

He's your starter.
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Old 02-01-2013, 01:21 PM   #81
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We aren't telegraphing anything; in the OP Alex Smith has already been brought in for insurance.
Insurance, or, as I like to call it, "worst possible scenario".
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Old 02-01-2013, 01:21 PM   #82
saphojunkie saphojunkie is offline
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Insurance, or, as I like to call it, "worst possible scenario".
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Old 02-01-2013, 01:23 PM   #83
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Originally Posted by Fat Elvis View Post
We aren't telegraphing anything; in the OP Alex Smith has already been brought in for insurance.
If my nightmare scenario comes true and we're left with the #4 pick, Alex Smith, and no chance at Smith or Wilson, who do we take?

This draft stinks to high heaven just like 2009 did. Pretty much any player in the top 10 who's not a QB makes my dick soft. I remember feeling the exact same thing when we traded for Matt Cassel in 2009 and knew that there was no way in hell we were drafting Sanchez. I even found myself rationalizing players like Everette ****ing Brown at that slot. Coincidentally, there's another Florida State DE in this draft who's being talked about in the early stages as a top 10 pick.

That's how we got raped into Tyson Jackson. By choosing "value" over franchise players. The Cassel trade was great "value". Well, here we are again, and in this scenario we're getting great "value" by bringing in Alex Smith and missing out on possibly the only two QBs who can really be a franchise guy.

Ever hear the phrase "One in the hand is worth two in the bush?"
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I would read an entire blog of SNR breaking down athletes' musical capabilities like draft scouting reports.
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Old 02-01-2013, 01:27 PM   #84
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If my nightmare scenario comes true and we're left with the #4 pick, Alex Smith, and no chance at Smith or Wilson, who do we take?

This draft stinks to high heaven just like 2009 did. Pretty much any player in the top 10 who's not a QB makes my dick soft. I remember feeling the exact same thing when we traded for Matt Cassel in 2009 and knew that there was no way in hell we were drafting Sanchez. I even found myself rationalizing players like Everette ****ing Brown at that slot. Coincidentally, there's another Florida State DE in this draft who's being talked about in the early stages as a top 10 pick.

That's how we got raped into Tyson Jackson. By choosing "value" over franchise players.
The lesson we need to learn from 2008 and 2009 both is that you need to move up and make sure that you get your Matt Ryan or Matt Stafford, rather than rely on getting the 'next best thing' at 5 in Sanchez or "value" O- or D-linemen.

We're in the position where absolutely nobody can move ahead of us. Identify the best QB. Take the best QB. This isn't the time to gamble.
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Old 02-01-2013, 01:29 PM   #85
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The lesson we need to learn from 2008 and 2009 both is that you need to move up and make sure that you get your Matt Ryan or Matt Stafford, rather than rely on getting the 'next best thing' at 5 in Sanchez or "value" O- or D-linemen.
Yep. I really hope Clark sits Andy and John down the week before draft day and reads from Aesop's Fables the story of the GM who thought he was hot shit.
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I would read an entire blog of SNR breaking down athletes' musical capabilities like draft scouting reports.
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Old 02-01-2013, 01:30 PM   #86
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The lesson we need to learn from 2008 and 2009 both is that you need to move up and make sure that you get your Matt Ryan or Matt Stafford, rather than rely on getting the 'next best thing' at 5 in Sanchez or "value" O- or D-linemen.
I still believe that every draft has at least one QB that can be the guy.

Everyone points to the David Carr year as the counterexample, but I am not convinced he couldn't have made a better go of it with an offensive line that wasn't made of used kleenex.
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Old 02-01-2013, 01:30 PM   #87
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Originally Posted by SNR View Post
If my nightmare scenario comes true and we're left with the #4 pick, Alex Smith, and no chance at Smith or Wilson, who do we take?

This draft stinks to high heaven just like 2009 did. Pretty much any player in the top 10 who's not a QB makes my dick soft. I remember feeling the exact same thing when we traded for Matt Cassel in 2009 and knew that there was no way in hell we were drafting Sanchez. I even found myself rationalizing players like Everette ****ing Brown at that slot. Coincidentally, there's another Florida State DE in this draft who's being talked about in the early stages as a top 10 pick.

That's how we got raped into Tyson Jackson. By choosing "value" over franchise players. The Cassel trade was great "value". Well, here we are again, and in this scenario we're getting great "value" by bringing in Alex Smith and missing out on possibly the only two QBs who can really be a franchise guy.

Ever hear the phrase "One in the hand is worth two in the bush?"
Worst case scenario.....I'm taking Milliner in that spot.
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Old 02-01-2013, 01:31 PM   #88
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I still believe that every draft has at least one QB that can be the guy.

Everyone points to the David Carr year as the counterexample, but I am not convinced he couldn't have made a better go of it with an offensive line that wasn't made of used kleenex.
I agree. And the David Carr draft was the David Carr draft.

I was there for the David Carr draft. And 2013 is NOT the David Carr draft.
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I would read an entire blog of SNR breaking down athletes' musical capabilities like draft scouting reports.
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Old 02-01-2013, 01:45 PM   #89
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The rams got 2 more firsts and a second for moving down. I'd want at least that, if not more.

But, no, I wouldn't do it.
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Old 02-01-2013, 03:48 PM   #90
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JFC You DO NOT play around with the QB position. If they like Wilson that much DRAFT HIM AT 1!!! You simply can't risk another team snagging him. The extra picks mean NOTHING without a franchise level QB.
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