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Old 02-12-2018, 07:10 AM  
HonestChieffan HonestChieffan is online now
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Dopers will not like this opinion.

Last week marked the fifth anniversary of Colorado's decision to sanction the world's first anything-goes commercial pot trade.

Five years later, we remain an embarrassing cautionary tale.

Visitors to Colorado remark about a new agricultural smell, the wafting odor of pot as they drive near warehouse grow operations along Denver freeways. Residential neighborhoods throughout Colorado Springs reek of marijuana, as producers fill rental homes with plants.

Five years of retail pot coincide with five years of a homelessness growth rate that ranks among the highest rates in the country. Directors of homeless shelters, and people who live on the streets, tell us homeless substance abusers migrate here for easy access to pot.

Five years of Big Marijuana ushered in a doubling in the number of drivers involved in fatal crashes who tested positive for marijuana, based on research by the pro-legalization Denver Post.

Five years of commercial pot have been five years of more marijuana in schools than teachers and administrators ever feared.

"An investigation by Education News Colorado, Solutions and the I-News Network shows drug violations reported by Colorado's K-12 schools have increased 45 percent in the past four years, even as the combined number of all other violations has fallen," explains an expose on escalating pot use in schools by Rocky Mountain PBS in late 2016.

The investigation found an increase in high school drug violations of 71 percent since legalization. School suspensions for drugs increased 45 percent.

The National Survey on Drug Use and Health found Colorado ranks first in the country for marijuana use among teens, scoring well above the national average.

The only good news to celebrate on this anniversary is the dawn of another organization to push back against Big Marijuana's threat to kids, teens and young adults.

The Marijuana Accountability Coalition formed Nov. 6 in Denver and will establish satellites throughout the state. It resulted from discussions among recovery professionals, parents, physicians and others concerned with the long-term effects of a commercial industry profiteering off of substance abuse.

"It's one thing to decriminalize marijuana, it's an entirely different thing to legalize an industry that has commercialized a drug that is devastating our kids and devastating whole communities," said coalition founder Justin Luke Riley. "Coloradans need to know, other states need to know, that Colorado is suffering from massive normalization and commercialization of this drug which has resulted in Colorado being the number one state for youth drug use in the country. Kids are being expelled at higher rates, and more road deaths tied to pot have resulted since legalization."

Commercial pot's five-year anniversary is an odious occasion for those who want safer streets, healthier kids and less suffering associated with substance abuse. Experts say the worst effects of widespread pot use will culminate over decades. If so, we can only imagine the somber nature of Big Marijuana's 25th birthday.

— Colorado Springs Gazette
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Old 02-12-2018, 12:23 PM   #61
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Originally Posted by Marcellus View Post
Its actually possible to tell how much THC is in the system when tested just like with alcohol so the real question is not did they test positive but how much THC was in their system.
Thank you! A ****ing FACT for a change.
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Old 02-12-2018, 12:26 PM   #62
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Originally Posted by patteeu View Post
Sure. Do you think that statistic is based on testing positive at the legally impaired threshold or testing positive at all? I'm betting on the latter, although I'm open to being corrected.
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Originally Posted by Marcellus View Post
Probably just a positive test I am sure.
If they did a blood test, which they probably (DUH) did......We are talking fatalities. They swab you then take you for a blood test.... it's not coming back as + or-.
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Old 02-12-2018, 12:32 PM   #63
MephistophelesJanx MephistophelesJanx is offline
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Originally Posted by cooper barrett View Post
Depends on what the standard is they aren't saying and you don't know shit about testing for DUI THC... Quit reinforcing your point, it's NOT fact so STOP telling us it is.
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Originally Posted by cooper barrett View Post
You have no ****ing idea what was considered as the standard. THC is measurable and a TRUE or FALSE is what you ASSumed they used.

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Originally Posted by cooper barrett View Post
Thank you! A ****ing FACT for a change.
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Originally Posted by cooper barrett View Post
If they did a blood test, which they probably (DUH) did......We are talking fatalities. They swab you then take you for a blood test.... it's not coming back as + or-.
Since you like FACTS

https://www.npr.org/sections/health-...-for-marijuana

"Here's the rub: Despite the increasingly legal use of cannabis in many states, cops still don't have the equivalent of a reliable alcohol breathalyzer or blood test — a chemically based way of estimating what the drug is doing in the brain. Though a blood test exists that can detect some of marijuana's components, there is no widely accepted, standardized amount in the breath or blood that gives police or courts or anyone else a good sense of who is impaired."

