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Old 03-18-2012, 06:39 PM  
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Eric Holder: "We must brainwash people on guns."

This video is hilarious, considering this is a guy that's directly behind one of the most biggest gun/arms scandals in the nation's history.



Breitbart.com has uncovered video from 1995 of then-U.S. Attorney Eric Holder announcing a public campaign to "really brainwash people into thinking about guns in a vastly different way."

Holder was addressing the Woman's National Democratic Club. In his remarks, broadcast by CSPAN 2, he explained that he intended to use anti-smoking campaigns as his model to "change the hearts and minds of people in Washington, DC" about guns.

"What we need to do is change the way in which people think about guns, especially young people, and make it something that's not cool, that it's not acceptable, it's not hip to carry a gun anymore, in the way in which we changed our attitudes about cigarettes."

Holder added that he had asked advertising agencies in the nation's capital to assist by making anti-gun ads rather than commercials "that make me buy things that I don't really need." He had also approached local newspapers and television stations, he said, asking them to devote prime space and time, respectively, to his anti-gun campaign.

Local political leaders and celebrities, Holder said, including Mayor Marion Barry and Jesse Jackson, had been asked to help. In addition, he reported, he had asked the local school board to make the anti-gun message a part of "every day, every school, and every level."

Despite strict gun control efforts, Washington, DC was and remains one of the nation's most dangerous cities for gun violence, though crime has abated somewhat since the 1990s.

Holder went on to become Deputy Attorney General in the Clinton administration, and currently serves as Attorney General in the Obama Administration.

The video of Holder's remarks was uncovered by Breitbart.com contributor Charles C. Johnson.
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Old 03-19-2012, 12:14 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trndobrd View Post
That the AG is responsible for taking a position on Constitutional issues and arguing the same before the various Federal Courts is a given. Even the most casual observer can see that was not the subject of Mr. Holder's comments.

Are you suggesting that Mr. Holder's statements dealt with promoting a particular view on the 2nd Ammendment to the youth of the nation during 'The Fresh Prince' and 'Martin' that position? That using 'entertainers and atheletes' are the optimal spokespersons to represent the United States on Constitutional issues.

errr...this speech is from 1995, right, LONG before he was the AG? I haven't (and can't at the moment) watch the video, so perhaps I'm missing something, but...?
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Old 03-19-2012, 12:14 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by Literature View Post
What if we think young black kids shooting each other is a good thing?
it's really sad and pathetic that you think that way...
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Old 03-19-2012, 12:16 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by dirk digler View Post
If everyone was honest who really has a problem with what he is saying? Do we really want kids thinking it is cool to carry around guns and shoot people?

This isn't about taking away anyone's 2nd amendment rights it is about changing the mindset of young people away from using violence especially in the African-American community.

I don't see anything controversial with what he said.
Because that would be inferring that the only use for a gun is to shoot people. That's just not true. You're asking to change a generational mindset to an idea that is incredibly biased.

Cars kill about twice as many people every year than firearms.

Would it be logical to say, "What we need to do is change the way in which people think about cars, especially young people, and make it something that's not cool, that it's not acceptable, it's not hip to drive cars anymore."

There are around 350M firearms estimated in the US. Compared to 230M estimated vehicles.

Yet, vehicle deaths are almost seen as acceptable loss, while firearms are a tool of Satan and you would like everyone everywhere to think they're bad.

This is absolutely controversial.
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Old 03-19-2012, 12:40 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KC Fish View Post
Because that would be inferring that the only use for a gun is to shoot people. That's just not true. You're asking to change a generational mindset to an idea that is incredibly biased.

Cars kill about twice as many people every year than firearms.

Would it be logical to say, "What we need to do is change the way in which people think about cars, especially young people, and make it something that's not cool, that it's not acceptable, it's not hip to drive cars anymore."

There are around 350M firearms estimated in the US. Compared to 230M estimated vehicles.

Yet, vehicle deaths are almost seen as acceptable loss, while firearms are a tool of Satan and you would like everyone everywhere to think they're bad.

This is absolutely controversial.
well, handguns generally are for shooting people unless you're an expert woodsman and hunter like bwana or an avid target shooter...

most handguns aren't suitable for hunting anything other than humans at close range...

having said all that i don't see any need to unduly restrict handgun ownership and use outside of densely populated urban areas...

the problem is that guns found on gang members and the like need to be a basis for locking them up, which is hard to do if carrying a gun is legal...
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Old 03-19-2012, 12:43 PM   #35
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Look at that idiot. He looks like a 70's sitcom slapdick. obama should be tried for treason just for appointing this incompetent bastard.
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Old 03-19-2012, 12:47 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by vailpass View Post
Look at that idiot. He looks like a 70's sitcom slapdick. obama should be tried for treason just for appointing this incompetent bastard.
treason?

really?

seriously?

and besides, i happened to like some of that 70's sitcom slapdick stuff...
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Old 03-19-2012, 12:53 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by go bowe View Post
well, handguns generally are for shooting people unless you're an expert woodsman and hunter like bwana or an avid target shooter...

most handguns aren't suitable for hunting anything other than humans at close range...

having said all that i don't see any need to unduly restrict handgun ownership and use outside of densely populated urban areas...

the problem is that guns found on gang members and the like need to be a basis for locking them up, which is hard to do if carrying a gun is legal...
Hunting isn't the only other use though. Some people enjoy target shooting. Millions of people safely rely on them for home and personal defense.

