Tesla unveil Semi, new Roadster, & also teased a "pickup truck"

[aturnis]

Anyone watch the unveil last night?



The numbers on the semi destroyed what anyone thought possible.

- 0-60 in 5 sec
- 0-60 in 20 sec under max gross payload of 80k lbs
- 65mph up 5% grade under max lied, compared to 45mph for ICE semi
- 500 mile range
- 400 miles of additional range after 30 min charge
- Guaranteed 7¢/kWh fuel cost(solar) compared to volatile oil
- Nuclear explosion proof glass(apparently cracked windshield takes semi off road)
- 1 million mile guarantee it won't breakdown
- Will never need a brake change
- "Impossible" to jacknife
- Beats semis on economics day 1
- In convoy mode, beats rail on economics

300 miles of range: $150,000
500 miles of range: $180,000
Founders series: $200,000




https://youtu.be/CBTQnmUolas
The Roadster was a complete surprise, and the numbers given destroy any production car you can think of, even a Koenisegg.

- 0-60 in 1.9 sec (this is faster than most Formula 1 cars)
- 0-100 in 4.2
- 1/4 mile in 8.9 sec
- 250+ mph top speed
- 621 mile range (That's Kansas City to Denver without fueling)
- 10,000 nm torque

and that's the base model. Starting at $200k and Founders series at $250k. Destroys million dollar cars.



Also teased a rendering image of a consumer pickup truck with a normal truck in the bed.

https://youtu.be/5n9xafjynJA

[Valiant]

Originally Posted by aturnis

Lol. Ok.

What about Tesla or any of Musks ventures gives you any reason to believe this will never exist? It's built, going through testing, it exists. It's a done deal. SUPER easy vehicle to build that could even be built by hand with decent margins. Same goes for the Roadster.

BTW, how do you know what the weight distribution is?



I mean, that makes sense if you don't understand the costs of opex in logistics and their impact on final product costs. Transport is a profit 5% margin industry. She's looking for an upgrade. Surely not the guy in the semi seat, but certainly the man in the real driver's seat.

Your author doesn't seem to understand that charging will likely initially be installed at the main distribution hub where the trucks are parked at night, and at their destinations to allow charging whole unloading.

Not only that, but they'll likely continue building their own, and partnering with gas stations and truck stops to install them at existing fueling points.

As for proving themselves, LOLWUT? Electric motors are a far and away proven tech. As for the batteries, I think those too can be considered proven. A possible moot point though as the batteries might be leased to give operators peace of mind.

I spoke with a diesel mechanic friend of mine, he says he expects adoption pretty quickly as diesel is currently about as efficient as we can make it.

My dad, who used to own his own long haul trucking company, agrees. He's a hater, but seems to be bitterly impressed.



Desperate? They do a Founders Series for every vehicle. Semis are the hardest use case of daily transport to figure out how to electrify. You figure this out, it becomes blatantly obvious that everything else is possible. No more excuses for existing industry. Hence the reason EVERYBODY has admitted defeat and is going all electric.



I mean, I will ignore Cummins and all of their friends. So far, all they've accomplished is a Class 7 with 100 miles of range, and Daimler managed a Class 8 with 220. Not terribly compelling.

What happens when Tesla unveils the prototype for the concept rendering of their medium duty truck and eats everyone's lunch there too? All that will be left is taking down consumer trucks, which again, shouldn't be too hard.

You need to realize this is about understanding how to generate and store electricity EFFICIENTLY, and apply that tech to an inherently efficient vehicle design. Something existing industry has shown no real understanding of. The US is ESPECIALLY far behind in this regard.



Hold on here. Without Tesla releasing any pre-order info, where did you get these silly numbers that obviously are not grounded in reality?

We know that day one, 3 buyers reported ordering 55 semis between them. Many more also pre ordered semis that night, beings the big movers in the industry were all there to see it first hand.

Meanwhile, Tesla has reported their expected costs. With the cost being so shockingly low, I can only expect orders will go up.

With the payback for the added capex in the US under 2 years for a heavily used rig and less than a year in Canada and Europe, this is a no brainer.

Over the million miles Tesla is guaranteeing the drivetrain for, the savings from operating this truck will pay for 3 more brand new semis.



Tesla stock isn't about a car company. The stock is about the batteries and the itunes model of selling the hardware AND the music. Or the phone AND the software. Driving your own demand. In other words, selling the car, and the fuel. The big 3, and their eastern counterparts don't seem to get that either.

Hell, they resisted so hard knowing it was superior tech. For what? They didn't want to upset the apple cart for their friends in oil and the parts industries? With electrification, both of those industries are next to dead.

You should really get on board. 30% of US carbon emissions are from transport. A number easily brought down through electrification.

Cool fact, in order to drive a Model S 300 miles, it takes about the same amount of electricity as powering your house for 3-4 days. Get one or two of these in every driveway and we WILL need new baseload power. Which, beings NEW baseload capacity is MUCH cheaper to deploy with renewables than fossil fuels(cheaper than nuclear too), Tesla again stands to gain as they make solar panels AND the cheapest best performing batteries available.

