3-4 vs 4-3 Critical Decision?

kccrow · 12-13-2014, 04:38 PM

Andy Reid has traditionally fielded teams that have ran a 4-3 base defense, until he came to KC where he inherited a 3-4 and brought in a 3-4 coordinator in Sutton.

With big decisions looming regarding both Justin Houston and Tamba Hali and their contracts as well as not really being set at ILB, what is your feelings on sticking with 3-4 versus the Chiefs switching to and drafting for the 4-3?

I'm not advocating for the 4-3 by the way, just curious to know thoughts. The league is now a front rush league in terms of trying to control the pass, and if you run a 3-4 you're continually rushing at least 1 or both OLBs anyhow. However, I have always preferred advantages you can gain with a 3-4.

**Dave Lane** · 12-13-2014, 05:25 PM

I think you are right. Todays 3-4 really is a 4-3 with just a tiny bit more flexibility.

Sandy Vagina · 12-13-2014, 06:07 PM

I think the 4-3 Under scheme could be a lot of fun.. This would utilize Houston as a SLB and create sick pass rush.. but they would be very suspect in some areas.

driver2 · 12-13-2014, 08:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sandy Cheeks

I think the 4-3 Under scheme could be a lot of fun.. This would utilize Houston as a SLB and create sick pass rush.. but they would be very suspect in some areas.

Good Post!
This is the base set run by the Broncos. It's been pretty effective for the last couple of years. Though we don't see the offensive 212 set in the diagram very often. Few teams have a good full back. More often than not teams will
use TE motion for their blocker to get the overload at the POA.
Or like NE use the 122 set and eat our safeties for lunch w/Gronk and Edelman on in slants. It's a pretty good D otherwise.

ADD; Like all D's your personnel have to fit the scheme. Hali as a DT? Ford as a DE ? If DJ comes back 100% and you can re-sign JH you would have some of the pieces for a good 4-3 D.

kccrow · 12-13-2014, 09:56 PM

Thanks for some input...

Here's what I see under contract heading into the offseason if the Chiefs make the switch...

LDE Allen Bailey, 6'3" 288
UT Jaye Howard, 6'3" 300, Vance Walker 6'2" 305
NT Dontari Poe, 6'3" 346, Mike DeVito 6'3" 305
RDE Tamba Hali, 6'3" 275, Mike Catapano 6'3" 270

SOLB Dee Ford, 6'2" 252, Frank Zombo, 6'3" 254
ILB Joe Mays, 5'11" 244
WOLB Derrick Johnson, 6'3" 242, James-Michael Johnson, 6'1" 240

CB Phillip Gaines, 6'0" 193, Marcus Cooper, 6'1" 192
CB Sean Smith, 6'3" 218, Jamell Fleming, 5'11" 206

FS ?, Sanders Commings, 6'0" 223
SS Husain Abdullah, 6'0" 204, Daniel Sorensen, 6'2" 208

What this eliminates is alot of stress to absolutely re-sign Houston, although having him at SOLB would be great. I see most of the pieces on the roster. Now, you have obvious concerns at Free Safety and some unknowns with DJ, DeVito, Catapano, Commings, and Ford. Otherwise its a situation where you see needs for depth and improvements but no major needs to make the switch.

jonzie04 · 12-13-2014, 10:16 PM

Dee ford doesn't fit in a 4-3. I suppose he can come in and rush the passer from any spot. But hed be a liability as a 4-3 end and an even bigger liability as a traditional LB.

kccrow · 12-13-2014, 10:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jonzie04

Dee ford doesn't fit in a 4-3. I suppose he can come in and rush the passer from any spot. But hed be a liability as a 4-3 end and an even bigger liability as a traditional LB.

