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Old 03-20-2009, 09:15 PM  
keg in kc keg in kc is offline
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Star Wars: The Old Republic

Don't believe there's a dedicated thread, and since they're starting to release information now, I figure it's time for one.

Last edited by keg in kc; 12-18-2012 at 11:12 AM..
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Old 06-03-2009, 12:16 PM   #46
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E3 2009: Star Wars: The Old Republic Preview

By Ryan Scott | Jun 2, 2009

We get a first-hand walkthrough of BioWare's upcoming Star Wars MMO.

Spiffy: An actual fun Star Wars online role-playing game; action that looks like it amounts to more than passive math.

Iffy:It's got a hell of a competitor in World of Warcraft; can't get here fast enough.

BioWare's epic third Knights of the Old Republic game -- this one a massively multiplayer online RPG -- takes players to a time roughly 4,000 years before George Lucas' dual film trilogy (and 300 years past the previous KotOR games). Republic forces tangle with the evil Sith Empire, and players choose sides in the mounting civil war. BioWare alleges unique story paths for each character class, with zero repeated content between Republic and Imperial character archetypes.

What's New for E3?

Besides one of the most beautiful cinematic trailers I've ever seen -- which depicts Sith forces infiltrating a Jedi temple and laying waste to the place before general hell breaks loose -- The Old Republic looks like the real deal. This is the first time anyone's seen it in action, and the push toward non-photorealistic art (senior producer Dallas Dickinson describes TOR's look as "stylized realism") means a scalability-minded developer who thought twice about relegating the game to Age of Conan hell.

The mantra: Story drives choice, and choice drives action. After a brief demonstration of the previously revealed Bounty Hunter class (a ranged terror who packs everything from grenades to wrist-mounted flamethrowers) and the just-in-for E3 Smuggler (an opportunist who makes shrewd use of cover terrain, and resorts to dirty kick-in-the-balls tactics when fighting up-close), Dickinson treated the audience to a show of the series' trademark ethical dilemmas -- sans save button.

A player-driven Dark Jedi (one that the developers were hesitant to definitively identify as such) commandeered a mid-transit ship, on orders to kill its treasonous captain. The choice was ours: permanently relieve him from duty, or show him our soft side? The jaded collective of critics chose the former, which resulted in a display of lightsaber-powered violence that quickly coerced the crew to his side. Chaos ensued, driving said Sith (named -- amusingly enough -- Darth Awesome) and his Bounty Hunter pal into an impromptu defense against invading Jedi. The expected hotbar of MMO moves guided the combat, though slick speed bursts, blaster bolt blockage, and flat-out badass lightsaber duels (which haven't looked this good since the movies themselves) afforded TOR a flair not often glimpsed in this me-too genre. As the Jedi fell, the victorious Sith snatched his prey's lightsaber, and immediately lit it up for dual-saber action.

If I were Star Wars Galaxies, I'd just go ahead and throw myself off the Cloud City catwalk.
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Old 06-03-2009, 01:49 PM   #47
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Originally Posted by keg in kc View Post
They all get repetitive, because every character is essentially just doing the same thing over and over, using different class mechanics.

The idea of making story a pillar of the game could feasibly be very interesting, particularly if different classes proceed in different ways.

The thing that I wonder is how interested hardcore mmo gamers will be in that story element, and in the cinematic presentation and voiceover. Because generally they don't even bother to read quest text, and I've known tons of people over the years that think quests in general are just a pain in the ass, and all they do is grind, pvp and raid.

I'm fairly hardcore myself, but I'm really looking forward to something in a game that goes beyond just killing the same things over and over for xp, loot or gear...
I'd really like to see a MMORPG that captures the complex storylines that I've seen in the text-based RPGs (Muds). A game I played and staffed on (www.armageddon.org) had incredible story arcs in a persistent game world. Many of these story arcs were inspired by player actions, but some were decided on staff side. One example: the game is set up around two warring cities, Allanak and Tuluk. Through ingame actions and play, Allanak invaded and occupied Tuluk for about 3 real-life years (50 or so ingame years). Tuluk then became an occupied city-state with an active rebellious underground engaged in terrorist and guerrilla warfare against the occupying army from Allanak. Other Tuluki became Allanak sympathizers, betraying their city-state. Opened up a completely cool and interesting political side of gameplay that made classes and coded powers/skills much less important than one's ability to inspire, organize, and lead.
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Old 06-03-2009, 05:27 PM   #48
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To a certain extent, playing an MMO is all about improving your character. The games are addicting because you're always working towards that next reward that's just "oh so close". If you want a storyline, you need to be playing a single player RPG where you [and your party] are the centerpiece and the savior(s) of that RPG universe. 10,000,000 people can't all be "The Hero". Another huge part of an MMO is the "epeen" factor, which is just a way for people to feed their ego to an extent that would be completely impossible in their real lives.

Bioware has never failed with a game, but I really worry they might not do very well with The Old Republic. I really hope I'm wrong.
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Old 06-03-2009, 07:03 PM   #49
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It was interesting seeing them talk about it with the gamespy guy earlier. They're apparently scripting 100s of hours worth of story progression, not just for each of the 8 individual classes, but for separate branches of each of the 8 classes. And they plan to somehow tie character progression in with that story progression. They made it sound like you would get more powerful by progressing within your own story, rather than only through endless hours of filling your quest log and grinding away (which, let's face it, that's what major MMOs are about right now - max your level that way and then raid...).

