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Old 11-08-2012, 06:55 AM  
Direckshun Direckshun is offline
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The Conservative Media Is Lying To You

Conor Friedersdorf ****ing nails it. If you bathe in the muck of the vast majority of conservative media -- if you read FoxNews.com more than any other site, if you hail Mark Levin as brilliant, if you live and die by Drudge...

Then you are being lied to.

There are plenty of conservative sources that simply have a conservative view on the world -- the Wall Street Journal, for instance. But that's distinct from the profitable media empire that sells propaganda damn near 24/7.

Example #1, since it comes up so much in this forum: the Drudge Report.

How many times did the Drudge Report link to Nate Silver, who absolutely crushed his election predictions? Zero.
How many times did the Drudge Report link to Dick Morris? A dozen.

And yet you bought it. You might recall sitting there watching the election returns, certain that Romney would win because for months you've been inundated with Republican whores like Morris telling you what you wanted to hear -- "Obama's a paper tiger," "his campaign is getting desperate," "absolutely nobody I know is voting Obama," "I see more Romney yard signs," "look at this outlier poll that favors Romney"...

Then the results come in, largely how the vast majority of polls told us they would.

You were misinformed. Massively. And it's not just limited to election returns. On climate change, tax rates, income inequality, immigration, healthcare, energy, foreign policy (in particular the Middle East), gay rights for the longest time, and of course Obama himself... You are being sold a bullshit platter that leaves you just as misinformed as you were about the prospective election results.

The biggest offender, of course, is Fox News. Not that they're the most egregious violators of conservative propaganda, but they're by far the most pervasive and the most influential.

You trust Fox News because you believe they are simply reporting from a conservative point of view. That's not true. They are actively selling bullshit. This election and Rove's meltdown on the evening of the 6th is proof. This is an organization that is financially and professionally tied to the Republican Party. Fox News' overlords donate heavily to the GOP. Many Republican candidates for the Presidency either end up or originate as Fox News contributors. This is not an independent outlet in any shape or form, it is a direct arm of the Republican Party.

Get out of this bubble. Set Google News as your homepage. And embrace the next four years as an opportunity to find out what you actually believe, rather than simply adopting the narrative of charlatans.

http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/...d-file/264855/

How Conservative Media Lost to the MSM and Failed the Rank and File
Nate Silver was right. His ideological antagonists were wrong. And that's just the beginning of the right's self-created information disadvantage.
By Conor Friedersdorf
Nov 7 2012, 6:30 AM ET

Before rank-and-file conservatives ask, "What went wrong?", they should ask themselves a question every bit as important: "Why were we the last to realize that things were going wrong for us?"

Barack Obama just trounced a Republican opponent for the second time. But unlike four years ago, when most conservatives saw it coming, Tuesday's result was, for them, an unpleasant surprise. So many on the right had predicted a Mitt Romney victory, or even a blowout -- Dick Morris, George Will, and Michael Barone all predicted the GOP would break 300 electoral votes. Joe Scarborough scoffed at the notion that the election was anything other than a toss-up. Peggy Noonan insisted that those predicting an Obama victory were ignoring the world around them. Even Karl Rove, supposed political genius, missed the bulls-eye. These voices drove the coverage on Fox News, talk radio, the Drudge Report, and conservative blogs.

Those audiences were misinformed.

Outside the conservative media, the narrative was completely different. Its driving force was Nate Silver, whose performance forecasting Election '08 gave him credibility as he daily explained why his model showed that President Obama enjoyed a very good chance of being reelected. Other experts echoed his findings. Readers of The New York Times, The Atlantic, and other "mainstream media" sites besides knew the expert predictions, which have been largely born out. The conclusions of experts are not sacrosanct. But Silver's expertise was always a better bet than relying on ideological hacks like Morris or the anecdotal impressions of Noonan.


Sure, Silver could've wound up wrong. But people who rejected the possibility of his being right? They were operating at a self-imposed information disadvantage.

Conservatives should be familiar with its contours. For years, they've been arguing that liberal control of media and academia confers one advantage: Folks on the right can't help but be familiar with the thinking of liberals, whereas leftists can operate entirely within a liberal cocoon. This analysis was offered to explain why liberal ideas were growing weaker and would be defeated.

Today?