Bolded part 1: you apparently don't know shit about THC DUI testing
BP2: There is no widely accepted standardized amount in breath or blood to determine who is impaired
BP3: ****ing facts from NPR... not just what you want
BP4: Even blood tests cannot determine impairment... just whether some marijuana components are there

some more links about THC DUI testing if you find NPR to be too liberal of a source for you:

https://www.denverpost.com/2017/08/2...rment-testing/
https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/3...d-in-dui-cases
http://q13fox.com/2017/07/20/not-bac...ana-dui-limit/

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Old 02-12-2018, 12:34 PM   #64
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Originally Posted by cooper barrett View Post
Depends on what the standard is they aren't saying and you don't know shit about testing for DUI THC... Quit reinforcing your point, it's NOT fact so STOP telling us it is.
Oh, good. Cooper the expert is here. Sit down, friend. You don't know what you're talking about.
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Old 02-12-2018, 12:37 PM   #65
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Originally Posted by cooper barrett View Post
If they did a blood test, which they probably (DUH) did......We are talking fatalities. They swab you then take you for a blood test.... it's not coming back as + or-.
So what? That doesn't change anything.
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Old 02-12-2018, 12:44 PM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HonestChieffan View Post
Last week marked the fifth anniversary of Colorado's decision to sanction the world's first anything-goes commercial pot trade.

Five years later, we remain an embarrassing cautionary tale.
"Embarassing". Welp, we know this author's opinion on the subject right from the start. So we can be assured of how "subjective" the rest of this will go....

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Originally Posted by HonestChieffan View Post

Five years of retail pot coincide with five years of a homelessness growth rate that ranks among the highest rates in the country.
I'd be much more curious to see if homeless rates were rising in CO prior to the legalization. Nice, cherry picked 5 years. Show me a 10 year window if we're going to be honest. That would give us a much more accurate representation and be more effective at proving/disproving the biased author's point.

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Originally Posted by HonestChieffan View Post
Directors of homeless shelters, and people who live on the streets, tell us homeless substance abusers migrate here for easy access to pot.
Considering pot might be the easiest substance to attain aside from alcohol, i have a bit of a hard time believing these anecdotal stories, reported by a biased author, that they moved there JUST for pot.

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Originally Posted by HonestChieffan View Post
Five years of Big Marijuana ushered in a doubling in the number of drivers involved in fatal crashes who tested positive for marijuana, based on research by the pro-legalization Denver Post.
Patt already tackled this with common sense and an understanding of how these studies are done.

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Originally Posted by HonestChieffan View Post
Five years of commercial pot have been five years of more marijuana in schools than teachers and administrators ever feared.
Complete conjecture designed to trigger confirmation bias.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HonestChieffan View Post
"An investigation by Education News Colorado, Solutions and the I-News Network shows drug violations reported by Colorado's K-12 schools have increased 45 percent in the past four years, even as the combined number of all other violations has fallen," explains an expose on escalating pot use in schools by Rocky Mountain PBS in late 2016.
Welp, if i use the same sort of correlation = causation logic that the author and anti-weed advocates use, i could make the argument that more pot results in less crime in nearly every other category thanks to that little nugget. Thanks author! #winning.

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Originally Posted by HonestChieffan View Post
The investigation found an increase in high school drug violations of 71 percent since legalization. School suspensions for drugs increased 45 percent.
45% Increase in suspensions because of DRUG use (as in all drugs) or 45% increase in suspensions for pot alone? Big ****ing difference. Nice misleading stat you got there, buddy.



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Originally Posted by HonestChieffan View Post
The only good news to celebrate on this anniversary is the dawn of another organization to push back against Big Marijuana's threat to kids, teens and young adults.
Sweet, more state spending against the will of its citizens! I know Republicans just LOOOVE that stuff.

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Originally Posted by HonestChieffan View Post
"It's one thing to decriminalize marijuana, it's an entirely different thing to legalize
Uhm....lol. Ok.

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Originally Posted by HonestChieffan View Post
devastating our kids and devastating whole communities," said coalition founder Justin Luke Riley.
Is Mr. Riley up for an Academy Award? Because the dude is draaaamaaaatic.

.......................

Welp, that was fun taking a big ol' San Francisco sized shit all over that PoS article.

