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Old 10-27-2012, 09:53 PM  
Al Bundy Al Bundy is offline
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Official 2012-2013 NBA Thread

Looks like James Harden has been To the Rockets for Jeremey Lamb, Kevin Martin and future picks. Plus... this is a general NBA thread.
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Old 10-28-2012, 02:03 AM   #91
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Originally Posted by okcchief View Post
Its not about one year. Besides, how do you know they are staying pat with this lineup? Do they not have multiple attractive picks and a huge expiring contract to dump?
Considering there's like two days until the season starts, this is pretty much their lineup to start this year. What they do in the future is up in the air now, but they obviously won't be adding back a player that can impact the game like Harden can any time soon.
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Old 10-28-2012, 02:06 AM   #92
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I respect Presti having the guts to make this decision. I'm also not surprised. I said all along I didn't think OKC would keep all 4 of their key players....cost too much both in $ and flexibility. On the other hand, I don't begrudge Harden for wanting his market value. No bad guys here IMO, and a pretty good deal for both sides. It wouldn't surprise me if we see a really nice come back year out of Kevin Martin now. He'll be re-energized, and he's a good player when healthy. Perhaps the key player now this season is Maynor.
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Old 10-28-2012, 02:07 AM   #93
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Originally Posted by KC_Connection View Post
Houston's not winning a championship any time soon regardless of anything they do. The goals there are lower (as they are for about 80% of the NBA).
which has nothing to do with my point...harden isn't a real #1

if they manage to acquire one sometime, he'd a be a very good #2...regardless, OKC made a great trade getting a lottery protected pick, another first, a proven scorer, and a promising rookie

for the 3rd best player on their team
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Old 10-28-2012, 02:11 AM   #94
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Originally Posted by the Talking Can View Post
which has nothing to do with my point...harden isn't a real #1
For OKC, no, he wasn't. For half the teams in the NBA that don't have championship aspirations, yes, he is. And now he's going to be paid like it.


Quote:
if they manage to acquire one sometime, he'd a be a very good #2...regardless, OKC made a great trade getting a lottery protected pick, another first, a proven scorer, and a promising rookie

for the 3rd best player on their team
There's nothing great about trading one of the most essential players on your prospective championship team for Kevin Martin and a bunch of lottery tickets to save some money. Keep him this year and go out and win a championship...that's what the point of all this is.
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Old 10-28-2012, 02:18 AM   #95
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Originally Posted by KC_Connection View Post
For OKC, no, he wasn't. For half the teams in the NBA that don't have championship aspirations, yes, he is. And now he's going to be paid like it.



There's nothing great about trading one of the most essential players on your prospective championship team for Kevin Martin and a bunch of lottery tickets to save some money. Keep him this year and go out and win a championship...that's what the point of all this is.
I've watched every game this team and Harden has played since they have been here. This team was not beating the Heat this year with or without Harden. They got a great return and will still be in the discussion for the next 4 years at least. It's not quite the tragedy you make it out to be
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Old 10-28-2012, 02:21 AM   #96
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Originally Posted by okcchief View Post
I've watched every game this team and Harden has played since they have been here. This team was not beating the Heat this year with or without Harden. They got a great return and will still be in the discussion for the next 4 years at least. It's not quite the tragedy you make it out to be
Why couldn't they have beat the Heat? They got one game off them last summer and played three other incredibly competitive games that went right down to the wire (within a possession or two of going the other way). OKC was very much a team that could have won a championship this year. Downgrading on one of their most important players will not help them do that.
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Old 10-28-2012, 02:22 AM   #97
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If Harden was as good as you think OKC would have shinny rings right now. He played like complete horse shit in the finals and really only had 3 good playoff games.
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Old 10-28-2012, 02:31 AM   #98
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Originally Posted by the Talking Can View Post
he's not eligible for an $80 mill contract, as i understand it...where are you getting that number?
He was only eligible for a 4 year contract extension with OKC, but he can get a 5 year deal with Houston. It's going to be a max 5 for 80 deal.