It is easy to close oneself off inside a conservative echo chamber. And right-leaning outlets like Fox News and Rush Limbaugh's show are far more intellectually closed than CNN or public radio. If you're a rank-and-file conservative, you're probably ready to acknowledge that ideologically friendly media didn't accurately inform you about Election 2012. Some pundits engaged in wishful thinking; others feigned confidence in hopes that it would be a self-fulfilling prophecy; still others decided it was smart to keep telling right-leaning audiences what they wanted to hear.

But guess what?

You haven't just been misinformed about the horse race. Since the very beginning of the election cycle, conservative media has been failing you. With a few exceptions, they haven't tried to rigorously tell you the truth, or even to bring you intellectually honest opinion. What they've done instead helps to explain why the right failed to triumph in a very winnable election.

Why do you keep putting up with it?

Conservatives were at a disadvantage because Romney supporters like Jennifer Rubin and Hugh Hewitt saw it as their duty to spin constantly for their favored candidate rather than being frank about his strengths and weaknesses. What conservative Washington Post readers got, when they traded in Dave Weigel for Rubin, was a lot more hackery and a lot less informed about the presidential election.

Conservatives were at an information disadvantage because so many right-leaning outlets wasted time on stories the rest of America dismissed as nonsense. WorldNetDaily brought you birtherism. Forbes brought you Kenyan anti-colonialism. National Review obsessed about an imaginary rejection of American exceptionalism, misrepresenting an Obama quote in the process, and Andy McCarthy was interviewed widely about his theory that Obama, aka the Drone Warrior in Chief, allied himself with our Islamist enemies in a "Grand Jihad" against America. Seriously?

Conservatives were at a disadvantage because their information elites pandered in the most cynical, self-defeating ways, treating would-be candidates like Sarah Palin and Herman Cain as if they were plausible presidents rather than national jokes who'd lose worse than George McGovern.

How many months were wasted on them?

How many hours of Glenn Beck conspiracy theories did Fox News broadcast to its viewers? How many hours of transparently mindless Sean Hannity content is still broadcast daily? Why don't Americans trust Republicans on foreign policy as they once did? In part because conservatism hasn't grappled with the foreign-policy failures of George W. Bush. A conspiracy of silence surrounds the subject. Romney could neither run on the man's record nor repudiate it. The most damaging Romney gaffe of the campaign, where he talked about how the 47 percent of Americans who pay no income taxes are a lost cause for Republicans? Either he was unaware that many of those people are Republican voters, or was pandering to GOP donors who are misinformed. Either way, bad information within the conservative movement was to blame.

In conservative fantasy-land, Richard Nixon was a champion of ideological conservatism, tax cuts are the only way to raise revenue, adding neoconservatives to a foreign-policy team reassures American voters, Benghazi was a winning campaign issue, Clint Eastwood's convention speech was a brilliant triumph, and Obama's America is a place where black kids can beat up white kids with impunity. Most conservative pundits know better than this nonsense -- not that they speak up against it. They see criticizing their own side as a sign of disloyalty. I see a coalition that has lost all perspective, partly because there's no cost to broadcasting or publishing inane bullshit. In fact, it's often very profitable. A lot of cynical people have gotten rich broadcasting and publishing red meat for movement conservative consumption.

On the biggest political story of the year, the conservative media just got its ass handed to it by the mainstream media. And movement conservatives, who believe the MSM is more biased and less rigorous than their alternatives, have no way to explain how their trusted outlets got it wrong, while the New York Times got it right. Hint: The Times hired the most rigorous forecaster it could find.

It ought to be an eye-opening moment.

But I expect that it'll be quickly forgotten, that none of the conservatives who touted a polling conspiracy will be discredited, and that the right will continue to operate at an information disadvantage. After all, it's not like they'll trust the analysis of a non-conservative like me more than the numerous fellow conservatives who constantly tell them things that turn out not to be true.
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Old 11-08-2012, 02:00 PM   #136
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Call me close minded, but I will never be convinced that any of these liberal media hacks are as hateful and venemous as Coulter.
You're closed minded.

Bill Maher is every bit as hateful and venomous as Ann Coulter. The shit he says and does to people that have committed no crime but to disagree with him is beyond the pale.

You're either not well-versed in the vitriol extolled by your side of the aisle, or you're just deaf to it.
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Old 11-08-2012, 02:01 PM   #137
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Originally Posted by bsp4444 View Post
Call me close minded, but I will never be convinced that any of these liberal media hacks are as hateful and venemous as Coulter.
Perhaps you think they're more hateful, because you already have bias toward one side?
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Old 11-08-2012, 02:01 PM   #138
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Sure, it sounds good. The problem is that our liberty is neither a gift from God nor an indulgence of the government.