Next.
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Old 02-12-2018, 12:48 PM   #67
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So, many more people smoke pot now that it is legal. There are more deadly accidents where the drivers had smoked pot (in the last ~30 days although I am not going to get into that discussion). Seems like it should be expected and I do not see a causal relationship here.
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Old 02-12-2018, 12:52 PM   #68
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Yes LA is rolling out a program now for sobriety checkpoints, but test results are funny because there is no good way for the police to know other than a blood test. Once a blood sample is taken, there are standards. We are talking deaths and if a driver preliminarily shows positive they get a blood sample. It is not for law enforcement, practical to take every driver who test positive using for a drug test, all the cops would do is eat donuts at the lab.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MephistophelesJanx View Post
Since you like FACTS

https://www.npr.org/sections/health-...-for-marijuana

"Here's the rub: Despite the increasingly legal use of cannabis in many states, cops still don't have the equivalent of a reliable alcohol Breathalyzer or blood test — a chemically based way of estimating what the drug is doing in the brain. Though a blood test exists that can detect some of marijuana's components, there is no widely accepted, standardized amount in the breath or blood that gives police or courts or anyone else a good sense of who is impaired."
The reason is because THC spikes quickly that why immediately after use it is clearly influencing, but it wears off quickly to where it is not scientific to say when a person used THC. The 5 that were tested and above limits were DUI. The ones that fell below the standard could have been at the time but THC levels either show your buzzed or you were buzzed in the recent past. That is the problem getting the test taken before THC levels fall off.
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Old 02-12-2018, 12:54 PM   #69
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Anyway, i like BigBeauford's idea of comparing Pot to Gun Control.

Marijuana buds can't get behind the wheel and drive, guys....right?

The little Marijuana bud isn't the one getting suspended from school, right?

Marijuna doesn't kill people. People kill people.

Don't blame the pot if some brat steals his ol' man's stash. Blame the irresponsible Pot owner.
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Old 02-12-2018, 01:15 PM   #70
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Yes LA is rolling out a program now for sobriety checkpoints, but test results are funny because there is no good way for the police to know other than a blood test. Once a blood sample is taken, there are standards. We are talking deaths and if a driver preliminarily shows positive they get a blood sample. It is not for law enforcement, practical to take every driver who test positive using for a drug test, all the cops would do is eat donuts at the lab.
It is not all the time but we often have "no refusal DUI enforcement" weekends here in Austin. If you are suspected of bring intoxicated they can force you to have a blood draw taken. If you refuse, it is a matter of having a judge available to sign a warrant to have that blood draw occur.
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Old 02-12-2018, 01:29 PM   #71
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Pretty sure you could write a much more damning article about the horrors of repealing alcohol prohibition in America.
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Old 02-12-2018, 01:51 PM   #72
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I live in Washington State and virtually nothing here changed in day to day life after marijuana was legalized. Occassionally when we go to a public area, we smell pot smoke. Also sometimes we smell cigarette smoke. Sometimes, we smell car exhaust. My family somehow manages without too much drama.
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Old 02-12-2018, 01:54 PM   #73
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I live in Washington State and virtually nothing here changed in day to day life after marijuana was legalized. Occassionally when we go to a public area, we smell pot smoke. Also sometimes we smell cigarette smoke. Sometimes, we smell car exhaust. My family somehow manages without too much drama.
How are your children not traumatized by such things?!?!?!
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Old 02-12-2018, 02:27 PM   #74
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Originally Posted by Detoxing View Post
Anyway, i like BigBeauford's idea of comparing Pot to Gun Control.

Marijuana buds can't get behind the wheel and drive, guys....right?

The little Marijuana bud isn't the one getting suspended from school, right?

Marijuna doesn't kill people. People kill people.

Don't blame the pot if some brat steals his ol' man's stash. Blame the irresponsible Pot owner.


Surely you must be the first human who's ever said that.
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Old 02-12-2018, 02:38 PM   #75
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I live in Washington State and virtually nothing here changed in day to day life after marijuana was legalized. Occassionally when we go to a public area, we smell pot smoke. Also sometimes we smell cigarette smoke. Sometimes, we smell car exhaust. My family somehow manages without too much drama.
It is illegal to smoke cigarettes in public parks in Austin. One of the stranger laws enacted in recent years, especially when you think of Austin and outdoor concerts (ACL, SXSW). But you would not have to smell cigarettes while enjoying the great outdoors!
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