The one thing I thought about is penciling him at RDE in a 4-3. Guys like Dwight Freeney (6'1" 269) and Robert Mathis (6'2" 246) were insanely undersized, but their speed and first step allowed them to be terrors. Ford could at least be a situational pass rusher at the position if he can't fit (and I'm also struggling to see his fit in any defense at this point) at OLB.

driver2 · 12-14-2014, 01:02 AM

In the 43 under your Mike and FS are critical. I love Joe Mays he really tries but pass coverage is pitiful he's a liability after second down. This ends up causing your safeties be cheated up into the box and leaves your secondary in straight man coverage, more often than not. Also forces your Will to cover a bigger zone or play a looser man coverage to compensate.

12-13-2014, 04:38 PM
kccrow MVP Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Michigan Casino cash: $3327078	3-4 vs 4-3 Critical Decision? Andy Reid has traditionally fielded teams that have ran a 4-3 base defense, until he came to KC where he inherited a 3-4 and brought in a 3-4 coordinator in Sutton. With big decisions looming regarding both Justin Houston and Tamba Hali and their contracts as well as not really being set at ILB, what is your feelings on sticking with 3-4 versus the Chiefs switching to and drafting for the 4-3? I'm not advocating for the 4-3 by the way, just curious to know thoughts. The league is now a front rush league in terms of trying to control the pass, and if you run a 3-4 you're continually rushing at least 1 or both OLBs anyhow. However, I have always preferred advantages you can gain with a 3-4.
Posts: 12,557

12-13-2014, 05:25 PM	#2
Dave Lane Space Cadet and Aczabel Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Kanab, UT, USA Casino cash: $9333275 VARSITY	I think you are right. Todays 3-4 really is a 4-3 with just a tiny bit more flexibility. __________________ Thanks, Trump for the civics lesson. We are learning so much about RICO, espionage, sedition, impeachment, the 25th Amendment, order of succession, nepotism, separation of powers, 1st Amendment, obstruction of justice, the emoluments clause, conflicts of interest, collusion, sanctions, oligarchs, money laundering and so much more.
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12-13-2014, 09:56 PM	#5
kccrow MVP Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Michigan Casino cash: $3327078	Thanks for some input... Here's what I see under contract heading into the offseason if the Chiefs make the switch... LDE Allen Bailey, 6'3" 288 UT Jaye Howard, 6'3" 300, Vance Walker 6'2" 305 NT Dontari Poe, 6'3" 346, Mike DeVito 6'3" 305 RDE Tamba Hali, 6'3" 275, Mike Catapano 6'3" 270 SOLB Dee Ford, 6'2" 252, Frank Zombo, 6'3" 254 ILB Joe Mays, 5'11" 244 WOLB Derrick Johnson, 6'3" 242, James-Michael Johnson, 6'1" 240 CB Phillip Gaines, 6'0" 193, Marcus Cooper, 6'1" 192 CB Sean Smith, 6'3" 218, Jamell Fleming, 5'11" 206 FS ?, Sanders Commings, 6'0" 223 SS Husain Abdullah, 6'0" 204, Daniel Sorensen, 6'2" 208 What this eliminates is alot of stress to absolutely re-sign Houston, although having him at SOLB would be great. I see most of the pieces on the roster. Now, you have obvious concerns at Free Safety and some unknowns with DJ, DeVito, Catapano, Commings, and Ford. Otherwise its a situation where you see needs for depth and improvements but no major needs to make the switch.
Posts: 12,557

12-13-2014, 10:16 PM	#6
jonzie04 MVP Join Date: Feb 2014 Casino cash: $5856817	Dee ford doesn't fit in a 4-3. I suppose he can come in and rush the passer from any spot. But hed be a liability as a 4-3 end and an even bigger liability as a traditional LB.
Posts: 6,779

12-14-2014, 01:02 AM	#8
driver2 Starter Join Date: Jan 2009 Casino cash: $10005870	In the 43 under your Mike and FS are critical. I love Joe Mays he really tries but pass coverage is pitiful he's a liability after second down. This ends up causing your safeties be cheated up into the box and leaves your secondary in straight man coverage, more often than not. Also forces your Will to cover a bigger zone or play a looser man coverage to compensate.
Posts: 150