And if you think that's a minor trifle go witness KILLER CLOWN attempting to rewrite the Constitution in the Beck thread.
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Old 11-08-2012, 02:02 PM   #139
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Originally Posted by bsp4444 View Post
Call me close minded, but I will never be convinced that any of these liberal media hacks are as hateful and venemous as Coulter.
Because conservatives deserve it when your hacks get hateful and venomous, amirite?

Bill Maher two days ago referring to Karl Rove on FoxNews' election coverage:

Quote:
"It was a little [like] Hitler's bunker, wasn't it?" Maher quipped, referring to the location of the Nazi ruler's suicide. "I wanted to rush in with cyanide capsules there. I thought he was going to say, 'I do not want to live in a world without National Socialism.' Okay, Mrs. Goebbels."
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Old 11-08-2012, 02:04 PM   #140
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Originally Posted by listopencil View Post
Sure, it sounds good. The problem is that our liberty is neither a gift from God nor an indulgence of the government.
Are they inalienable or not? If they are, then there's nothing wrong with the religious equating that to a gift from God even if you'd rather say they just arise from nature. It's a belief vs belief argument and you can't win that one. If they aren't, you've got an issue with the basic tenets of our country.
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Old 11-08-2012, 02:05 PM   #141
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Originally Posted by patteeu View Post
Because conservatives deserve it when your hacks get hateful and venomous, amirite?

Bill Maher two days ago referring to Karl Rove on FoxNews' election coverage:
Yeah, I'm sorry, but there's nobody on either side that beats Bill Maher.

Any time a liberal backs that guy, they are of no use to me. There isn't room for people like Bill Maher in an environment that hopes to reasonably debate anything.

Coulter is extremist and certainly vicious in her criticisms. Maher, on the other hand, I believe genuinely loathes the people he criticizes. I feel he sees no human worth in people that disagree with him.

He's the worst of the worst. But of course, the Libs swear up and down that they don't have anyone like that damn awful blonde woman...
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Old 11-08-2012, 03:00 PM   #142
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Originally Posted by patteeu View Post
Are they inalienable or not? If they are, then there's nothing wrong with the religious equating that to a gift from God even if you'd rather say they just arise from nature. It's a belief vs belief argument and you can't win that one. If they aren't, you've got an issue with the basic tenets of our country.
Not true. That phrase comes from the Declaration Of Independence. Our nation was founded upon the Constitution. Our liberty is given to us by "We the people".
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Old 11-08-2012, 03:00 PM   #143
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Bill Maher is the spokesmen for all that is Democratic. There is no one on the Republican side in media with the marshaling power of Bill Maher.
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Old 11-08-2012, 03:04 PM   #144
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Not true. That phrase comes from the Declaration Of Independence. Our nation was founded upon the Constitution. Our liberty is given to us by "We the people".
For instance, based on the Declaration Of Independence, the South was within its rights to secede from the Union. They could use Biblical references to slavery in that case to form a reasonable argument against emancipation even.
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Old 11-08-2012, 03:09 PM   #145
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Not true. That phrase comes from the Declaration Of Independence. Our nation was founded upon the Constitution. Our liberty is given to us by "We the people".
That's a misreading of the philosophical underpinnings of our founding, IMO.
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Old 11-08-2012, 03:14 PM   #146
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That's a misreading of the philosophical underpinnings of our founding, IMO.
Not at all. They had experience dealing with countries where State and Church were mixed. They were well aware of the power of churches in Europe and rule by divine right. They wanted the law to be based on the will of the people, to self govern as much as is realistically possible. That is a common theme running through our Constitution. That's why they chose a republic.
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Old 11-08-2012, 03:18 PM   #147
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Too bad the polls weren't located at Chick-Fil-A.
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Old 11-08-2012, 03:20 PM   #148
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Perhaps you think they're more hateful, because you already have bias toward one side?
I think this is absolutely the case.
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Old 11-08-2012, 03:21 PM   #149
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Originally Posted by patteeu View Post
That's a misreading of the philosophical underpinnings of our founding, IMO.

There a lot of quotes available from John Adams. Some of them seem to outright condemn religion and some of them are more abiding of it. Digging through he seems to acknowledge a person's right to engage in religious practices of their choice while decrying any existence of it in formal government policy.
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Old 11-08-2012, 03:27 PM   #150
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I think this is absolutely the case.
No worries if that's the case. Everybody's been there. Acknowledging your own bias indicates better understanding of both sides...
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