OKC couldn't give him the 5 year deal because Westbrook already had the 5 year max extension and you're only allowed one per the CBA.
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Old 10-28-2012, 02:32 AM   #99
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Originally Posted by okcchief View Post
If Harden was as good as you think OKC would have shinny rings right now. He played like complete horse shit in the finals and really only had 3 good playoff games.
And if Presti made this decision based on the small sample size of five NBA Finals games, he's a much worse GM than I think he is. But I don't think he did.

BTW, the fact that OKC started losing in the postseason when Harden started playing poorly should probably give you an inkling as to what his importance was to that team.
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Old 10-28-2012, 02:36 AM   #100
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None of this is to say that there isn't a rationale behind this deal for OKC in the salary cap era, but taking a serious step back and breaking up your core the year after reaching the NBA Finals is an odd decision to make just to get some draft picks and save some money.
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Old 10-28-2012, 02:41 AM   #101
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Originally Posted by okcchief View Post
If Harden was as good as you think OKC would have shinny rings right now. He played like complete horse shit in the finals and really only had 3 good playoff games.
If Brooks had played Perkins less.........

Harden is still only 23, very reasonable to think he improves this season with more experience. It hurt your chances this year, but it's an understandable decision IMO.
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Old 10-28-2012, 02:45 AM   #102
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If Harden was as good as you think OKC would have shinny rings right now. He played like complete horse shit in the finals and really only had 3 good playoff games.
That's an irrational way to look at it. Harden had an off series. Doesn't mean he isn't a good player.

At the end of the day, I think he'll be another Joe Johnson. While good, he isn't a 5/80MM type of player.
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Old 10-28-2012, 02:48 AM   #103
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None of this is to say that there isn't a rationale behind this deal for OKC in the salary cap era, but taking a serious step back and breaking up your core the year after reaching the NBA Finals is an odd decision to make just to get some draft picks and save some money.
We will see where OKC and Harden are in 3 years.

OKC is still a championship contender. Maynor is back, Kevin Martin like him or not can put up 20 a night and play no defense like Harden,, and PJ3 and Lamb have lots of potential. Oh yeah, we have KD and Russ.
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Old 10-28-2012, 03:00 AM   #104
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Originally Posted by okcchief View Post
We will see where OKC and Harden are in 3 years.

OKC is still a championship contender. Maynor is back, Kevin Martin like him or not can put up 20 a night and play no defense like Harden,, and PJ3 and Lamb have lots of potential. Oh yeah, we have KD and Russ.
Nobody's saying they're bad or suddenly future-less. They're just saying they took a step back by downgrading from a significant core piece. Kevin Martin isn't even half the player that Harden is.
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Old 10-28-2012, 08:52 AM   #105
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And if Presti made this decision based on the small sample size of five NBA Finals games, he's a much worse GM than I think he is. But I don't think he did.

BTW, the fact that OKC started losing in the postseason when Harden started playing poorly should probably give you an inkling as to what his importance was to that team.
Of course he didn't make it off a small sample size. Every player for the Thunder with the exception of Durant, Westbrook and Collison played like junk in the finals. brooks did a poor job of managing the lineup in the finals. Im not putting the finals on Harden. im just saying he's not a max player. You are looking at a stat and not taking into account every game they play. Harden and Ibaka, for that matter, haven't been consistent enough through 82 games and playoffs to warrant max deals. Harden is a nice player and will continue to get better.

Maynor is back and very important to this team. Harden's role last year was a backup point guard more or less. In previous seasons he was asked to be a spot up shooter a lot more. Kevin Martin will be better in that type of role. PJ3 and Lamb also provide scoring potential. I believe they may take a step back initially, but by years end they'll be pretty tough.

Yes, OKC could have easily won the Finals LAST year, but the Lakers and Heat made significant moves THIS year. This roster needed to be tweaked to stay with them. It may not take effect immediately, but I'm ok with the hand they are sitting.

The bottom line is I was picking a Lakers/ Heat final before and after this.
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