Demonizing guns is treating a symptom of the problem, instead of the source. Take away the guns, and the violence still remains. The weapon of choice would simply shift to something else.

Do you honestly think that if guns were banned or if youth were brainwashed into thinking they were bad, that there would be a great reduction in gang violence? The people using guns strictly for violence aren't going to care about legality or public indoctrination. If they can't buy a gun legally, they'll simply purchase one illegally or even make one themselves. Which is pretty simple to do.
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Old 03-19-2012, 12:59 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KC Fish View Post
Because that would be inferring that the only use for a gun is to shoot people. That's just not true. You're asking to change a generational mindset to an idea that is incredibly biased.

Cars kill about twice as many people every year than firearms.

Would it be logical to say, "What we need to do is change the way in which people think about cars, especially young people, and make it something that's not cool, that it's not acceptable, it's not hip to drive cars anymore."

There are around 350M firearms estimated in the US. Compared to 230M estimated vehicles.

Yet, vehicle deaths are almost seen as acceptable loss, while firearms are a tool of Satan and you would like everyone everywhere to think they're bad.

This is absolutely controversial.
Then you are not being honest. The only reason why a young person is carrying a handgun is to shoot someone. There is no other reason. Which is what he is talking about.

As far as comparing cars to guns well that is stupid IMHO. It is all about intent. Teenagers don't use their car as a weapon to kill someone on purpose. They kill people or themselves with their cars out of their own stupidity and carelessness.
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Old 03-19-2012, 01:07 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by dirk digler View Post
Then you are not being honest. The only reason why a young person is carrying a handgun is to shoot someone. There is no other reason. Which is what he is talking about.

As far as comparing cars to guns well that is stupid IMHO. It is all about intent. Teenagers don't use their car as a weapon to kill someone on purpose. They kill people or themselves with their cars out of their own stupidity and carelessness.
The only reason someone carries a gun is to shoot someone? GTFOH
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Old 03-19-2012, 01:10 PM   #40
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Originally Posted by Bewbies View Post
The only reason someone carries a gun is to shoot someone? GTFOH
I said young person carrying a handgun not everyone.
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Old 03-19-2012, 01:16 PM   #41
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Originally Posted by KC Fish View Post
Hunting isn't the only other use though. Some people enjoy target shooting. Millions of people safely rely on them for home and personal defense.

Demonizing guns is treating a symptom of the problem, instead of the source. Take away the guns, and the violence still remains. The weapon of choice would simply shift to something else.

Do you honestly think that if guns were banned or if youth were brainwashed into thinking they were bad, that there would be a great reduction in gang violence? The people using guns strictly for violence aren't going to care about legality or public indoctrination. If they can't buy a gun legally, they'll simply purchase one illegally or even make one themselves. Which is pretty simple to do.
i mentioned target shooting as a legitimate basis to own and use a handgun and i agree with what you say...

wrt your question, no of course not, gang violence has been a part of american life for generations and was a problem long before handguns became easily obtainable...

and handguns are definitely easy for criminals to obtain nowadays, what i was suggesting that often the only crime that can be pinned on gangsters is possession of a handgun and removing all restrictions would remove that essential law enforcement tool...

it's a hard decision as to where to draw the line...
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Old 03-19-2012, 01:16 PM   #42
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Old 03-19-2012, 01:19 PM   #43
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Originally Posted by go bowe View Post
treason?

really?

seriously?

and besides, i happened to like some of that 70's sitcom slapdick stuff...
I like those shows too. Every time I see Holder all I can think of is Detective Harris on The Barney Miller show. Except Harris was smarter and didn't hate the American way of life.
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Old 03-19-2012, 01:23 PM   #44
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I like those shows too. Every time I see Holder all I can think of is Detective Harris on The Barney Miller show. Except Harris was smarter and didn't hate the American way of life.
well, it wasn't very fashionable back then to publicize one's hatred of the american way of life...

so who knows? detective harris may have been a communist in drag or a serial killer that only killed americans living their way of life...
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Old 03-19-2012, 01:24 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by dirk digler View Post
Then you are not being honest. The only reason why a young person is carrying a handgun is to shoot someone. There is no other reason. Which is what he is talking about.