DOE expected electric cars to be cheaper that their comparable ICE counterparts within 6 years, published last year(?). Tesla seems to be really early to that party.

The magic number for battery cost is $100/kWh. Based on the semi and Roadster, if Tesla isn't there already, they are CRAZY close. WAY ahead of expectations. Meanwhile, the rest of industry is still aiming for early to mid 2020's.

How on earth can you trust Wall Street mouth pieces who claimed to see no synergies between batteries, electric cars, and solar while Tesla was in the process of acquiring SolarCity? They're all a bunch of rubes. Tesla seems to progress to new victories seemingly ever other day, yet 9/10 articles about them are decidedly negative. It's pretty obvious there's a strong smear campaign being run.

"Their balance sheet, blah blah blah". This is the silicon valley business model. The Street HATES it, but only b/c it breaks their system. Add in a CEO with a value of 20 billion and a "not afraid to lose it all" mentality, I don't think we'll see Tesla sunk. Unless of course the illuminati are real, lol.

How can so many be against an American company with the most American made auto products in the world? I'll never understand it. Do you really want China to own the future?

What scares my company most is the power. Those trucks could have the product all over the road if the trucker romps on it. Bonus is as tech goes forward driverless saves on cost.

Also bonus of these are pollution regulations that keep changing especially in California.

[DaFace]

Much like the current cars, one of the fascinating parts of this will be all of the things they start adding that haven't been around before - even after purchase. I have to imagine assisted driving and backing will be coming, for example.

If too much acceleration becomes an issue, I bet a software option with company control would take care of it.

[cooper barrett]

It does not have to be new to take "section 179" as long as its a HD truck and is used 50% for business. Bonus is only for new but you would have to be buying a small SUV to capture it. On a small truck/ suv the 179 is capped at 25K and bonus on a new vs used would be $10K Trucks over 6Klbs are 100% write off new or used.

Originally Posted by Buehler445

He’s probably referring to bonus depreciation that you don’t get with used. That would benefit him if he doesn’t keep it for the 5 year life.

I’m on the other end. My position is industry standard is the business provides agronomists and managers a vehicle that they also drive to and from work. So I’m taking 100% of the bastard and the corporation pays repairs. I’m not dicking around with mileage logs, percentages, allocations, goddamned cluster**** rocket science equations to calculate a couple thousand dollars gain when you trade the ****er off.

Not this ****ing guy. Corporation owns the pickup per industry standard. No sense making something simple complicated to the sake of the IRS.

[Buehler445]

Originally Posted by cooper barrett

It does not have to be new to take "section 179" as long as its a HD truck and is used 50% for business. Bonus is only for new but you would have to be buying a small SUV to capture it. On a small truck/ suv the 179 is capped at 25K and bonus on a new vs used would be $10K Trucks over 6Klbs are 100% write off new or used.

Bonus depreciation is different than 179.

I’m not going to speak to notorious’ tax planning but you asked the difference between new and used and bonus depreciation is the difference.

[cooper barrett]

Originally Posted by Buehler445

Bonus depreciation is different than 179.

I’m not going to speak to notorious’ tax planning but you asked the difference between new and used and bonus depreciation is the difference.

TY

I need to look at section 179 and bonus together for equipment vehicles,

[notorious]

Here you go: https://www.google.com/amp/www.marke...3-88734B7705AA

[notorious]

My pickup cost around 59k after sales tax. That saves me around 15k+in federal taxes in 2 years. It goes beyond just federal income tax too. Drops income lower so that health insurance is (was, now) cheaper, etc.

I get a brand new 59k truck for essentially 44k, trade in for $35-37k at a $6-8k total loss. That's pretty awesome for a truck with 65-70k miles when I'm done.

I could have bought a Chevy Diesel 2500 with 170k miles for $20k, no warranty, pay for repairs, and been stuck with an unsellable truck after 2 years. I would have lost way more than 6-7k over 2 years with it. Also, I got to drive a new, badass vehicle for the 2 years instead of a 10 year old vehicle.

That's why you see guys driving new pickups every year.

[cooper barrett]

yeah if it is a heavy work truck you get a 59K deduction dropping your earnings that much, It you are in a moderate tax bracket 28% + 15.3 you just saved $25K in fed and fica,(ss) payments.

If I buy a used truck w/ 6' bed that is 2 years old for $30K I get to write that much off also saving 29K and at 28% plus FICA or 13K totalizing 42K plus I get lower insurance, property taxes, and still get mileage or expense deduction.

I like it, I didn't really run the numbers as to new vs used, but I think I see a 4 door truck with a 6 ft bed in my future. I always wanted a an El Camino SS

[Buehler445]

Originally Posted by cooper barrett

yeah if it is a heavy work truck you get a 59K deduction dropping your earnings that much, It you are in a moderate tax bracket 28% + 15.3 you just saved $25K in fed and fica,(ss) payments.