I'll have to see it implemented to really be able to give an opinion on it, but it's certainly ballsy.
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Old 06-03-2009, 07:11 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by keg in kc View Post
It was interesting seeing them talk about it with the gamespy guy earlier. They're apparently scripting 100s of hours worth of story progression, not just for each of the 8 individual classes, but for separate branches of each of the 8 classes. And they plan to somehow tie character progression in with that story progression. They made it sound like you would get more powerful by progressing within your own story, rather than only through endless hours of filling your quest log and grinding away (which, let's face it, that's what major MMOs are about right now - max your level that way and then raid...).

I'll have to see it implemented to really be able to give an opinion on it, but it's certainly ballsy.
****in Bioware, lol. EPIC.
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Old 06-03-2009, 07:20 PM   #51
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Originally Posted by Metrolike View Post
To a certain extent, playing an MMO is all about improving your character. The games are addicting because you're always working towards that next reward that's just "oh so close". If you want a storyline, you need to be playing a single player RPG where you [and your party] are the centerpiece and the savior(s) of that RPG universe. 10,000,000 people can't all be "The Hero". Another huge part of an MMO is the "epeen" factor, which is just a way for people to feed their ego to an extent that would be completely impossible in their real lives.

Bioware has never failed with a game, but I really worry they might not do very well with The Old Republic. I really hope I'm wrong.
You're right when you're talking about 10,000,000 people. The MUD I played on had a population of about 500 active players, usually maxing out at 100 or so online at the same time. Even at that, it was extremely intensive on the staff side of things to keep realistic, interesting storylines going ingame, but it worked. But for 100 players online, we had a staff of like 20, so you're looking at 20% of your people online being responsible for playing NPCs, keeping the storyline going, and managing making the game environment respond realistically to player actions. Basically a lot of the stuff that MMORPGs handle with code, we'd handle manually... but that manual handling allowed for it to be more unique, unpredictable and interesting. Not sure that an MMORPG on the scale of WOW will ever be able to pull off a truly great story-based roleplaying game.
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Old 06-03-2009, 07:21 PM   #52
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Originally Posted by NewPhin View Post
You're right when you're talking about 10,000,000 people. The MUD I played on had a population of about 500 active players, usually maxing out at 100 or so online at the same time. Even at that, it was extremely intensive on the staff side of things to keep realistic, interesting storylines going ingame, but it worked. But for 100 players online, we had a staff of like 20, so you're looking at 20% of your people online being responsible for playing NPCs, keeping the storyline going, and managing making the game environment respond realistically to player actions. Basically a lot of the stuff that MMORPGs handle with code, we'd handle manually... but that manual handling allowed for it to be more unique, unpredictable and interesting. Not sure that an MMORPG on the scale of WOW will ever be able to pull off a truly great story-based roleplaying game.
That must have been fun as hell.
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Old 06-03-2009, 07:36 PM   #53
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That must have been fun as hell.
Very much so. It's still going: www.armageddon.org

I just don't have the time to sink into it. Oh... the most badass thing about it that contributes to not getting too into your skills/stats: permadeath. When your PC dies, it dies. You then create a new one (which is actually really cool, because there are so many difference gameplay experiences through different races, clans, city-states, tribes, etc). While this sucks in some ways, it also makes it so that having a long-lived PC is more important than having a code-wise strong PC. In other words... who is more powerful? The bigass, strong barbarian warrior or the effete noble that can hire 20 bigass strong barbarian warriors?
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Old 06-04-2009, 09:56 AM   #54
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Holy...mother...of ****. Those were the best graphics I have ever seen in a game.
That trailer made my balls tingle joyously.
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Old 06-04-2009, 11:14 AM   #55
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After WoW took over my life I vowed to never play another MMO again. Then I see this and Final Fantasy XIV...
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Old 06-04-2009, 11:18 AM   #56
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After WoW took over my life I vowed to never play another MMO again. Then I see this and Final Fantasy XIV...
I made that vow after EverQuest. And then after Star Wars: Galaxies. And then after WoW.

I'm not making that vow again.
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Old 06-04-2009, 11:44 AM   #57
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I play City of Heroes/Villians, and likely will until The Old Republic comes out. It is a great casual game.
The thing that keeps City of Heroes alive is that the game keeps making changes with each new issue. The Architecht Missions right now is the only thing keeping me playing at the moment. I love making my own missions. Going Rouge that's coming out soon that allows Heroes and Villians to switch sides also sounds pretty awesome.
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Old 06-04-2009, 02:51 PM   #58
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The Deceived trailer is badass.
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Old 06-04-2009, 02:58 PM   #59
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The Deceived trailer is badass.
That shit was Imax-worthy.
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Old 06-04-2009, 03:06 PM   #60
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The Trailer was cool but it won't be like the game. Trailer's rarely show the exact game mechanics and views. As for an MMO, I'm all for it, if it's done right. There's too many variables yet to sway my immediate purchase of this title upon release.
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