As far as comparing cars to guns well that is stupid IMHO. It is all about intent. Teenagers don't use their car as a weapon to kill someone on purpose. They kill people or themselves with their cars out of their own stupidity and carelessness.
It's already illegal for a young person to own a handgun. It has been for a long time. A young person owning a handgun is already breaking the law. Creating an after school special telling that child that guns are evil is going to have zero affect.

We already have a great deal of data over a considerable time frame showing that gun control laws do not lower crime rates, and in the high majority of cases, crime rates rise in locations with the most strict gun control laws. Washington D.C. and England are good examples of this.

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The issue of continued high crime is especially disconcerting when comparing the crime rates in these gun control Utopias to the crime rates in areas that have not gone the route of extreme gun control. In almost all cases, the areas in the U.S. with the fewest gun control laws and highest gun ownership also have the lowest crime levels. One of the most interesting comparisons is that of Washington, D.C. with its gun bans since the 1970s, and the D.C. suburbs in Virginia, which has very little gun control. Even though gun ownership is high and there are few gun control laws in the Virginia suburbs of D.C., gun control has reached extreme levels and the crime rate is much higher across the state line where gun ownership is almost non-existent.

Some try to turn this argument around, blaming crime problems in Washington, D.C. on weak gun laws in Virginia, but the reality is that Virginia with all of its guns and few laws does not have the crime problem that plagues Washington, D.C. and its gun bans. If guns are the problem, then why is it that those areas with the most guns have the lowest crime levels? If one believes that gun control lowers crime and violence and thus guns are responsible, then these aforementioned facts are counterintuitive to the logic of gun control. This is especially true of the 31 states that have enacted concealed carry laws. Even though groups like Handgun Control, Inc. continually attacked such measures in saying that they will lead to higher crime, "blood on our streets," and "wild west shootouts," just the opposite has occurred. Those states that have enacted concealed carry measures have seen their crime rates immediately fall and continue to do so at rates in most cases faster than the national average. One of the best examples is Florida. Prior to their enactment of concealed carry laws in the late 1980s, the crime rate in Florida was higher than the national average. However, following the enactment of the concealed carry law their crime immediately began to drop and has continued to do so today. In fact, today the crime levels in Florida are considerably lower than the national average. Additionally, the U.S. state with the lowest crime rate, Vermont, also happens to be the state with the fewest gun control laws and they allow all law-abiding citizens to carry concealed weapons.

The simple fact is that those areas in the U.S. with the fewest gun restrictions and highest gun ownership rates also have the lowest crime rates. Even a recent study published in the Journal of the American Medical Association, which is well known for its anti-gun bias, reported that the 1994 Brady Law has not had a discernable impact on homicide or suicide rates. The results from this study are completely counter to claims by gun control groups, like Handgun Control, Inc., which have repeatedly claimed that such laws have saved thousands of lives. This aforementioned study also pointed out that crime has been falling for a decade now and it began to fall over three years prior to the passage of the Brady Law. Furthermore, there was no increase in the rate of crime reduction after passage of the Brady Law. In essence, the Brady Law has done nothing to lower crime or violence. Again, this is a continuation of mounting evidence that gun control schemes have no relation to crime or violence prevention.

Based on the crime rates in areas with the most and fewest gun control laws, one could argue that gun control schemes contribute to higher crime rates. There is much evidence to support this hypothesis and similar results can be found in international examples. Just recently, the violent crime levels in England have risen during the past year by more than 15%. These results represent a continuation of crime problems in England that have been encountered since their gun bans took affect in the mid 1990s. The home invasion, burglary, robbery, and a wide range of other crime rates in England now exceed that of the U.S. Only murder and rape remain higher in the U.S., with the difference now being relatively minor and the gap is steadily closing. Even staunchly anti-gun journalist Dan Rather of CBS called England "one the most violent urban societies in the Western world." As many people are aware, England has long been an example cited by gun control supporters as having good gun control laws and a role model for the U.S.

Furthermore, one would have to place blame on an inanimate object, instead of the individual. Such a simplistic view would also have to make the ludicrous assumption that criminals will give up their already illegal guns. Another motivation that is common is the "feel good" factor. I have encountered many gun control supporters that have their hearts in the right place. Unfortunately, they either don't understand the reasons behind crime, they do not want to face the true causes of crime, or they feel helpless in their ability to respond. Therefore, they support unsophisticated gun control laws that have nothing to do with the criminals, but are instead focused on gun ownership, which few such gun control supporters can understand or comprehend. In doing so, they feel good about themselves and their one-dimensional accomplishments, but the reality is that such measures do not reduce crime and in fact probably causes an increase.
Source: http://www.american-partisan.com/cols/blanks/081400.htm
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