If I buy a used truck w/ 6' bed that is 2 years old for $30K I get to write that much off also saving 29K and at 28% plus FICA or 13K totalizing 42K plus I get lower insurance, property taxes, and still get mileage or expense deduction.

I like it, I didn't really run the numbers as to new vs used, but I think I see a 4 door truck with a 6 ft bed in my future. I always wanted a an El Camino SS

Eh. Do what works for you.

All the tax numbers are one thing but you still gotta write the check. Tax accountants give no ****s about cash flow. Many a mother****ers get strung on cash flow deficiencies.

[cooper barrett]

Originally Posted by Buehler445

Eh. Do what works for you.

All the tax numbers are one thing but you still gotta write the check. Tax accountants give no ****s about cash flow. Many a mother****ers get strung on cash flow deficiencies.

I just never thought or knew about section 179 and vehicle restriction rules and what could be written off with 100% first year depreciation vs 5 years for a car or SUV. Too bad an El Camino only weighs 3200lbs when to be considered a truck it has to be 6000lb+.

Thanks for sending me that direction,

[notorious]

Originally Posted by Buehler445

Eh. Do what works for you.

All the tax numbers are one thing but you still gotta write the check. Tax accountants give no ****s about cash flow. Many a mother****ers get strung on cash flow deficiencies.

You saved so much on your taxes last year by buying new gear, NOW PAY FOR THE ONE YEAR OLD GREEN PAINT!!!!

[aturnis]

Originally Posted by vailpass

Elon Musk fan boi sighting.

Naw. I'm just smart enough to ignore Wall Street. Those nerds missed on Amazon b/c they couldn't get out of their own way and realize the strength technology brings to the table.

Have you looked at the gains made in batteries and solar over the last 5, hell, even 2.5 years?

Now realize that Tesla has the auto industry flailing to catch up after they all downsized to the point of having essentially zero electrical engineering in house, opting instead to focus on making engines with a fast approaching ceiling "better". Enter dieselgate.

Facts are, the auto industry all buy from the same parts manufacturers and basically just assemble parts off the shelf. They own the engine, but that's about it.

The investment to catch up is much larger than they assumed. Don't believe me, just ask Porsche CFO Lutz Meschke. https://www.teslarati.com/porsche-mi...le-investment/

To add to their ire, none of them know anything about software. Ford a bit with Sync and MAYBE GM has a partner with investment in Lyft, but both are essentially on the bench. That's why all auto systems UI suck so badly. It's developed by the parts supplier to "work". It's a bigger distraction on the road than Teslas giant screens. By a long shot.

Musk has a giant advantage there in that he owns 2 of the most attractive companies in the world to software programmers and software engineers as well as engineers at large.
https://www.recode.net/2017/10/26/16...s-tech-workers

https://www.forbes.com/sites/kathryn...dents-in-2016/

These guys missed on Apple, Google, Amazon, Nvidia, Broadcom, IBM, Netflix, Adobe etc. Anything they haven't seen before, they believe is a fad, a bubble or they explain it away some other way. They're old, out of touch and don't care about the future they won't be around for. Short term investors scoffing at long term potential. It's criminal what they do to investors.

So when it's cheaper to buy an EV than an ICE car, and cheaper to add solar to your house than to pay the electric bill every month, are you still going to throw good money after bad? Mind you the two together represent a $6,000+ annual savings plus energy independence for the average 2 adult household. Not to mention the equity the solar system adds to your property.

Both of these things will happen, without subsidy by 2027 at the latest. Prices are falling FAST.

Now that nearly half the world's populations representative governments have set dates for ICE car sales death, and forced the auto industry at large into the battery electric arena against their will, investment in battery research is skyrocketing.

There's absolutely a Moore's law for everything. Now, with bigger investment in research, the investment/progress timeline for batteries is accelerating.

[aturnis]

Originally Posted by stevieray

Porsche

Is getting spanked by Tesla. Panamera sales hurt badly by $la. Hence the reason they're going all electric.

https://www.theverge.com/2017/9/11/1...ar-lineup-2030

[Buehler445]

Originally Posted by notorious

You saved so much on your taxes last year by buying new gear, NOW PAY FOR THE ONE YEAR OLD GREEN PAINT!!!!

There aren’t 179 limits on farm equipment. It’s just vehicles. Because fraud. Nobody is buying their wife an articulated 4 wheel drive to pick their kids up from school.

Besides that. Most BRAND NEW Deere shit would max out the 179 limits anyway. ****ing Deere.

It’s going to be one hell of a long time before I can buy any factory Deere paint. Someone else has to knock the new off (and the good in most cases) before I’m going to have it.

[Perineum Ripper]

Originally Posted by Buehler445

There aren’t 179 limits on farm equipment. It’s just vehicles. Because fraud. Nobody is buying their wife an articulated 4 wheel drive to pick their kids up from school.

Besides that. Most BRAND NEW Deere shit would max out the 179 limits anyway. ****ing Deere.

It’s going to be one hell of a long time before I can buy any factory Deere paint. Someone else has to knock the new off (and the good in most cases) before I’m going to have it.

Here these are better than those nasty green things anyway